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Palin On Supreme Court Cases: ???

Here it is, the much-hyped moment where Sarah Palin was unable to name any Supreme Court case that she disagreed with, other than Roe v. Wade:

Palin employs the same dodge here as she did when Katie Couric asked her what newspapers she reads -- she retreated to vague terms about how there are all those Supreme Court decisions out there that people might disagree with, just as she mentioned all those newspapers out there she relies on.

There is a certain irony here. John McCain has long criticized Barack Obama for speaking in platitudes, and then he went and picked a running mate who apparently can only think in platitudes.


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WI + 9 Obama, Will the MSM stop saying its a swing state and move it to leaning Obama already?

RCP moved it tonite....MN will follow soon and we will be at 269.....!!!!!!!!!!!

Yeah and most of those that are listed as toss ups are favoring Obama, and he just needs 1 of them.

NO MAS


Please stop

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Hard Kweshcuns UNFAIR!

DEMANDING A SARAH PALIN PRESS CONFERENCE: Sure, bring it on — right after Obama takes questions from Bob Owens, Stanley Kurtz, David Freddoso, the Powerline guys, and Hugh Hewitt on the Bill Ayers/Annenberg business.

You see, it's no fair letting vicious in-the-tank sharks like Katie Couric savage poor Bible Spice, unless right wing philosopher-princes like Confederate Yankee can harass Obama.
~

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Bible Spice -

O god - you're killing me -

Bible Spice!!!!! Awesome.

If there is anyone on TPM who cannot answer this question or what they read in 30 seconds then they should not be contributing here. Couric tossed her puffballs and she flat out missed these and others.

My favorite court case was Kramer vs Kramer.

Thank you. Thank you so much for finally giving us a really good nickname for Palin.

You have done a great service to our country.

Katie Couric is doing the work of a patriot this week.

Yeah, as much as she has disappointed me over the past few years, she really is doing the job, isn't she?

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Hear! Hear!

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Katie Couric is getting her ratings out of the tank and Palin is getting debate expectations so low that just showing up will win it for her. These interviews are about as real as reality shows and Americans are swallowing it, hook, line and sinker. A win/win situation for Couric and Palin.

I really resent CBS for playing with the future of this country for ratings and it tells me everything I need to know about the McCain campaign.

Hopefully this is preview of the VP debate.

This confirms what we've already know: she is a historically unserious, unprepared, uninformed threat to our country. Like Jack Cafferty, I've never seen anyone so pathetic nominated for one of the highest offices in the country. While George Bush seems to operate analytically on a middle school level, she is still a toddler. A toddler wandering around with a loaded shotgun.

Pufferfish

Her worst answers come as a result of follow-ups. Unless Biden asks for clarification--which he really can't do unless he wants to risk hanging himself--this is not at all how the debate will play out.

Right wingers don't mind her answer about Roe (they would object strongly to the admission of a right to privacy). Middle of the roadies will recognize that Biden understands the issue and knows how to explain it to the public.

Sir, may I have some more? Please Sir!!!

LOL!

Once again Katie gives her the simplest GED motherfucking question and she can't answer it.

Brown v. Board, Bush v. Gore, Plessy v. Ferguson. Is she really that dumb?

Oh wait I just reread the question. It's court cases that she disagrees with.

Then again who knows? She's a Republican so Brown v Board might just be a suitable answer for the base.

Hell, Hamdi would have been a suitable answer for a republican to make. I obviously wouldn't agree with her, but again, like on the newspaper and magazine question, she is either too slow or too dumb to even think of an answer to spit out.

Oh wait I just reread the question. It's court cases that she disagrees with.

How about Dredd Scott?

Bonus: IIRC from the 2000 election, "Dredd Scott" was also a code used by the Right when they mean "anti-abortion". Why that's the case -- or if it really is even the case -- I don't know.

Well, the gimme on this answer is the recent Guantanimo decision--at least for many Republicans.

The Federalist Society types pretty much disagree with all the jurisprudence from the New Deal onward. They hate the expansion of federal power under the Commerce clause and most of the Warren Court 4th amendment stuff. She of course has no idea. Right of privacy, of course.

You can't just say statres should decide. You have to give a reasonthe Constitution gives the power to the states and not the Federal government. It's not a matter of preference.

Hell she didn't even say she's against "Legislating from the bench" That would have been pretty easy.

As was just pointed out on Olbermann, how about Exxon v. Baker? Came out in June '08, reduced the award for the worst oil spill in history, and was in ALASKA.

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As a local official she should have heard of and had an opinion on Kelo. Of course she might not have disagreed with it, but the party line is that it was a bad decision.

She issued a press release criticizing the decision.

Or her office did in her name.

She even gave an interview to KTLA on Exxon v. Baker, on June 25. It's on Youtube...

Her first sentence says how disappointed she was in the ruling. Are you kidding me with this? She isn't quick enough on her feet to pull that out of her ass? You should post this video as a blog.

Disappointed in the ruling?

She was 9 years old at the time. I wonder how should could remember that after "hearing (Biden's) speeches" when she was seven years old?

Dred Scott!!!! Geeeeeeez.

That Joe Biden guy is impressive.

I posted this on the previous thread, but Jeffrey Toobin does a good job of saying what to expect from a McCain Supreme Court.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6PS0BvkoVvA&feature=related

Thanks for the video. I'm totally depressed after seeing it.

Since McCain picked Palin a lot of people, myself included, have seen him as something of a joke. But this video is an important reminder that a John McCain presidency is no laughing matter.

Being for executing children, is just beyond the beyond.

Thanks for passing on the link. Great reminder of what we're all working so hard for.

I think that since Palin has gotten herself in trouble with previous specific remarks, her handlers have told her to avoid taking specific stances on issues, as much as possible.

They have warned her to not provide any more ammo to those foreign journalists from Gotchastan, which is a very dangerous place, since one can not watch it from Alaska. Yup! Yup!

This is worse than silence. It has always been my understanding that the right wing nuts, the very people Palin is supposed to attract, are absolutely against the notion of a right to privacy. She would have been better off getting up and walking off.

Absolutely. And she doesn't even know what she stepped it it seems. If there is an inherent right to privacy in the constitution, then pro-lifers lose one of their major legal arguments against Roe v Wade.

There is an inherent right to privacy in the US Constitution. The Ninth Amendment reads: "The enumeration in the Constitution, of certain rights, shall not be construed to deny or disparage others retained by the people."

