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Veterans For Obama: We're Impressed With Obama's "Service"

The Obama campaign is trying out a new message in response to McCain's endless discussion of his own POW experiences: Describe Obama's time as a community leader and public servant as akin to military service.

On a conference call with reporters moments ago, the Obama campaign rolled out a new effort called "Next Generation Veterans For Obama," a group of Iraq and Afghanistan vets who back Obama (the nod to the change message is a nice touch).

On the call, several of the veterans went out of their way to describe Obama's "service" to his country in various ways.

"The fact is, Senator Obama has served," said Koby Langley, a former Army JAG officer and Iraq and Balkans veteran. "He's served his community." Langley added that veterans like people who "actually legislate for change" and "serve" vets.

"Most of my friends and colleagues in the military look at Senator Obama's lifetime of service and they identify with that," added former Army military police Iraq veteran Philip Carter, who's now serving as the veterans director for the Obama campaign.

One interesting moment on the call: When the assembled vets were asked by a reporter if their fellow vets were resisting Obama because of his lack of military service, most said no, but one went a bit off message.

"Yes, I have had some resistance to it," that vet said. "Most times their views are based on inaccurate information they have heard. I try and give them the information that they need. They're not gonna change their minds sometimes."


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"Describe Obama's time as a community leader and public servant as akin to war service."


Ehhhhh, I think that has "backfire" written all over it.

I guess if it's only vets pushing this, then that's okay. But I feel like Obama will get hammered if he personally tries to equate his community organizing with military service.

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umm...isn't the point that there are more ways to serve your country than to join the military?

Obama was way too young to fight in vietnam. I can't imagine anyone would really hold that against him.

Instead, he served his community and his country by taking a lowerpaying job on the south side of chicago where real people needed real help and real results.

if military service is the only way to serve your country, then we're just setting ourselves up for disaster because not everyone wants to join the military. ANd turns out, we actually need people to serve their country in ways other than just joining the military. Otherwise, there would be no cops, no teachers, no doctors, no community organizers, no boyscout troops, etc...

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Total backfire. About as reasonable as Mitt Romney's sons saying that working for his campaign was akin to serving in the military.

Exactly what it first reminded me of.

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Me three, total backfire. I'm really getting concerned about the obama campaign. WTF is going on?

What is going on is reality setting in.

Obama is an invention, vaporware. Are yu finally ready to admit that he is in fact the empty suit that all the Clinton supporters warned about?

McCain comes off as authentic.
Obama is a mirage.

"What is going on is reality setting in."

..this coming from a certified asshat who actually thinks Hillary will be the nominee. lol

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And the clintons are pathological liars. I'd rather have obama any day before the clintons.

Bwahahaha. They're all liars. Goes with the territory. Don't delude yourself.

"Bwahahaha. They're all liars. Goes with the territory. Don't delude yourself."

..more incoherent ramblings from a baboon's ass.

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That's really insulting to baboons.

Take two aspirin.

Snot snorting the crystal meth.

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...besides, most baboon asses are bright and colorful...

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I disagree, the clintons raised it to a new art form, above and beyond anything anyone else has done, except maybe the king. The king and his cronies are neck and neck with the clintons in the lying department. They are head and shoulders above everyone else.

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If they are liars, like all the rest, why are you so dedicated to serving the Clintons? I mean why should you throw yourself under the bus for any of the bastards, the Clintons included?

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Yes we can...(sorry, I couldn't resist).

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Naw, it doesn't backfire, but it doesn't help much, either.  No traction here.

I doubt it will backfire. Obama obviously hasn't served in the military and the fact that vets are saying this about Obama will prevent backfire. As we have seen with McCain's treatment this election, you never question a veteran even if they lie


Warren Lied, McCain Wasn’t In The Cone of Silence

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What's significant is that military donations to Obama are six time greater than to McSame. That's his target, not the general public, I believe.

The military service is not the only way to serve your country.

I'm tired sometimes of the militarism as a major element of U.S. society. That should be an issue of this campaign. Sadly, in the climate we're living in and the larger role of the military in all aspects of american life, it's impossible even to present that topic.

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It's rather curious that those who have actually served in a war-time military do not hold it against those who did not, while those who didn't serve hold it against those others who didn't.

It's only those who have never experienced war first hand who glorify it. Eisenhower's writings are quite clear on the subject.

