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New Poll Finds McCain With Narrow Lead In North Carolina

A new poll suggests that yesterday's SurveyUSA poll of North Carolina, which gave McCain a 20-point lead, might have been an outlier -- though a new poll this morning still shows him ahead there.

The new numbers from Public Policy Polling (D), which is based in North Carolina: McCain 48%, Obama 44%, with a ±3.9% margin of error. PPP's Tom Jensen immediately set to work on his own poll after he saw the North Carolina survey.

The key difference here is party identification. SurveyUSA's numbers had self-identified Dems making up 40% and GOPers at 41%, roughly in line with the 2004 exit poll. PPP's numbers have Dems at 49% and Republicans at 36%, seemingly consistent with an overall increase in Democratic registration and identification across the country over the last four years.

The only way to settle the question of which party ID breakdown is right is to wait for the actual voting.


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My head hurts.

These poll-result headlines are blasted back and forth before any discernable pattern is identified, all of this leading to a collective TPM migraine.

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I thought the SUSA poll might be an outlier because of the results it had for the gov and sen races as well -- every poll to date has shown the race to be much closer, with Hagan even ahead in some polls, whereas SUSA had Dole with a wide lead.

However, with dynamic voter registration numbers it's very difficult to evaluate polling results.

By now, i hope Eric would have learnt from his mistake by posting a bogus poll number. Anyway, PPP has been consistent all year long. North Carolina is a battle ground state

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I think 49-36 is probably overstating the Dem number but I also don't believe that the party ID in NC is the same as it was in 2004. McCain probably has a 5-6pt lead here, with still 3-5% undecided. A slim chance here for Obama but I don't think it's going to happen. I'd keep up the push in the Research Triangle, though, if only because some of that will bleed over into Southern Virginia. At this point, though, I don't think Obama - by making a move in that state - is going to force McCain to spend a lot of time or money there. Looks like McCain may seem some potential trouble in Florida so he'll probably focuse his efforts more in that state.

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Awesome analysis... "It's close but it's not going to happen. But Obama should keep trying. But no matter how close it gets, McCain probably won't have to contest it. But either way, working in the Research Triangle will spill over into SoVa."

What?

You're the person in line in front of me at McD's aren't you?

"Well... the Big Mac is a classic... but I hear the new Fillet-O-Fish is pretty good... Oh, but they used to put too much tartar sauce on the other one. Maybe the chicken strips? But I had chicken for dinner last night... Hmmm..."

I've not trusted a SurveyUSA poll out of NC when they showed McCain with 14% of the black vote.

Oh and look over to the right, Obama is back up in the Rasmussen tracking poll....

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Eric

I have been reading that the "bounce" McCain enjoyed in the polls has more to do with internal changes made by the pollsters than anything else. Those changes generally put a thumb on the scales that help Republicans and have no basis in reality. I would suggest that the pollsters who you are reporting are paid to make the race look close and they are very good at what they are paid to do. They won't give us honest polls until we are close to the election and their reputations are on the line.

I don't know, has there been an increase in democratic registration in North Carolina consistent with national trends? It seems like that would be the question here...

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Since January, there are 180,000 more registered Democrats in NC (110,000 of whom are black) compared to just 20,000 more registered Republicans. So, yes. here in NC, Democrats are kicking butt.

Yes. Democratic registration has boomed in NC since the Obama and Clinton battle started last year. Also Democrats have always had a lead in voter registration in NC. The state is pretty Democratic on the state level but many of those conservative Democrats vote GOP for federal offices like President.

I'm disappointed that Eric doesn't think McCain is "clinging" to his lead...

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As I posted somewhere else here, there is no way I believe such a large shift, 20 points, practically overnight

Greg, we know it's you. Posting as Eric isn't funny.

It's things like this that make polling right now a futile effort.

OT: I'm detecting a very serious shift in the media's coverage/relationship with the McCain campaign and its tactics. I don't watch cable news if I can help so I don't know if it's universal, but McCain seems in danger of losing his most coveted base....

I've certainly noticed the same. I hope that a) it's true, and that b) it continues. McCain can't be allowed to get away with outright lies and fabrications.

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I think the love affair is over. Most of them are calling BS on the "bridge to nowhere" and the "lipstick on a pig" faux controversy. I don't think he's going to win them back, nor will he try.