That's is the best part: that this demigoddess of the right wing, she whose intellect and judgment they've been talking up for weeks, has now declared that she recognizes a constitutional right to privacy. Guess that's settled!

wait. she believes in a right to privacy?? is that her final answer??

i'm confused. are there actually pro-lifers who support a right to privacy??

Seriously, can you say "President Sarah Palin" and not feel really scared for America?
I can't.


spot on crouton.

I hadn't thought about those words strung together but it definitely gives me the heeby jeebies. It would be like having a less competent George bush in charge. Hard to get my head around that to be honest.

Word for word:

Couric: "Do you think there's an inherent right to privacy in the Constitution?"

Palin (nodding): "I do. Yeah, I do."

Couric: "That's the cornerstone of Roe versus Wade."

Palin (ignores Couric): "I do, and I believe that, um, individual states can best handle what the people within, the different constituencies within the 50 states would like to see their will ushered in, in an issue like that."

Couric: (pauses, then moves on to another subject)

Uhh... ... What?

I should've mentioned this, but the key of this exchange is Palin's ignoring Couric. Palin obviously does not know on what grounds Roe v. Wade was decided. That's problematic. Extremely so. Though, to be fair, most conservatives I've met don't know the grounds on which Roe v. Wade was decided.

Nor does she truly understand the republican arguement as why they want abortion rights turned over to the states.

Another great point.

It's not just that you may WANT policy decided at the state level, but you have to be able to say the Constitution does not grant the power to the Federal Government. Commerce clause. 10th Amendment. 14th amendment liberty clause.

How can you defend the constitution against enemies foreign and domestic if you do not even know what the hell it says.

But she's just joe sixpack so how is she suppose to know that.

They just know that Roe is very bad, and that there are these bad activist judges out there that need to be replaced.

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I noticed that about her answer too. She, like a majority of people, seem to be under the misconception that Roe v. Wade is about the legality of abortion. So after she prattles on about how she's pro-life and against abortion (I noticed her invocation of "States Rights", obviously something her handlers fed her) she then turns on a dime and directly contradicts herself by stating that she believes in a right to privacy -- which is actually what Roe V Wade was about. Here's hoping she keeps such "clarity" tomorrow night.

It's very problematic. One of the real issues I have with Palin's responses to such questions is that I never understand what she's actually trying to say. What her message is. It's never coherent. So she DOES believe in an inherent constitutional right to privacy... But Roe v. Wade was a mistake? How, pray tell, does that work?

How you get across a river has nothing to do with your right to privacy, dude.

LoL! Nice one, man. Ahahaha!

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I think the answer to your question is: "she doesn't have a message".

As others here have alluded to before, as I'm now finding myself starting to agree with, that she's nothing more than an ambitious, opportunist that'll say whatever she needs to to achieve her aims. The term "rudderless" comes immediately to mind.

No wonder McCain called her his "soul mate".

On CNN, one of the pundits mentioned how she claimed she was a Federalist, but that she would be run out of any group of Federalists with an answer like that.

Yeah, I scoffed at that comment.

She isn't a Federalist...she's a Secessionist.

True. But I also know of quite a few who know that its based upon the right to privacy found in Griswald v. Connecticut, which is their ultimate objective.

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Nor does she get that the Constitution by definition covers ALL the states... not just gives rights to people that they can then choose WITHIN their states! Oh, Lord!

Look...folks. You keep getting caught up in facts. They don't trade in facts or reality...they trade in feelings and beliefs. Stephen Colbert hits it on the head when he says, "I won't just report the news, I'll feel the news to you."

Remember the human footprints inside the dinosaur prints statement? Patently absurd...but enough to sway an opinion? I finally came to understand the futility of arguing with them when I found out how they explain away the apparent size of the universe, the speed of light, and the creationism point of view. The dilemma is that we _know_ that the universes is some 15 billion light years across (because we can see and analyze the light from the distant galaxies). We also know that light would have taken 15 billion years to reach us. How to explain this? Well, the speed of light changed, of course! Yeah...during the flood. While Noah was floating around with two of every single species (why, oh why, did he have to bring mosquitoes and fruit flies?) the speed of light changed. Says it right their in the bible.

You cannot argue with people like this. They don't care about the real world. They only care about what they can see and feel from the hole in the ground they've buried their heads in.

I think everyone is being a little unfair... as a New Zealander, off the top of my head I can only name Brown v Board of Education, Bush v Gore, and Dred Scott v Sandford... and it`s not like a VP candidate is going to come out against any of those.

It`s being spun all over the place that she couldn`t name any any other SC decisions, which like I say is unfair.

I think Eric hits the nail on the head though - what`s more concerning is not that she can`t name SC decisions she disagrees with - it`s the way she basically tries to bullshit her way through an answer, rather than just saying `I can`t think of any right now`, or showing any self awareness whatsoever of her lack of knowledge. There`s a clear pattern of this, and that`s why I think she`s a terrible choice.

I wouldn't expect an average non-American to be able to discuss Supreme Court cases. I do, however, expect that a candidate for Vice President of the United States could at least name a few decisions or legal theories she disagrees with -- even if she can't name them. Dredd Scott is the one W always cites. Of course, he was wrong about the reasons for it --- it was an "originalist" opinion, not an "activist" one as he suggested. She could have talked about Plessy (separate but equal), or affirmative action (Bakke) or cases supporting strong separation of church and state or strong environmental regs. I mean, she's not running for the school board here ...

Miranda. Don't the pugs hate Miranda?

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You may not know but she should. She's running for vp. She supposed to have some idea of our government, courts and history.

Besides, how absurd is it that a New Zealander came up with a case when she couldn't - at the very least she coulda fallen back on Dred Scott.

But if you mentioned Dred Scott to her she'd probably assume it was something about a kid suspended for wearing dreadlocks to school.

Brown v Board of Education, Bush v Gore, and Dred Scott v Sandford... and it`s not like a VP candidate is going to come out against any of those.

No candidate for President or Vice-President would argue against Brown v. Board of Education.

A Republican candidate would support Bush v. Gore; a Democratic one would likely be against it. I doubt either would bring it up if they could help it (due to partisanship; now is the time to appeal to undecided independents; arguing over the 2000 election probably won't help.

I very much doubt any candidate -- any Republican or Democratic Candidate, that is -- would support the Supreme Court's decision in Dredd Scott.

right.