Yeah right, Obama's time as a "community organizer" registering black voters for the Daley machine so they could vote for Obama in the future was really akin to military service. And arugula and organic tea are a normal diet for a 6'1" 47-year-old guy. And we all have clergymen who beg God to damn America, don't we?

Clearly the gorillas were superior after all.

"And arugula and organic tea are a normal diet for a 6'1" 47-year-old guy"

Karl Rove's nutsack drippings finding their way on TPM.

And $520 shoes and 11 houses are normal for a 72 year old man?

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Certainly, for a 72 year old kept man....

I still have 4 years to make the grade. Tell me more about the houses.

Maybe a backfire, but I see it as an opportunity to openly question how McCain's POW experience relates to actually leading a nation without people going batshit hysterical. When republican's ask "What does Obama's "service" compare to McCain's war record?" - Answer - "Good question, Obama's "service" actually relates to being a successful Commander-in-Chief"

openly question how McCain's POW experience relates to actually leading a nation without people going batshit hysterical.

Good luck with that. :)

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Nonstarter. It has to be ignored by obama. Mcbush will totally play it up at every opportunity. Change the narrative and dialogue. You can't "question" it, because the 80% of the voting public who are low information voters will get the spin that its an attack on his service and won't think about the nuance. Just ignore it. Talk about his absurd senate record, lack of knowledge on the economy, terrible economic policies, how mcbush will screw everyone but the top 1%, etc., etc., etc. Ignore the pow garbage.

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"Obama's "service" actually relates to being a successful Commander-in-Chief"
Your point was flying along so well then you overloaded it with BS. You are honestly saying that being a "community organizer" for 3 years, 7 years as a part time state legislator and 3 years in the Senate better prepare you to be Commander in Cheif of the Armed Forces than 27 years in the Navy and a combined 18 years in the House and Senate...? Seriously...?

I think this is a TERRIBLE idea. Please make them stop!

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I picture him standing up at the convention saying "I'm Barack Obama and I'm reporting for duty! (with a half assed salute John Kerry taught him back stage...)"

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Very funny and I remember when kerry did that and all the play up on his service and I was like oh boy, we lost this one. It really wasn't very bright, especially with all the baggage that his nam service brought up, which wasn't vetted in the primary but that he knew about. It still pisses me off. It should have been played totally differently by kerry.

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The whole thing was(how does Humanity_Critic put it?) "inartful" to say the least...I was watching it with my father-in-law who is a retired Air force colonel and he said "Damn! Even I can salute better than that guy!" Which is pretty funny if you've ever spent anytime on an air force base.

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Former US Army and his salute sucked. I salute better than that and it's been decades. Also, he shouldn't have played up his service like he did. There were too many holes that could be exploited, which were. Ugh, what a freaking disaster in 04. It still makes me ill.

Cut him some slack. He was in the Navy, wasn't he? I didn't know they saluted at all. But your point is well taken. We need to forget about who's the greatest soldier since Sergeant York and give peace a chance.

I'm hoping that this is some sort of trap being set for McGoo.

If not, I don't see the upside.

Hopefully they aren't going to push that. Maybe some of the vets just happened to go that direction on this particular conference call. But I do like the idea of "Next Generation Vets for Obama".

My God, I can see it now.

It will be painted as Obama equating his work as a community organizer not with "service," but with John McCain being tortured for 5 and 1/2 years as a POW in Vietnam.

This is a total loss. No wonder Obama wants complete control over his campaign.

"Maybe it's the applause still ringing in his ears.

Maybe Barack Obama really thinks that defending America is something you can learn on a quick crash course, like community organizing. ..."

and on and on and on and on

Not good.

Indeed, learning how to Defend America requires crashing not one but FIVE airplanes.

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...you do have to get in one to crash one though...

...you have to start a nuclear war on one or two fronts in order to crash foreign policy...

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Why are we trying to out-service McCain? That's not the way to go with this thing. He was a POW, we shouldn't be trying to stack up Obama's community service next to that.

