Nagourney: "Don't Believe Everything You Read On Drudge"
Matt Drudge is -- ahem -- "reporting" that the New York Times has learned that Obama has made his Veep choice, and lots of folks in the political world are chattering away about this as if it's true.
Drudge, who's blaring this as his big lead story, also says that the paper's Jeff Zeleny and Adam Nagourney have learned that his Veep roll-out could begin tomorrow morning.
Mark Halperin reports that Drudge is "wrong." I checked in with Nagourney himself, and he emailed this:
Don't believe everything you read on Drudge. We'll post a story when it's ready.
That's pretty much a denial. Sort of, anyway.
Late Update: The Times story is now up:
WASHINGTON -- Senator Barack Obama has all but finalized his choice for a running mate and set an elaborate roll-out plan for his decision, beginning with an early morning alert to supporters, perhaps as soon as Wednesday, followed by a trip to swing states by the new Democratic ticket, aides said.Mr. Obama's deliberations remain remarkably closely held. Aides said perhaps a half-dozen advisers were involved in the final discussions in an effort to enforce a command that Mr. Obama issued to staff: that his decision not leak out until supporters are notified.
Mr. Obama had not notified his choice -- or any of those not selected -- of his decision as of late Monday, advisers said. Going into the final days, Mr. Obama was said to be focused mainly on three candidates: Senator Evan Bayh of Indiana, Governor Tim Kaine of Virginia and Senator Joseph R. Biden Jr. of Delaware.
So the paper isn't reporting that Obama has finalized his decision, as Drudge said; he has "all but" finalized it. And the roll-out could come tomorrow. Or it might not. And the Veep pick himself or herself -- if there is one -- hasn't been told.
And Bayh may still be in the running, supposedly, though that's very hard to imagine.
Nagourney is too busy putting the finishing touches on his "Obama's VP Problem" column.
August 18, 2008 6:09 PM | Reply | Permalink
All I know is that McCain's VP better be young, because the signs show McCain's age is getting in the way of his abilities:
http://www.thepersonalispolitical.com/2008/08/is-mccain-physicallymentally-fit-to.html
August 18, 2008 9:26 PM | Reply | Permalink
nothins gonna happen for a couple days.
they just came out with this news to change the subject from obama's poor showing at the saddleback forum.
August 19, 2008 1:38 AM | Reply | Permalink
Wow. Another article that explains McCain to a *T*:
http://www.tnr.com/story_print.html?id=bb70e50e-58fb-4893-ac00-62b92a515161
August 19, 2008 3:11 AM | Reply | Permalink
I don't know, doesn't sound like much of a denial to me. Isn't it suggesting that they DO have the story but that it isn't quite ready yet?
August 18, 2008 6:11 PM | Reply | Permalink
Seemed like a non-denial denial to me as well.
August 18, 2008 6:12 PM | Reply | Permalink
Me as well.
August 18, 2008 6:14 PM | Reply | Permalink
SILLY SEASON has reached it's climax! Back to my vacation from politics.....
Oh, and..... VPOTUS Feingold.
August 18, 2008 6:16 PM | Reply | Permalink
and its kind of funny because now the drudge report has this "VP poll" to see who people think his VP would be, very much silly season...silly from boredom
Warren Lied, McCain Wasn’t In The Cone of Silence
August 18, 2008 6:55 PM | Reply | Permalink
Well, that would be my choice, but alas, not very likely. Wasting some time tonight, I started trying websites like obamawebb.com, etc. Some have some political stuff on them, but ONE shuttled me immediately to barackobama.com - it was obamanelson.com. I know, it doesn't seem likely, but he and Hillary are supposed to be in Florida on Thursday. Hmmm.
August 19, 2008 12:57 AM | Reply | Permalink
Why would the NYT get an exclusive disclosure of Obama's VP when they didn't even endorse Obama in the primary.
Gov. Kathleen Sebelius will be VP.
August 18, 2008 6:18 PM | Reply | Permalink
For it to be Sebelius, H Clinton would have to nominate her, or else all the Clintonite gasbags at Talk Left and PUMA will have fainting spells and hissy fits (as if they ever stopped!)
August 18, 2008 6:28 PM | Reply | Permalink
That will happen regardless of who it is, except for the clintons. I'll be happy when the selection is out and after about 2 weeks of bs from the media about how it should have been the clintons.
August 18, 2008 6:31 PM | Reply | Permalink
Philosophy 101
(a) If a tree falls in the woods and no one is around, is there any sound?
(b) If three liars like Drudge, Nagourney, and Halperin are in disagreement, is there any truth?
August 18, 2008 6:20 PM | Reply | Permalink
Unlikely that Obama will be announcing his VP choice tomorrow.
Obama has a speech he will be giving to the VFW tomorrow and later in the day an economic summit at a Townhall in North Carolina.
Thus his plate is full tomorrow for a roll out.
August 18, 2008 6:21 PM | Reply | Permalink
I didn't get my text message so I KNOW its wrong.
August 18, 2008 6:29 PM | Reply | Permalink
Yep, a non-denial from Nagourney. Anything that "sort of" sounds like a denial, isn't.