'the court's decision in dred scott was wrong' is actually republican code for 'i'm pro-life and i'll help stack the court to overturn roe v wade'

but i guess if you aren't gonna bother hiding your contempt for roe v wade you don't need to know the code words to signal yourself to fellow travelers...

right.

'the court's decision in dred scott was wrong' is actually republican code for 'i'm pro-life and i'll help stack the court to overturn roe v wade'

but i guess if you aren't gonna bother hiding your contempt for roe v wade you don't need to know the code words to signal yourself to fellow travelers...

WTF are you talking about and how do you arrive at your conclusions? Are you Sarah Palin's doppleganger?

No shit, Dredd Scott is code; you'd still be hard-pressed to find a candidate who would publicly state they agreed with the result in Dredd Scott.

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Kelo, Miranda and the other "watershed" criminal procedure cases, to name a few.

Everyone is convinced that she will do a great job at the debate. I'm not for this very reason. She was good in Alaska because she had some knowledge as to what is going on. IN general she doesn't and it shows when she starts talking in circles.

I don't think she will do that well tomorrow.

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I watched some of that Alaska debate. And it was very similar. Pablum... and meandering. She simply cannot deal with anything of substance. It's flat, black and white at times, but mostly fluff. Fluff and nonsense... filled around with BS platitudes. I've never seen anything like it - together with brazen confidence in fluff!

I think the McCain camp was very smart to push that the issue was being stumped over Supreme Court cases. The real issue here is that she doesn't understand what was at issue in Roe v. Wade and why conservatives hate it: it recognizes a right to privacy (well Griswold did). She just doesn't understand.

Read my post above. I said the same exact thing. Great minds think alike, eh?

What amazes me is how many times Journalists will let people like Palin claim that they are pro-life, and that is why they want each state to decide if it wants to keep abortions legal, or not.

None of those journalists ever then ask the simple follow up question; If you believe that abortion is murder, why are you advocating that some states should be free to commit it, if they choose to.

You see folks, that states right crap, is the same old dodge they used to try and keep segregation in place.

I think she's just been packed with so many facts and techniques by her handlers she just can't pull out any answering strategies quickly enough. You can surely her mind working to crank out any BS that sounds like something. Biden had a good answer to that question: "I wish I could get your husband arrested for beating you up, but the Supreme Court said 'No'." earned some points in a couple of categories there.

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Yes, and the contrast between Palin's Wasilla charging victims for the rape kits and Joe Biden writing the Violence Against Women Act is something the Obama campaign should trumpet across the land.

and yet...here...not 3 months ago...she disagreed with the supreme court's exxon valdez decision on alaskan tv:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5H-26MOxH34

palin is either completely out to lunch, or not allowed to talk about her (few) opinions. which is worse...it's like sophie's choice, i really can't decide...

Amazing isn't it. This is case is all she had to mention and it becomes a non-issue or even a "win" because she shows she's not a complete dunce.

seriously...and wasn't the exxon valdez spill in ALASKA! you know, the governor she's the state of, and that this case pertain to? she could see the decision from her house, like russia.

and isn't E-N-E-R-G-Y supposed to be her economic specialty? or was it her foreign policy specialty? i can't remember...um...decide...uhm...remember...uh...blink, blink, blink...

She comes across as competent in that interview, not to mention she talks about oversight of the oil industry, so she could tie this decision to oversight of wall street.

OUCH that hurts. I love me some Katie C.

Oh, and re the debate: these Couric answers feel excruciatingly long, but in fact they are only a few seconds. She has to talk for at least 90 seconds on each question tomorrow, right? God I hope I don't have an anxiety attack, I can't even watch the Couric stuff twice.

Yes, the key to her bad answers seems not to be whether it is an Alaska issue or national issue. Instead, she seems to falter when she lets herself run at the mouth. In this way, she has the same problem as Biden. But whereas Biden goes on about minutiae that no one really cares about and might cause him to say something controversial/boring (like when he talks about debating with his conservative friends about the 14th amendment), she gets in trouble because usually the more she talks, the more it becomes apparent that she is saying nothing.

Republicans these days are claiming that this tendency is recent and is a result of too much handling. But from watching the Alaska debates, this really seems like a verbal tic of hers. Like a lot of people, when she gets nervous, she talks. And she goes to a lot of meaningless ten cent words (jargon) and draws on lots of adverbs and colloquialism. It eerily resembles my first-year college students' writing style. Sound and fury signifying nothing...

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I think the key is that she knows very little about how to meander and spew BS. And she covers her lack of knowledge by a continual sprinkling of chiches or tossed salad ideas.

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very little "but"

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I agree.

Sarah Palin: the gift that keeps on giving!

I believe Halcro said that Palin was master at giving answers without answering anything. That seems to be what she tries to do here. He also said that she once mocked somebody (possibly him) for having all these facts and figures to use in a debate as she feels folks don't want to hear that stuff during a debate.

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Here and even in the Alaska debates. The woman is a purveyor of fluff done with aplomb!

I have to say it again, Sarah looks like she just wandered off SNL's Jeopardy set.

Biden has GOT to pretend she isn't there and rip McCain up one side and down the other. So viciously it makes even me uncomfortable. AT least 1 maybe 2 such shots

Leave Palin to Tina Fey

He better have a damn good poker face as well, because how can somebody not cringe or scoff if she gives one of these run-around answers.

If he didn't, I'm sure Barack taught him a thing or two, being the avid poker player that he is.

What Biden needs to do is think to himself "This debate, and my candidacy, are the only thing stopping this woman from becoming vice president of the united states of america."

Leave Palin to Tina Fey

THAT, I'll agree with. ;)

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Agree! Palin is a distraction. The economy is defeating McCain. Don't distract Americans from reality with pointless fluff.

Exactly. No smirks, or eye rolling. The perfect gentleman.

He doesn't have to do anything but let Sarah speak for herself.

I think everyone is overestimating the problem there would be if Biden rolls his eyes or scoffs at Palin. Right now, Biden is much better liked than Palin. I think it would be inhuman if he didn't do some eyerolling at an absurd answer. And I think most Americans would understand.

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No, he must not do that. He needs to be the gentleman.

I don't think one eyeroll to an absurd answer is going to lose the election. I guess we'll have to disagree.