However, the GOP has done such a good job of cementing the myth of the liberal media in the minds of Americans that they can probably afford to lose the press. In fact, it's probably part of their strategy. The base will love it and for low-info/undecideds who have bought into the myth, the media accurately fact checking McCain and Palin may appear to them as the media trying to help Obama.

It's so damned frustrating. You have to hand it to the GOP, though...they've neutered the press and turned them - in perception, not in reality - into an arm of the Democratic Party.

I think it is really going to matter when they (the press) are analyzing the debates.

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NBC news last night was taking McCain/Palin to task for all of the things that TPM was covering yesterday. And aggressively (relative to their normal coverage). By contrast, AM Joe aired two web-only anti-Obama smear ads, openly talked about how the McCain/Palin camp was juicing the system by releasing web-only ads to be picked up by the media, and then didn't linger long enough to address the fact that one of them was an utter lie and the other was an utter distortion. The media in general is definitely spending too much time playing the "neutral ref" just reporting what each campaign says about the other, and too little time addressing whether or not the charges are based in reality, but for the moment the trend seems to be moving in the right direction...

There has been a massive voter registration drive in NC this year, but it's not enough to flip the state. There are a lot of unaffiliated voters, and a lot of older folks who are registered Democrat but vote Republican. In fact there were more registered Democrats than Republicans in 2004.

Before the conventions I thought NC was a longshot, now I think it's not going to happen. I'm still volunteering, my goal is to scare McCain into spending money here that he could be spending in Ohio, Florida, Colorado, etc.


As of Sept 6 2008:
Democrat 2,688,252
Republican 1,941,247
Unaffiliated 1,300,848

As of Jan 5 2008:
Democrat 2,511,446
Republican 1,919,575
Unaffiliated 1,173,399

As of Jan 1 2005:
Democrat 2,584,307
Republican 1,912,003
Unaffiliated 1,025,463

http://www.app.sboe.state.nc.us/NCSBE/VR/VR%20Stats/vr_stats_main.asp

Thanks for doing your part.

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Survey USA is red-shifting/tinting their polls. The Coefficent of Correlation is close to one.

Whether it is question construction or sample selection I can't say but Survey USA is bad people.

Note to all Obama supporters. When you get nervous send money to www.barackobama.com. Send $5.00, $10.00, anything. It will make you feel better.

Or volunteer. Especially if you're in NC or another swing state. You can always phone-bank for NC, too. :-)

Oilbama, who voted for Dick Cheney's Energy Bill, claims that sure he has had a 20 year relationship—personal, business, and political—with unrepentant terrorists William “Bill” Ayers, but he says "hey Ayers terrorist acts happened when he was only 8 years old". So if he decided to be friends with Charlie Manson now it would be OK too.

Oilbama with his comparison yesterday with Palin and a Pig and McCain with a Old Fish reached an all time low in politics. Oilbama can compare his fatassed flat chested sourpuss faced wife Michelle with a Pig if he wants to make a silly remark.

Note to all Obama supporters. How proud you must be of your Sexist Pig candidate, and that Oilbama voted for Dick Cheney's Energy Bill crafted in secret with Oil Lobbyists which contained the billions of dollars in givaways to Big Oil.
To bad Oilbama is going to get trounced in this election and all you Oilbama cultists will have to become Moonies or Scientologists to get your cult fix. Poor Michelle will have to go back to hating America again.

Eric the PPP numbers are consistent with Party ID numbers from a PEW poll this year in NC.

Factoring out the SUSA poll, it looks like NC hasn't budged barely a single point. McCain has had a fairly comfortable 4 point lead since May. Given Obama's very strong efforts there, that isnt good.

It was a worth while effort, but seems like no fruits have been gathered.

Wow. What an idiotic thing to post. I'm all for equal time, but Dem BillC (even a ridiculous post name for a troll) you need to get a grip. Quickly.

Living in NC is a bizarre thing for a Democrat. During the primary season, I felt a definite shift for Obama. Also, living in the blood red western part of the state, I see an awful lot of Obama stickers/signs. This doesn't translate to a win, of course, but I think it's every bit as close as the polls indicate. GOTV efforts are hugely necessary here to take advantage of our swelling numbers, at least on paper.

NC-Pres
Sep 9 SurveyUSA
McCain (R) 58%, Obama (D) 38%

Yankeedevil is the idiot if he thinks Oilbama the Sexist Pig has a chance in NC.

NC-Pres
Sep 9 SurveyUSA
McCain (R) 58%, Obama (D) 38%

Yankeedevil is the idiot if he thinks Oilbama the Sexist Pig has a chance in NC.