There is SO much to go with when it comes to framing McCain, I'm not sure we want to fall into the public service trap.

http://strategy08.wordpress.com

I don't know. You assume that everyone accepts that Obama is a patriot who's committed to serving his nation and not his self-interest. Given that their is a concerted effort on the part of Republicans and others to paint him as "other," as a publicity hound more concerned with his own ambition and not the nation, there must be more than a handful of people that are receiptive to that notion. Pushing back against this meme and reinforcing his committment to America is critical going into the fall. This has NOTHING to do with McCain's time as a POW or juxtaposing the two.

But obviously I could be wrong and not seeing this very clearly. Only time will tell.

As long as Obama never says it himself, I think it'll be fine. Let the Vets say what they "want." If he's asked about it, he should just defer to the vets themselves.

They'll put the question in a direct way that he can't refer to the vets. Is it or isn't it? He'll have to say it isn't unless you're a firefighter, cop or paramedic, etc. More worms. Their best bet is to cite civilian authority. There is a good reason we don't want soldiers making foreign policy. Vets for Obama and Peace makes sense to me.

Service to the country people. People serve the country in a variety of ways, not just by signing up for the military. Good gawd....

If Obama and the Dems were good at message control, I'd be all for that. But they're not and the Republicans will win like they always do. They'll say that Obama, through this group, is trying to equate his community organizing years with John McCain's years of torture. They'll also say he's once again short changing the military.

If we had a candidate strong enough to push back then I wouldn't have to care what they'll say, but we don't and he'll lose this battle like he's been losing the past few weeks.

Obama is a wimp.

There is nothing in the electorate's mind that is the equivalent of military service except military service. Period.

This issue is kryptonite to Obama. But he cannot stop McCain from keeping it front and center for the rest of the campaign.

Obama was an Indonesian citizen, studying the Koran and Arabic while McCain was a POW. Obama has never served in the military. End of discussion.

"There is nothing in the electorate's mind that is the equivalent of military service except military service. Period."

You have shown yourself to be politically inept at every single turn, I'm sure the American electorate doesn't want the likes of you representing them..

"Obama was an Indonesian citizen, studying the Koran and Arabic while McCain was a POW."

..the way you gleefully digest the discredited Larry Johnson, makes me think that you have a bright future in porn ahead of you.

Here, I'll throw you a bone. From the messiah's own mouth:

"Not only do I think I'm a desi, but I'm a desi," he said, using a colloquial term that describes South Asian immigrants. The remark was greeted with laughs. "I'm a homeboy."

http://www.sfgate.com/cgi-bin/article.cgi?f=/c/a/2008/08/17/MNCI12CVH8.DTL&tsp=1

So what? McCain says we're all Georgians.

"Here, I'll throw you a bone. From the messiah's own mouth"

..wipe your mouth, I can tell that Larry Johnson has been there.

Whiteman, finally you have proven that you cannot even accept the words that come right out of Obama's mouth.

Stick to hippity hop. The real world has no use for you.

"Stick to hippity hop. The real world has no use for you"

Nah, I'll stick to smacking you around like the crackwhore that you are - just as long as you stick to being the proverbial anal wart of this website.

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"He's served his community." Langley added that veterans like people who "actually legislate for change" and "serve" vets.

i think this something that needs to be highlighted constantly. Despite McCain's status as a veteran and POW, he has a worse voting record on veterans issues than Obama.

They should cut an ad highlighting this. The Objective facts are these:

-Iraq and Afghanistan Veterans of America gave McCain a grade of D for his record of voting against veterans. (By contrast, Obama got a B+.)

– Disabled Veterans of America noted McCain’s dismal 20 percent voting record on veterans’ issues. (Obama had an 80 percent.)

– In a list of “Key Votes,” Vietnam Veterans of America (VVA) notes McCain “Voted Against Us” 15 times and “Voted For Us” only 8. (Obama voted for VVA 12 times, and against only once.)

Camp Obama should make this a part of the narrative.

You should send him an email, or get Josh to send it. These are have very good points.

Agreed.

I keep trying not to second guess Obama's campaign, but why the hell isn't this stuff in a commercial? Why the hell isn't this stuff being repeated ad nauseum by Bill Burton? They do oppo research - you can't tell me they don't know this already.

I'm withholding any judgment on what Obama should and should not be putting out there until after the convention. No one is paying attention right now.

Yeah, I'm thinking (hoping) that the campaign's plan is to let McCain throw everything he can at him and then come out blazing after the convention. I seem to recall reading somewhere that Obama has a history of putting petal to the metal late in campaigns. I hope that's what he's doing here.