Where's the rationality in that? Did you see the response to McCain's refusal to look at Obama? It was hugely negative. How would it look for Biden to roll his eyes at Palin, no matter how idiotic her response was? Let the public be her judge, not Biden. He'd come off as elitist and condescending, the two LAST things he wants to be seen as.

Listen, I'm not saying it would be viewed as a positive. I just don't think it would be the end of the world as many people seem to say it would be. Palin has a net negative approval rating, Biden has a net positive. People are expecting Biden to do something like that. One slip up isn't going to cost Obama the election. That's what my point is.

Maybe she just doesn't want to answer the questions.

Although he had a smoother delivery, John Roberts didn't give any more direct answers in his Senate confirmation hearings.


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So I'm damn sure she's just as smart as Justice Roberts.

Yup - she and Justice Roberts have spent long hours discussing SCOTUS precedent and stare decisis.

Yup yup.

This reminds me of Leno's man on the street bit or whatever it was called where he asked random people on the street simple trivia. Most ended up not knowing and looking foolish.
Those people however, were not up for the FUCKING VICE PRESIDENCY OF THE U.S.A!!!!
Seriously, this election is turning me into a full blown alcoholic.
I had a dream where Biden at the debates, looked directly into the camera and asked "Are you kidding me". sigh, great dream.

jay-walking

Up until this point I was really enjoying this, absolutely hilarious, but this, this is honestly way too much to laugh at. It is scary, scary too many levels to list.

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Shades of Commander CooCoo Bananas - McLame told the Des Moines Register that he has always aspired to be dictator.


Sarah Palin reads the Guardian - official!
The vice-presidential candidate reads "all" newspapers, she claims

Oliver Burkeman
Wednesday October 1 2008
guardian.co.uk

In the latest instalment of Katie Couric-induced TV torture, John McCain's running-mate is asked to describe the newspapers and magazines she reads and replies "all of 'em", which therefore, following a logical process of reasoning, includes this one. Commentators have pounced on this interview excerpt because it looks as though Palin is unable to name a single newspaper or magazine, but really, it's clear that she simply doesn't want to offend rival publications by singling the Guardian out for praise. (A sensible precaution during an election campaign, of course.)

According to high-level sources, Palin especially enjoys the cryptic crossword, the Saturday book review and the Country Diary, though she does feel the Sports section's dog-sledding coverage leaves something to be desired.

Copyright Guardian Newspapers Limited 2008

She's a joke that has gone global.

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O I'm so sure she does the cryptics.

Ever done one? Sure she does - I can tell - all the literary references, different kinds of clues that are totally different than anything you encounter in bland American crosswords - cryptics are a trip. I've got a pretty word sense, I think, and I struggle. I love the things but you really have to pay attention - there are about 5 standard different types of clues and you have to decipher what they are trying to get you to before you even can decipher any of the rest of it. In order words, those things ain't easy.

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O and the Guardian: lol politely. That English sense of humor sometimes escapes me.

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For chrissakes Tena, she does the Word Search. And gives up before finishing.

I heard she can do the mazes on Happy Meals in record time too.

i love those things. back in college finishing those things always impressed the roomies.

It's minor, in my opinion, if we're to believe this analysis:

My guess is that the newspapers that she usually reads are the obvious ones — The New York Times, The Washington Post – and she was worried about either 1) implying some endorsement of these papers (or any, really) or 2) shocking some of her more sensitive conservative base with the fact that — gasp! — she gets her news from the liberal media!

http://culture11.com/blogs/theconfabulum/2008/10/01/where-palin-gets-her-news/

Of course, given her recent streak of BS...

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No. Fucking. Way.

;)

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I'm seeing this Des Moines Register interview for the first time on Olbermann - he is royally pissed off and lying like a rug.

What a complete asshole, huh? Sarcastic, snide, condescending....it's all there for everyone to see.

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It's very very ugly.

I hope it gets shown widely. This is the real McLame.

I'm counting on that being his last trip to IA!

I think we have to applaud CBS for trickling these snippets of interviews out over a long period of time. It's providing a week long focus on Palin's ineptitude. If they aired the whole thing at once, the public would've moved on to the next thing.

Of course, this is in their own self-interest to get as many people to watch as possible, but it also works out pretty well for Obama.

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Plus, it's like watching torture or something. You can only take it in little smidgens day by day. You need time to digest what you've seen and heart and come to terms with - this is coming out of the mouth of VP candidate for god's sake!

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seen and "heard"

Yeah true. Maybe CBS is taking pity on the American public. Knowing that too many heads would explode if they showed the whole thing at once.

No kidding. It must be driving the McCain camp bonkers, but they deserve every second of it.

1. How can someone say that a right found in the U.S. Constitution should be interpreted by the states.

2. She's never heard of Miranda rights (Miranda v Arizona). I think she must just freeze up completely in these situations.


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Shhh! Don't tell her that the Constitution is the governing document for the whole country. That might be, you know, actual knowledge about the government she's going to hold the second highest position in.

And actual knowledge makes her less authentic! Free Palin!

Hold up!! This has got to be a set up or a strategy, So in the debate she can wipe the floor with Joe!

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There is no way you could fake what she did! No way. Trust me.

Well.... ok, an actress with a script. But this dame does not possess that high an ability.

Just Wow. It's not just her take on the right to privacy. Her answer for "Supreme Court decisions I disagree with" is "cases where there is not absolute consensus by every American" and "any issue that could best be dealt with on the state level" i.e., "States' Rights." (Because that's her talking point for Roe v. Wade -- that the feds should not be interfering in a state's legislation on the abortion issue.) So does that mean that the feds shouldn't be interfering on a state's decision on the integration issue (Brown v. Board of Education)? Interracial marriage (Loving v. Virginia)?

Wow.

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It seems to me that until "every American" agrees with something, there is no law.

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Hear that? It's the sound of the McCain campaign imploding.

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Sounds like the smell of napalm in the morning.

Interesting to me how the McCain people leaked word of this several days ago, to try and mitigate its impact. Not sure they succeeded.

The format of the debate won't lend itself to the sorts of confused ramblings we've seen in the Couric interviews, I think.

"Negotiations between the McCain and Obama campaigns resulted in a 90-minute format that calls for the two candidates to stand at podiums and field questions in turn from moderator Ifill. Answers may not exceed 90 seconds, and two minutes of open discussion will follow each question. Each candidate will give a 90-second closing statement."