BTW, thanks to the few of you who recommended my Branding McCain a "Big Oil Cowboy" post. I had some trouble with the formatting, and there are several versions of it up.
If the one you rec'd isn't the one linked above, please consider recommending the "approved" version. Thanks!
August 18, 2008 6:33 PM | Reply | Permalink
Please God, let it be Hillary.
Hill & Bill to the rescue. The three of them together will be the most unstoppable force in American political history. They'll steamroll right over the Republicans and its smear machine.
Jeremiah Wright, the Clinton library donors, none of that shit will matter when Barry, Bill & Hill and a united Democratic party are in complete control of the message from August 29th to November 4th.
Obama/Clinton '08. McCain's shitting his Depends at the prospect.
August 18, 2008 6:34 PM | Reply | Permalink
I don't know Michael, the Republicans will slam down on that ticket hard.
First Obama will be labeled as a hypocrite for campaigning as a candidate of change and then selecting a VP candidate who felt that his opponent was fit to be commander and chief.
Obama-Clinton could have happened Pre-March but that opportunity was blown by none other than you know who.
August 18, 2008 6:43 PM | Reply | Permalink
Your argument is wack sauce, Paris.
Barack Obama's gonna be labeled a lot of things from here on out. The road will be no easier for him without Hillary. It doesn't matter so long as he controls the message by drowning out the negativity with something McCain and the GOP lack: a good, strong vision for America.
Then on the night of November 4th, they'll be labeling him president-elect Obama. That's all that matters.
August 18, 2008 6:54 PM | Reply | Permalink
You forget people like me, fervent Obama supporters, who would turn on him definitively if he attached his fortunes (and, more importantly, those of the country) to the Clintons.
August 18, 2008 7:08 PM | Reply | Permalink
You'd become a PUMA? What's that like? I never met one before.
August 18, 2008 7:35 PM | Reply | Permalink
You must be kidding. The clintons have repeatedly said in one way or another that obama wasn't qualified to be president. How on earth could he put them on the ticket? Also, the dump truck load of clinton garbage would bury the campaign. It would be a mcbush landslide.
Send the clintons to timbuktu to rally the americans overseas vote until november. No dual clinton vp.
August 18, 2008 6:45 PM | Reply | Permalink
Are there any recent polls (last 7-14 days) listing Barack w/different veep prospects in battleground states?
August 18, 2008 6:37 PM | Reply | Permalink
Yeah, here's the latest Gallup results:
Obama/Clinton: win
Obama/Anybody Else: lose
August 18, 2008 6:42 PM | Reply | Permalink
Which was conducted among 68 self-identified PUMAs. Clinton won't be the pick namely because of the scorched earth campaign she ran from March until June. It was her decision and she (and her supporters) have to live with the consequences. C'est la vie.
Survey USA was the only outfit polling different VPs and they stopped shortly after they started.
August 18, 2008 6:53 PM | Reply | Permalink
Consequences? To get off before the train wreck is consequences? I sure hope you know what you're talking about for once.
August 18, 2008 7:37 PM | Reply | Permalink
I thought I smelled shit....
August 18, 2008 7:50 PM | Reply | Permalink
Mark Halperin vs. Matt Drudge.
Battle of the douchecocks.
August 18, 2008 6:40 PM | Reply | Permalink
It WON'T be Hillary.
August 18, 2008 6:41 PM | Reply | Permalink
Oh btw did anyone catch ABCNews' Pulitzer Prize winning concern troll piece on Dem leaders being 'uneasy' with Obama's strategy thus far?
Oh, Jake Tapper may be a sexy ass fox but a tool to rival David Gregory nonetheless.
August 18, 2008 6:45 PM | Reply | Permalink
Tyler, do you want to be a pundit when you grow up?
I'd sure hire you as a commentator if I ran CNN.
August 18, 2008 7:36 PM | Reply | Permalink
But (crucial information) I don't.
August 18, 2008 7:36 PM | Reply | Permalink
Drudge, Halperin, and Nagourney all in one post.
That's a hat-trick of misinformation!
August 18, 2008 6:49 PM | Reply | Permalink
Yes and all three suck!
Ben Smith also sucks!
August 18, 2008 6:58 PM | Reply | Permalink
Does anyone else consider it annoying that Matt Drudge, who (in the last twenty odd years) has been correct exactly one more time than Billy Kristol (who has never been correct), is considered a minor deity by the USofAian press?
I am ticked off the TPM wasted electrons on this. Sigh . . . I hate slow news days.
August 18, 2008 6:51 PM | Reply | Permalink
Another interesting tidbit is that McCain is planning a big rally in Ohio the day after the Dems convention and wanted somewhere that could seat 10,000 people. That HAS to be the VP roll out you'd think right? Now unless he just wants to give Ohio some love with his VP pick no matter who it is, otherwise wouldn't that signify Rob Portman?
August 18, 2008 7:02 PM | Reply | Permalink
Yep and that makes sense. Good analysis.