Actually, I think you're misphrasing this, Greg. The veterans seem to be saying that Obama's actually served the interests of veterans more than John McCain has.

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You know what, after reading the quotes again, I think that you may be right. The point of the call may have been supporting obama's positions on vet issues vis a vis mcbush. Good catch.

I also think I agree. I think Greg's characterization is a little off.

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I keep forgeting the clintonian spin that greg sometimes falls back on. Have to read between the lines. Greg's marching orders are to play for 2012 for the clintons. We have to keep that in perspective.

Wow, and I thought I was still holding the "Meanest" title...

:-)

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Nah, I think I get it with respect to the clintons. There is no other reason for their conduct throughout the primaries and since. They want to damage obama as much as possible for a 2012 run, without making it look like they are damaging him. If I were obama, I would keep them as far away and isolated as possible. Especially, mr. bill. I would send him to campaign for the overseas american vote in timbuktu until november without any media present. Mr. bill's last interview with abc was priceless. Can you imagine the outcry if the roles were reversed and obama said that about the senator from new york?

Hey, be careful there. I'm a Clinton supporter to the end. Do you think it's easy for me to hold my nose?????????????

:-)

One second thought, you don't stop I won't have to either....


:-)

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Ok, can you make the clintons stop? That would be helpful and would be better long term for the dems. They can't win in 2012 either. Maybe you can talk some sense into them and their supporters.

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"Do you think it's easy for me to hold my nose?????????????" Y'all on the left are not allowed to complain about holding your nose. McCain was being vetted by John Kerry as his runningmate less than 4 years ago...we're doing some major nose holding over here.

His characterization is indeed off here.

I'll add my agreement to this.

I just worry, though, that if Greg can misrepresent it accidentally, then the wingnuts can certainly misrepresent it on purpose.

In his short tenure in elected office, Barack has "served" veterans better than has John McCain.

I am glad to see these veterans step up and say that "serving" the country means more than wearing a military uniform. McCain has not served veterans well.

I spoke this weekend with an active duty Army SFC who has done two tours in Iraq. He is supporting Obama.

Look, not everything is a national ad or is presented to appeal to the entire clump of American voters.

Military folk and their families listen more to other military folk and their families. It's a tight-knit group. This is a very good strategy for getting information to that group.

Those of you with "national ad campaign" mentality need to rethink things, I believe. Take Obama's campaign running targeted local ads and his appearances before specific audiences--like at Saddleback and in the Brody CBN interview. These are not conversations that are "national"--they are targeted to specific groups and sometimes to specific geographical regions.

This is a different style of campaign; Hillary and Bill were running the "national ad campaign" and I saw that up close and personal here in Missouri. Hillary lost in Missouri--not by much, but it was a major upset. And my city ward was not exempt from "Hillary should have won". At that meeting to start the delegate selection process, we had several folk who were shocked to learn that Hillary had not won the ward.

Even Democrats at the local level with heavy experience in the previous decades of campaigns are shocked by Obama success. This is a different style of campaign--and it will work.

Your entitled to your opinion. Just remember that, um, you are the one getting weak-knee'd here, not Obama or his campaign.

Written in response to......??

Michael Hussein, up thread. Not sure how it got appended to your post.

Thanks. We're on the same page with the rampant pessimism.

Everybody knows McCain was a POW, not everybody knows Obama was a community organizer in Chicago's south side. If McCain attacks this it will A]Publicize Obama's community organizer work and B]Have him playing his POW card again - I think there could be an issue where he plays it too often it will lose value.

I'd rather the Obama camp didn't "go here" either, but have faith(even if it is fading) that there is a method to their madness.

..thats my thinking Jonze.

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Everyone does knoe he was a community organizer...that's all we heard about for the first 6 months of his campaign till he figured out what else to talk about...now, most still don't know what the heck a community organizer is...but that's a different story.

Ah yes, Hussein has a proud history of Defending the Nation by virtue of his "community organizing" in Chicago. And all that crack smoke was really incoming fire, right?
This really is dumbing down the conversation.
Using their criteria we need to start giving Purple Hearts out to everyone who can sprain a wrist spanking their monkey.
And to think that the ObaDroids are actually pushing this!

"And all that crack smoke was really incoming fire, right?"