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So?

This woman is dumber than Commander CooCoo Bananas - I mean, people say this outloud on TV.

Joe Biden is perfectly capable of taking her pieces and I hope he does. I don't want him to hold back. Just KO her once and for all and put this thing out of its misery. It's miserably pathetic - the entire McLame Campaign.

For a mental break, this vid gives a interesting take on Dr. FrankenMcCain has given us with his creation and what it has done to his campaign

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VH2nQHPs4aA

You nailed it!

Here's one of John and Sarah in the WH.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CBEvlwtaaTA&feature=related

yay. KO is covering this now.

It's refreshing to see support for Griswold coming back into vogue. I just didn't see it coming from a Republican.
Tip 'o the hat to you, Couric. You're smarter than I gave you credit for.

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She really is.

And boy do I agree. I have always thought that if we could get ahold of that dialogue again - the anti-choice crusaders have dominated it- if we could get it back and turn it away from dead babies to what it really is about: a woman's right to privacy in her own damn body.

Men have no clue what this is like - really. You guys aren't subject to warning signs on bars telling you not to drink if you're pregant -

After these interviews how are we to expect for Gov Plain to hit a home run tomorrow night? Coaching can only do so much.

No, dude. You're wrong. Coaching is EVERYTHING. You don't need any kind of natural talent in a debate, as long as you have the best coach out there.

Nope, not buying it.

Man, you gotta watch them sports movies. The losing team is down worse than they've ever been before. Then, they get some MAGICAL MASTER OF A COACH, like GENE HACKMAN, or DENZEL WASHINGTON, and they WIN! They win not because of talent, but because of their COACH!

See my empirical evidence? I have won this argument.

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Confidence in BS. That's what she's got!

Yup yup!

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That's been my position on it all along.

Keep her on TV please! Her Miss South Carolina 2007 "US Americans" answers are the best thing we have going for us!

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This is of course, quite quite true. ;P

Oh, sweet Jesus, I just watched that clip. I'm not a lawyer and haven't had a political science or a history class in decades....but I could've given a better answer to that question after a long night of doing tequila shots in a bar in Mexico.

Can anyone on the right REALLY claim that this is a gotcha question? Not understanding the Republican party's stance that there's no right to privacy in the constitution? How does she not know that? How can you vote for someone to be 2nd on your party's presidential ticket when they don't have a basic understanding of what your party stands for? I'm just astounded.

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KO is running a clip that edits together all the classic Palinisms - it's amazing.


This has got to be THE most anticipated VP debates in U.S. history.

If you think about it, this election has broken so many records its really a great one to be around for. Between the influence blogs has had by making everyone accountable for everything, to an African American Dem winner, a female that almost won, female VP, oldest first, not sure if 3 Senators have ever been in the pres/vp slots or not, and many many more I couldn't even list 'em all.

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1. Glad you're enjoying it but FYI "May you live in interesting times" was meant as a curse, not a blessing.

2. I want it over - NOW.

3. You left out "Biggest asshole and dumbest ho' ever on a Republican ticket."

4. Fix your avatar. That little red X is gettin' on my nerves.

I'm not sure what is up with my avatar. Some times I see it, others not. Any idea what might be wrong with it?

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Now I see it. Sometimes size really does matter. Try reducing it a few pixels (literally) below the size TCM says.

Cheers.

Couric: Other than Roe v. Wade, are there any other SCOTUS decisions you don't agree with?

Palin: In looking back at this Nation's vast history I obviously disagree with all decisions to which I find disagreeable - like Roe v. Wade.

--- you just can't make this stuff up!

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I know.


Please stop - the stupid burnssssssssss -

;)

I can't tell you just exactly how stupid I find her answer.

The thing that is most mind-boggling about her answer is, how hard would it have been to say something along the lines of:

"Well, nothing comes right to mind, but I do believe that decisions made by the country's highest court should be based on a strict reading of our constitution." End of story. How bad of a politician are you if you can't even obfuscate very well?

I think we are forgetting how this whole thing got set up:

While these bits have played out over days to us, is was a single interview with Palin.

Suppose we assume she was simply having an off day? (I don't for a second believe that, but let's suppose.) It was McCain's "campaign shield" strategy that put them in this position. Without follow up with other interview clips, Palin gets strangled on a single bad interview. And these are the easiest, open-ended softball questions you can imagine: "name us a news source?" Even FNC didn't think of asking something so easy!

No, as bad a Palin is, McCain is running a terrible campaign and deserves the blame here for bad tactics. By the way, picking a running mate based solely on gender/youth/surprise was bad strategy.

You see? Some of us do know the difference.

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She thinks there's an inherit right to privacy in the Constitution.

What does this mean about how McCain would appoint Supreme Court justices? Will she advocate for broad constructivists? Locating an un-enumerated right to privacy in the Constitution was the ultimate in judicial activism.

Saying she thinks there's an inherit right to privacy is a lot broader than just the implication that she doesn't understand Roe. It impacts (or should impact) how she's going to feel about almost every conservative issue under the sun. Does she support the PATRIOT Act, given that it contains so many incursions on the right to privacy? Does she think that interstate commerce laws should be broadly construed as well, which would give the Federal government more power to regulate markets, instead of shifting that burden towards the states?

The problem here isn't that her stance on abortion is incoherent (although given the voter block she was nominated to appeal to, that is a problem), it's that if she's being truthful about her stance on privacy, her entire political existence is incoherent. If she actually thinks it's good to broadly construe the Constitution, then nothing in her platform makes an ounce of rational sense.

She believes in a culture of life.

You know, the thing that's going to be different about this debate compared to her debates in Alaska is that the media is going to chew over her answers ad nauseum for a few days. Each answer she gives has the potential of generating another news story, whereas in Alaska, they have the debate, everyone thinks she did fine, and they never hear anything more about it. If she doesn't really answer a question, even if Ifill doesn't follow up, the media will call her on it later.

Excellent point. It's clear by who Alaskans have elected for Congress that they have different standards than America as a whole. What's impressive to them, might not be so for the rest of America.

That statement is the equivalent of GOP-style national jingo-ism.

And as about convincing.

So you posit that Alaskans have the same criteria for electing officials as every other state in the union, and that Alaska is a "microcosm of the United States" as a whole?

Biden is going to shine in Thursday's debate. This video is a preview of what's to come tomorrow.