NC-Pres
Sep 9 SurveyUSA
McCain (R) 58%, Obama (D) 38%

Yankeedevil is the idiot if he thinks Oilbama the Sexist Pig has a chance in NC.

I just have to give a big FUCK YOU to those few on here who promised not to give another dime to Obama unless he responded to Mccain's most recent attack. You're pussies with no sense of goddamn will. Obama struggles in the polls and media have fuckin inspired me to donate and volunteer, I'm going to put in extra work to help this man save our country.

So when we win this November I'll remember the assholes who said that and laugh because we did it no thanks to you. I feel we'll be better off without that no-will-to-win attitude anyway.

You trolls just keep following those popular vote polls. The college is what matters!

Republican 194
Democratic 243
Toss Up 101

http://pollster.com/

I just have to give a big FUCK YOU to those few on here who promised not to give another dime to Obama unless he responded to Mccain's most recent attack. You're pussies with no sense of goddamn will. Obama struggles in the polls and media have fuckin inspired me to donate and volunteer, I'm going to put in extra work to help this man save our country.

So when we win this November I'll remember the assholes who said that and laugh because we did it no thanks to you. I feel we'll be better off without that no-will-to-win attitude anyway.

I'm shocked! shocked I tell you to learn there's deception in the polls! I'm with jbrandof,man/woman up you Chicken Littles, get off your hand-wringing buts and DO SOMETHING! Volunteer at mybarackobama.com. You thought these muderous scumbags in the Grand Old Perverts were gonna roll over for Obama? Like O sez: This ain't about him, it's about US. What are YOU gonna do TODAY to win the future for our children? Let's kick some neoCon ass!

I am increasingly convinced that American people should be blamed for rewarding dishonorable politicians.

I am inclined to suggest, after being reminded once again today how dishonorable McCain has been in running this campaign, that Team Obama should match McCain's no-holds-barred approach if it is what it takes to win. And if Obama wins the election, he should declare a day of national soul-searching with 3 minutes of silence and the national flag flying at half-mast.

I just have to give a big FUCK YOU to those few on here who promised not to give another dime to Obama unless he responded to Mccain's most recent attack. You're pussies with no sense of goddamn will. Obama struggles in the polls and media have fuckin inspired me to donate and volunteer, I'm going to put in extra work to help this man save our country.

So when we win this November I'll remember the assholes who said that and laugh because we did it no thanks to you. I feel we'll be better off without that no-will-to-win attitude anyway.

I think Obama should give a speech on lies and deception in the GOP presidential campaigns since 1988, mentioning the most glaring lies, including Swiftboat, and particularly highlight the big lie Team George Bush manufactured about McCain's adopted kid and then play up the fact that McCain, the former victim, has transformed himself into a villain by hiring those who helped victimize him in 2000 and turning his campaign into a factory of lies. He should then most forcefully refute every potentially damaging lie and misleading statement that the McCain campaign manufactured. In the speech, he should also tie the GOP's practices of misleading and lying to the public with failed policies of the Bush administration.

As soon as I saw the SurveyUSA numbers, my response was, "Don't Panic, and wait for a PPP poll."

I know SUSA has a strong record overall, but they pretty much blow when it comes to polling the south. They got NC's primary so wrong - they were the farthest off-mark of any of the "good" pollsters. PPP is based in North Carolina, and has done a consistently good job of polling the state (as much as I wanted to dog their primary numbers in the Senate race, they proved to be dead on. All props to PPP).

I have felt all along that NC is winnable for the Obama campaign. I do think that there may be a percentage or two of underpolled "cell phone only"/young voters who could push up Obama numbers, because I've seen the enormous support he has at area universities & colleges. NC has a particular voting geography that plays to Obama's favor - about half its votes come from 14 counties, 3/4 of which are Obama strongholds (versus only 3 of those counties which went for Kerry in '04). And perhaps most importantly, the Obama organization knows how to work early voting in NC. As they learned in the primary, this can have enormous pay-offs: they won the election here before election day. With 50 field offices to McCain's 0, I believe the Obama campaign in NC can do so again.

Obama having a shot in North Carolina is pretty slim -- and that's no surprise. Wack-o fundamentalists make up a sizable chunk of the population (believe me, I lived there for over 15 years).

That said, it's Dole/Hagan I'm most curious about. That's the one where Dems have a realistic shot.

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