..put your mother on the phone, I'm sure she's an authority on cooked cocaine.

"This really is dumbing down the conversation."

..this coming from the mental midget who inserts winning quips like "Hussein" and "ObaDroids" into the conversation.

Dear American Citizens and the media

Challenge to Media.

As a disabled American Veteran and concerned American citizen.

"We the citizens of the United States of America have the ultimate responsibility to elect the " Right Candidate with the right temperament" to lead our nation'

Our nation is and will be facing many present and future critical internal and external challenges as well as opportunities to address those challenges.

In order to prevent any probable prolong recession and diminished world standing as the sole superpower in the world' Whether it is the moral, democratic, economic, military, and other issues.

I impress upon voters to vote after considering following " qualities and characteristics" of our presumptive presidential nominees.

In my firm professional opinion that the media should help the common voter to explore and discuss following attributes of Hon. Senator McCain and Obama:


1. Calm, cool, and collected " temper " [ Presidential Temperament ].
2. Sound and sustained "Judgment and Caliber".
3. "Thought-fullness and togetherness" of purpose and positions.
4. Minimum "ex-poser and exploitation" around "Washington and Washington insiders".
5. Renewed " Vigor and Vision " for our Great-grand Nation.
6. Foreign policy based on " American Values, Virtuous, Vastness".
7. The campaign based of facts and free of fiction, deception, seduction, and attacks.

I plead to common voter to stay informed, stay involved, and stay engaged.

Do not allow some partisan media, pundits, pollsters, and perpetual political opinion makers effect your vote in the wrong direction.

Please do not be deceived and duped by "Psychological Terrorism" that is being directed at you without your consent and awareness.

Long live U.S.A and its diverse but democratic people.

Col. A.M. Khajawall [Ret] MD., Colonel, USAR / MC Combat Stress Control[Ret], Disabled American Veteran and Iraq Freedom team.

This is the wrong answer.

The right answer is to do what Clark began to do some weeks ago: call McCain's own record of service into question.

This is what beat Kerry in 2004. Heck, it's what beat McCain in 2000.

And the great thing for the Democrats this year is that they can do it to McCain without lying about his record (unlike the Republican attacks on Kerry or, for that matter, McCain).

But they will need to be willing to ignore the cries of outrage from the GOP that would greet this strategy. And I don't think that the Democrats have it in them to do that.

If McCain wins this election, I think the refusal of the Obama campaign to stand behind Clark when he questioned the relevance of McCain's POW experience will be seen as the 2008 equivalent of Kerry's non-response to the swiftboaters in August 2004.

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Nope, totally disagree. Kerry wasn't in a pow camp for years, mcbush was. Kerry was only in nam for a few months.

It's apples and oranges. It would be foolish to try to attack mcbush's pow experience. It is best ignored.

Clark's comments were stupid. The issues are his record after nam, not getting into an argument over what happened in nam. Total non-starter.

We have the 2000 Republican primary campaign as pretty solid evidence that I'm right that going after McCain's Vietnam experience can be a winner.

You forget that before the 2004 campaign, Kerry's Vietnam record was unimpeachable. The obvious thing for the Republicans to go after that year was his antiwar activism.

But for decades now the GOP has understood that you defeat your opponent not by avoiding his strongest points but by going right after them. So they went after Kerry's record of wartime heroism.

McCain's wartime record is the very core of his own campaign narrative. The only way to challenge that narrative is to attack it directly.

However, I think that the Democrats are much more likely to think as you do about these things. And, as a result, I'm beginning to think our next president will be John McCain.

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1. Kerry's vietnam record was not unimpeachable. Everyone outside of massachusetts just didn't know about the attacks. The swiftboat bozos attacked kerry in mass in the past, but it didn't come out in the primaries. I am actually pissed about that. Also, kerry's protests and stuff play in mass, but not middle america. I actually was shocked when I found out that he was only in nam for 90 days or so and he so played it up at the convention and during the primaries. WTF.

2. The republicans didn't attack mcbush's pow record in 2000. They came up with a bunch of other nonsense to go after mcbush.

I still think the way to go is to go after everything after nam, from him trashing his first wife to his senate record. Gee, what a hero. If you get hung up about what happened in nam, you are arguing where he wants to argue and on his turf.