Jesus Fucking Christ. I had shivers running down my spine. Chilling. Still shocked!!!

If this doesn't kill their chances, let's all pitch in to a buck or two. buy a boat and sail to the other of the Atlantic.

I'm seriously worried. How can anyone see and not be scared. I knew GOP would play fear card, but boy this trumps any fears from the past.

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I'm in.

Someone must of have left one of the jokers in the deck of fear cards.

And, hell, I throw in 5 bucks for that boat.

If every person who's been thinking about being an expat, put money into that boat, why I bet you could charter an ocean liner.

The Queen Mary, even.

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Wouldn't that be a trip? LOL!

Ifill ran a tough debate between Edwards and Cheney and at points asked each to defend statements they had made that they later seemed to contradict.

I hope Biden worries about his own answers and ignores Palin because Ifill is a tough moderator and he has the voting record and past statements that Ifill will use against him.

C'mon Jonze give it a rest dude.You're worried about Biden, when the real thing all Americans MUST be worried about is this clip.

Biden? Seriously? You don't get it. This is deep shit which cannot be cleaned out by a single debate.

Jonze - the man has been around since Sarah was 7 for gods sake. Did you see his answer - he didn't miss a sliver of an opprotunity to blow his own horn (and RIGHTFULLY SO I might add) and that was after answering the question in full. And that was in the same amount of time that Palin started to go to the nearest law school but got lost then shot herself in the foot, then shot herself in the foot (the other one)and just before her time was up took aim at the Republican Party. Watch him tomorrow night and you will be so filled with joy that Joe is going to be your next VP you will move your calendar to Jan. 20 2009!!

So she's a pro-life federalist...who believes the Constitution grants our citizens the right to privacy...and that the states should have the ability to nullify this Constitutionally granted right to privacy if they choose.

Anyone else's head hurt?

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Truly.... this is the utter trashing of concern for the Constitution!

And Hizzoner is completely responsible. His utter contempt for the citizens and for the Republic is practically treason.

Federalist? States decide?! Basic High School civics, man. How's Faux News gonna spin that without dropping the bar even lower for her.

I think there is one thing that keeps getting lost in the whole 'expectation setting' game. After the woman has been ridiculed twice on SNL even if she has a 'good' debate the meme of her as a joke is already out there in the national psyche. So how much ground can she make up after being in the bubble for a month and every time she has given an interview she has been a disaster?

More importantly though, those who talk up her debates in Alaska seem to be missing two crucial points, to my mind: First--even when she sounds, composed, confident even winning in those debates she is tap dancing and not giving answers. If you read the transcripts from those debates you can see she has the same problem formulating good string grammatical coherent sentences. It is just a cloud of words, but because she is immersed in Alaska issues and knows the code words she needs to use to sound on the ball she comes off stronger and more coherent than she does now.

Second, it is one thing to sound (semi or more) coherent talking about issues you are familiar with and that have to do with your every day life in the small media environment of Alaska. Just because she was able to do that it does not mean she will be able to do the same in the big-media national stage. No matter how much she crams for this there will be things she won't know a thing about and she will be trying to tap dance around it but if that worked well in Alaska I don't see how that works well in the national stage. That requires a different kind of finesse and talent that she does not have yet. And it won't lay precisely because people are already pre-disposed to think of her as being a complete idiot. To put it in sports a great minor league baseball player cannot play on the World Series of the Major League and expect that he will be playing at the same level and be immediately successful. This requires a completely different talent base. She has neither the knowledge for this nor the talent to make it on a couple of week's notice.
She might survive tomorrow but it will only if she spend the whole night attacking Obama and Biden, mocking and being condescending, but that too will be bad since she has no credibility now to be the one who mocks.

Biden should just leave her alone, ignore her and focus on McCain. She will self destruct.

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Thank you! We're on the same page. What you've called a "cloud of words," I deemed "fluff." She is hopeless. There is nothing there but fluffy clouds of words. Fluff and nonsense.

You've really said it all.

thanks TheraP. The thing for me is that her strategy and her tactic has always been the same--to charm and not answer. But she could do that in Alaska because it is Alaska and because she had her finger on the pulse of how answers had to be framed to sound at least somewhat credible.
She might sound better tomorrow than she did in the interview but watch out because this is what she will do and she will remain out of her league. I also think she will go for the mocking stuff big time.

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So a combination of charm and sarcasm? Whew! But I can see that. She'll try to mock the opponents and charm the audience.

Thank you for that.

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agreed totally and I'll say it again - she doesn't speak proper English, so it's a fuzzy cloud of words alright, but not only that, she murders the King's English just being fuzzy.

Agree totally with your post. Her apparent lack of interest in "national" issues means that she had no base on which to build when she started "cramming". She had to start from ground zero...there's no way she could become fluent in a lot of these issues over the course of only 4 weeks. She might be able to show a basic knowledge or familiarity, but not a true understanding. Being side-by-side with Biden will make this even more apparent.

I also agree that "Sarah Barracuda" will be as mean, snide, and mocking as possible. I've said it repeatedly today - her only hope is to get Biden to attack her or patronize her or something so she can play the victim.

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Also agree, Biden should focus on McCain and let Missy self-destruct.

But, there are two points that Biden should try to drive home:

1) Palin's ideas about choice, about who should pay for rape kits, about how teen pregnancy is prevented all position her as anything but a feminist. Biden has done far more for women in this country than Palin ever will. If he can make the argument without seeming to confront her, and maybe if he can direct the brunt of it at McCain, he'll win that round.

2) McCain's temperament. It takes a steady hand and a cool head to steer the ship of state in these difficult times. We're trying to improve our standing in the world, not obliterate it. There just isn't an opening for Obama to address McCain's impulsiveness and bellicosity during the debates. Let Biden go after it.

For the love of God, will some one ask those pro-life loons this question:

If abortion is murder, when ruled legal on the federal level, then why would it not be murder when ruled legal by an individual state"

Does anyone else think the McCain campaign feels like it's tied down to train tracks with the train bearing down on them right about now?

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I totally agree. They would deny it. But yes.

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Someone explain this to me - I keep hearing how Palin has this Reaganesque quality to make audiences love her - all I can say is "huh?"


Governor, attractive by politician standards, full of shit.

Who knows, Republicans think everyone looks like fucking Reagan.

Where are you hearing that? The only person I've seen compare Palin to Reagan is the all-too-reliable and honest Senator John McCain.

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This nitwit that Rachel had on tonight - he's a pundit with the paper in Alaska.

He was a nitwit - I don't know why I listened to him.

One of the guys who debated her when she was running for governor. He said that she has a "reaganesque-ability" to get audiences to like her...or something like that.

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that was him - he ran against her but works for the paper now.

He was a twit. In my opinion.

Pffft. Anyone comparing Palin to Reagan is a douche.

I think that stems from her approval ratings as Governor. That and the rabid evangelicals who flock to her appearances.

Of course these same folks were chastising Obama supporters for falling for his "celebrity" when Obama has been a national player since 2004 and had done 20 debates and given numerous interviews.

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Jeez Jonze - you are hitting on all cylinders. Very nice observation.

Eric, I'm in a bad mood after watching that clip. So please don't try to pontificate. She was not trying to making 'vague' references as you call it. She doesn't know what 'Right to Privacy' means w.r.t Roe v. Wade. That's not dodging or avoiding a question- that's pure ignorance- not knowing one of the most important decisions of the land.

That is ignorance.

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O god spare me - it's down to victory for the bimbo as long as she doesn't faint or throw up.

The pundits are idiots - this guy was from Alaska. The public is on to her.

my money says she throws up.

The Senate just passed the bailout bill.

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A little touch of sanity in this thread.

Oh wow.

75-24.

The ball is on the House's court now.

Oops! It's actually 74-25.

Ted Kennedy didn't vote.

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So, why does Teddy hate America?

Do we know the split between among the Dems and the GOP?

Even though she didn't recall Exxon v. Baker, she should remember her Shame Pole.

http://gov.state.ak.us/large_photo.php?id=106

So she was even in Washington DC for the decision and went to the National Pres Club to speak. And she couldn't remember that? Yeah right.

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If you contrast Biden's answer to the first question and Palin's you'll see the way the debate is going to go tomorrow night. Biden is going to be calm and reasonable and extremely detailed. The contrast will then be between someone who knows what he is talking about and someone spouting talking points.

Now, chances are Palin will come off better than she did versus Couric. As others have pointed out, it is the follow ups that kill her. But the narrative is already out in the press that Palin is incapable of giving any answers that aren't scripted. So, it will be up to the Obama surrogates to go on TV right after the debate and repeatedly make the case that Palin did nothing but repeat talking points fed to her by her handlers.

My guess is that after tomorrow night Governor Palin is all but going to disappear. She'll do carefully scripted and planned rallies with the base but she won't come within two states of another interview and will never hold a press conference. Even if she does better than expected the McCain team knows that she is always another mic away from screwing up and they won't chance it.

Biden's job is to just give the same answer he'd give to a trade magazine no one ever reads and not try to impress anyone. No need to push it - if he is gaffe free by Friday noon the news cycle will be dominated by whether the Republicans in congress will vote for the bailout plan and the VP debate will be all but forgotten.

No follow-ups in the debate, sorry to say, just a rebuttal. Like elementary school debates.

I disagree. It seems that they are planning the opposite strategy than what they had before. I expect an all-out Palin flurry after the debate. There's really no point in hiding her after the debate. Instead, they will let "Sarah be Sarah," which means letting her talk so much that it won't be news anymore, but it will bring around her throngs of supporters. She will bad mouth Obama and make a lot of her snide sarcastic comments. And talk about how she represents the little guy.

I also think it will be almost a complete failure if all the Dems have to say tomorrow night is that she repeated talking points. How is that a criticism? That's what politicians do. And besides, Repubs will say "No, we just let Sarah be Sarah." Ugh.

Instead, Dems need to hit hard that she gave no specifics. There will assuredly be about 50 topics that she didn't really explain her policy positions on, and they must hammer those. I don't think it will do much difference, but it will reconfirm in independent voters' minds that she is not qualified--without the surrogates having to come right out and say she isn't qualified. Let's let the sour Republicans say that, which they are doing more and more.

Nah. I've got to agree to Jorge here. We'll never see her do a press conference. They'll let "Sarah be Sarah" but only amongst friends - like the Hewitt interview. With less than 5 weeks to go until the election, they can't risk her having a major gaffe....that's much less likely under friendly questioning.

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Ok, let's step back here. We need to get a grip. Yes, the woman is hopeless. We knew that from the start. And we now have a very clear picture of how hopeless - in word and deed.

At the same time, our guy is up in all the polls and his next two debates are on turf where he will do very, very well.

mcShame has almost mortally wounded himself through his VP pick and his disastrous campaign and recent erratic behavior, poor judgment, and so on.

That leaves the VP debate. She may hurt mcShame more or she may just stay where she is. But I can't see her ever coming back from Tina Fey and the interviews with Katie and Charlie and all the terrible stuff she's done in Alaska.

So, as upsetting as all this may seem right now, it's one debate. It likely won't affect the outcome one iota. And the only reason we're sort of freaking out here tonight is because of mcShame and his utter contempt for us and the Republic - to actually choose a Simpleton as a running mate. That's the source of our outrage. And this man must be stopped in his tracks.

Thank goodness for early voting. That must be putting the fear of god into some of these fundies!

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And by the way, the special prosecutor's report comes out a week from Friday. It may not lead to indictment or impeachment for her, but it'll put a whole lot of bad stuff on Palin in the news for a few days, at the least. It sounds like the workers comp part of the investigation has some pretty damning evidence.

Let's see how long she can keep that smug grin pasted on her face in the middle of a shit storm.

Kash79- I am scared. She is so bloody snarky and sarcastic. I just simply detest that smirk on her face and her voice-aaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaagh. I hated HRC's voice too, but man HRC was brilliant compared to this sorry excuse for a human being. I can't believe the right wants to defend THIS woman?????

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Resist the fears.  Don't let 'em paralyze you.  Just keep on muddlin' through.

McSame is toast.  Extra burnt.  100+ EV margin.  Don't lose any sleep!

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Comparing Biden's gaffes to Palin's gaffes is ridiculous - Joe Biden sounds like the smartest guy in the room 98% of the time. Joe Biden IS the smartest guy in the room 99% of the time. But he's got a slight case of foot in mouth disease. If he didn't chances are he'd a been POTUS by now.