You're simply incorrect about the role Vietnam played during the 2000 campaign:

In the 2000 South Carolina Presidential primary Bush surrogates circulated stories that McCain's five years as a POW had made him "mentally unstable," gave him a "loose screw," that he "committed treason while a POW" and "came home and forgot us."

In the crucial SC primary, Bush operatives went directly after McCain's time as a POW. And the attacks were very effective.

The whole point is to argue on "his turf." You don't concede to the opponent the ground on which he wants to fight the campaign. You undermine it.

I do think that the Democrats should avoid the lies and distortions that the Bush campaign used in going after McCain in SC. But I think that the Bush campaign had the right target--the core of McCain's own personal narrative.

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You are correct, I forgot about that and now vaguely recall it. I disagree with its impact though. I don't have a problem with 3rd teir people, not prominent dems or official surrogates, circulating what you are saying. I just don't think that it should be a primary line of attack from prominent dems or the obama campaign. It would be better to have bozos in the right-wing media repeating the line of attacks and asking prominent dems what they thought and the respondent could use the "as far as I know" line used by the clintons. Maybe that's the way to go.

Hold fast, Michael. You're right. McCain never used the "unstable" attacks as an excuse for losing SC. He says the reason he lost SC was he caved on the Confederate flag issue and pandered to the rednecks. Yeah. He really talks that way. Can you imagine? It's why 4 years ago McCain was the most respected politician in America.

Read your source again, my friend. The McCain campaign acknowledges that the black kid calls hurt McCain. That the unstable shit stuck is just speculation. No one knows if it did or not. McCain says it didn't.

However, there is plenty of that sleaze flying around TPM right now. It's a real loser's trick.

Don't discount Obama's service as a community organizer,,,,,, I know the south side, and much of it is a warzone in more ways than one. The man has paid his dues and doesn't have to take a back seat to anyone, least of all McCain.

For those who missed it, check out the Bacevich interview on the PBS archive that was on Bill Moyers Friday last,,,, especially the parts on militarization. Obama, not McCain, is the one to be able to comprehend the situation and begin the generational changes necessary to restore the Republic from its imperial captivity.

You know, I take it back.
Obama does deserve the Medal of Honor.
Damn, imagine living with his bitch!

And lordy yes! Even better, Hussein, armed only with his crack pipe, went up against the Drug Gangs and Pimps and made the streets safe once again.
Not only is Hussein the Second Coming he is One Bad Mothafucka!

What a great followup to his pathetic performance with Pastor Rick!

The more veterans, particularly Iraq and Afghanistan veterans (aka "boots on the ground"), are heard, the better for Barack.

way to invite the mccain camp to fire back that obama is demeaning military service, by trying to equate it with other types of service, that's the kind on nonsense the media loves. they are better off just pushing the facts that he actually supports legislation that benefits those who serve their country, unlike mcstupid.

There is an interesting angle to the Vets for Obama. I was a Vet for Kerry in Wisconsin. Couple of nights ago, I got a call from a start-up Vets for Obama in WI. But I've moved to MI, so I said have the Michigan folks give me a call. Standard stuff. The Kerry campaign shared their list with Obama.

Now earlier his year, I was an out-of-state volunteer for Clinton. OOS volunteers are hard core. Travel on their own dime to canvass, etc. Got a form letter from Clinton says thanks, count on me to do right, etc., but no mention of Obama.

Then comes the got your name from Hillary phone call. From the Obama campaign? Nope. From a guy running for Congress in a district down the road. Knew how much I gave Hillary, knew I volunteered, the whole story.

Why isn't Clinton turning those lists over to Obama yet?

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Oh, come on billy, you know why not. They will never turn over the lists. They are holding out for 2012. They are not cooperating at all.

Hillary gave her lists to Kerry in '04.

It's important for Obama to challenge McCain's judgment on National Security. All he has to do is bring up Bosnia. We won the Bosnia campaing in about two weeks using airpower. McCain wanted to send in ground troops, lots of them. How many American soldiers would have been killed fighting a ground campaign in central Europe? Fortunately America never had to find out, because President Clinton rejected Senator McCain's bad, bad advice. McCain, bellicose, impulsive and cocky, cannot be trusted with the lives of our troops. If he were president today, American troops would be headed to Georgia to fight the Russians. America can't afford that risk.

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