But ultimately him being smart is a known known. And him saying something stupid 1% of the time is a known known. So, when he screws up there is some context and history to it. Yeah, he needs to avoid any "clean black guy" remarks. But Joe Biden literally answers hundreds if not thousands of questions from reporters sounding brilliantly between gaffes. Palin can't handle friggin Katie Couric.

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The other 1% of the time is when Biden is in the same room with Obama.

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NickinOz has it right. This is the blathering of bs. The interesting thing is that most average americans recognize bs when they hear it. That would explain the slide in her approval ratings.
Fundamentally, she has no, zero understanding of Roe v. Wade. Without the right of privacy, which Justice Douglas (Griswold v. CT) said arises by implication from the liberty clause of the 14th Amendment and from the 9th Amendment (we have rights even if they are not expressly stated in the Constitution), Roe does not come out the way it does. Vacuous.
What is particularly galling to me is the Sen. McCain is willing to put this Governor into the Presidency and states without reservation that she is qualified for the job. I suspect that Americans want someone more intelligent, curious and articulate than "Joe Six-Pack" to be the President. They may like her, but do they really want someone who does not read newspapers and is not engaged in the real issues of the U.S. or the world to be President. I hope not. I fear for my country.

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I like what you're saying, James. I would venture a guess that there is something in our neurons that allows us to recognize sensible speech. And to recognize fluff, BS, whatever you want to call it - that does not have the flow of language and sense to it.

And I agree that even children would likely be able to pick out BS from speech that flows and makes sense.

By and large the audience for the debate will be interested voters. The kind of people who, by and large, will have this ability to determine sense from BS/nonsense.

It would make an interesting study.

You just have to wonder if there is something seriously wrong with this woman's brain functioning.

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Palin is a mystery. I thought she was a standard far right politician. But if she were, the names of Warren Court decisions should drip from her lips - Miranda, for instance.

She doesn't really seem to care that much about politics. I think, aside from a few right wing memes, she doesn't know or care that much about the dittohead sector.

Nothing wrong with that. But what is it, exactly, that attracts her about the VP spot? The salary? Or - and this is realy my theory - she wants to ride this to a tv hosting job.

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The potential for graft?

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It's the ambition - it's just blind ambition.

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In her case, it's sure blind!

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Palin is a mystery.

Mystery Alaska... great hockey movie.  Or so I'm told :-)

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Man is the Senate sounding off about its big balls in telling Cmmdr CooCoo that his plan wasn't going anywhere, theirs was the only way and "as a separate branch of government that is our duty," all of a fucking sudden.

Sorry - I"m the first to say that they've done well given what they've had to work with. I like it when Congress starts feeling frisky.

From the NYTimes:

"Mr. Obama spoke in support of the plan, but Mr. McCain did not address the chamber. As their colleagues gathered on the Senate floor for a series of votes, Mr. Obama walked over to the Republican side of the chamber to shake his rival’s hand. He was greeted with a chilly look and a brief return handshake from Mr. McCain."

......

McCain is so out classed by Obama.

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McLame is presently into the 3d week of an epic hissy fit.

Just wait - it'll get better.

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McCain is so out classed by Obama.

Out-classing McSame isn't very hard to do...

Obama had a pretty good address to the Senate this afternoon regarding this vote. I heard it on C-SPAN. What he did was what everyone has been asking for and what President Bush failed to do. He broke it down exactly how failure to pass this could affect peoples paychecks, loans for cars and homes and small business. He broke it down to the mainstream level.

Mr. McCain did not address the chamber

Way to lead there, Senator McCain!

Damn blockquotes.

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Intrade has Barack back up to 353 for electoral votes! It may not last... but it will warm your heart.

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You know, if Miss Alaska causes a bump in the polls for them, I'm not going to hang around here until it goes back to where it should be- it's gonna be awful. ;)

(I'm trying to use more emoticons to seem less bitchy. Hope it doesn't annoy people who don't like them.)

[o, and I hope it works, a little]

I've never thought of you as bitchy. Passionate, sure...but there's nothing wrong with that.

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Thanks.


Oh so it was you who ran off fogu2!
Way to go Bitxh!!
:D ++++

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Was it me? O boy!

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Palin is a somewhat smart, ambitious, attractive, incurious, undereducated, tribal, Christian conservative. She probably knows more about the mainland USA from watching network TV and movies than she does from actually having spent any time here. Not a knock - I know more about Alaska from Northern Exposure and 30 Day of Night than I do from spending any time there.

And what I gather most of all from the Couric interviews is that if she isn't scripted she is scared out of her mind to do or say the wrong thing. She reminds me quite a bit of a newsanchor I worked with for years. This woman was ambitious and determined and not stupid, but completely out of her depth once you got her off script. Every once in a while you'd realize she had no clue what she was saying on camera because she'd be sounding like she knew exactly what she was talking about reading a story about Russia but would mispronounce Putin's name 3 or 4 times during the package.

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God - no offense - will someone please "stupid" for me?

I mean to me, to be intellectually incurious is to be stupid.

I don't consider native cunning and good animal instincts intelligence. I honestly believe you have to read something once in awhile to be considered anything other than stupid.

I'm sorry- I guess I don't understand what everyone else means by "stupid" and therein likes my problem.

Would someone enlighten me?

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define "stupid"

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I mean to me, to be intellectually incurious is to be stupid.

Or lazy.  Thinking takes work.

I know a few bright people who've become spoiled by easy success.  They're used to getting by on intuition and feelings.  It seems to work most of the time for them, and for them that's good enough.

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I have known people like that too - but they know more SCOTUS cases than Roe v Wade.


The smart lazy people I know are still smart.


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OT:  Sez here that the Nevada Sec'y of State just released voter-registration figures showing Ds now lead Rs by over 80,000!

Damn!  Whoda thunkit???

Just a Q.

Does anyone think Biden should say I am heartened that Gov. Palin agrees with Senator Obama and I that the right to privacy is one of the emanations and penumbras cast from the Bill of Rights, and is one criterion for evaluating nominees to the SCOTUS?

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I think Joe Biden should say whatever he has planned to say.

;)

Agreed.

:-)

I just would like to see if she can be turned against the fundies. Or, put another way, she is the only thing that's got their base jazzed. ANYTHING which could splinter off a few of them would be a net bonus. It would be a dog whistle that most average Americans would gloss over, but INFURIATE the fundamentalist right-wing.

The fundies won't turn on her. They created her and trumpeted her. They'll just snap the leash hard enough and she'll start saying what they want.