August 18, 2008 7:04 PM | Reply | Permalink
Here's my question, why does he think he can draw 10M people? What's the most he's ever drawn? My guess is less than a thousand. Now he's claiming ten times that amount? And do you think he can pull it off? I don't. Hell, they are going to surround him with people at the convention so that he doesn't look small at that the convention.
Just a bunch of hype if you ask me.
August 18, 2008 7:04 PM | Reply | Permalink
The question is how much street money will he have to pay to draw the crowd. Money talks. However, with the environment in ohio, he might not have enough cash to pull it off.
August 18, 2008 7:07 PM | Reply | Permalink
He does need to burn through all of the money raised in July and August....
August 18, 2008 7:11 PM | Reply | Permalink
There you go. I am willing to bet that they are spending a ton of cash on the event and are planning it already. Maybe they'll give away free steak dinners or something. He still will have a tough time drawing 10k though, unless he's paying some major coin. However, the crowd won't be all that great no matter how much mcbush pays.
August 18, 2008 7:17 PM | Reply | Permalink
The single DEM ticket that will have me considering pulling the lever for a non-DEM ticket is a Barak Obama/Ms Hillary McInsane ticket. While McCain, the Republican, NEEDs to lose . . . The Queen of the Clintoids NEEDs to sit this election cycle out.
Side Note: It remains likley that Obama's V.P. choice was made a year ago and the campaign is waiting for any potential bad news to fall out of the sky.
V.P. choice, like poll chasing, remains one of the most useless things that passes for news during any election cycle.
August 18, 2008 7:12 PM | Reply | Permalink
Amen. Amen. Amen.
August 18, 2008 7:39 PM | Reply | Permalink
just keep your cell phones on and near you at all times this week.
August 18, 2008 7:16 PM | Reply | Permalink
http://www.nytimes.com/2008/08/19/us/politics/19veep.html?_r=1&hp&oref=slogin
NAGOURNEY/ZELENY ARTICLE ON OBAMA'S VP
August 18, 2008 7:26 PM | Reply | Permalink
Yawn. Nagourney cracks me up. Bottom line, it will be sometime this week. What a scope for the times. I think that that would be a safe bet.
August 18, 2008 7:32 PM | Reply | Permalink
Greg, the paper DOES say he's picked a running mate.
"Mr. Obama’s advisers said he reached his decision while on vacation in Hawaii."
August 18, 2008 7:33 PM | Reply | Permalink
I could live with Biden or Kaine. I think Biden is a more effective attack dog, but then again, I've never really seen Kaine in action.
Byah just doesn't cut the mustard to me.
August 18, 2008 7:34 PM | Reply | Permalink
Bet you a lunch, it's none of the above.
August 18, 2008 7:37 PM | Reply | Permalink
Never seen him attack? Then watch this 94 seconds and BEHOLD AN ATTACK against none other than Rove. This shit we NEED!
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=385x170848
August 18, 2008 7:42 PM | Reply | Permalink
Thanks for that.
August 18, 2008 7:48 PM | Reply | Permalink
I'd like Tim Kaine.
August 18, 2008 7:35 PM | Reply | Permalink
So do I. But the question is: how many of us are there?
August 18, 2008 7:53 PM | Reply | Permalink
I was impressed with him on MTP. I'd be happy with him.
August 18, 2008 9:01 PM | Reply | Permalink
My projection....if the three choices are correct, then I would go with Kaine. Obama and Kaine seem comparable in style and I would like a governor being a heartbeat away from the presidency.
August 18, 2008 8:02 PM | Reply | Permalink
In theory, yes - just not a zero like Tim Kaine, please.
August 18, 2008 8:10 PM | Reply | Permalink
Ah coooome oooon!
I had goten all excited and stuff.
You know what? Screw it! im staying excited.
August 18, 2008 7:41 PM | Reply | Permalink
Obama accidentally sent me the text message early.
I know who it is, but I can't say...
August 18, 2008 7:43 PM | Reply | Permalink
I got it too.
Were you as surprised as I was to see "Lieberman" on my phone?
August 18, 2008 8:06 PM | Reply | Permalink
I think it's sort of silly that the VP candidate doesn't know yet. Why not give them a day or two to sit on it and get completely comfortable with the idea.
August 18, 2008 8:04 PM | Reply | Permalink
Of course the vp nominee knows. He or she has to do a speech and get ready to go campaigning. I would say the nominee, the speech writers, and the obama inner circle know. The ones who didn't get it won't find out until right before the announcement.
August 18, 2008 8:08 PM | Reply | Permalink
As David Gergen once pointed out on CNN, Michelle and others in the Obama camp believe that Hillary as a VP would probably have Barack eliminated so she could become President (since she could not patiently wait until 2016 to run when she'd be 68). Peggy Noonan wrote in the WSJ that a VP Hillary would surely poison Barack's organic tea in the White House.
August 18, 2008 8:05 PM | Reply | Permalink
Who the fuck cares.
Obama will announce.
You'll all draw wood.
Two days of Obamic orgasms.
TenaX will cry at the sight of them.
Then the explanations and excuses for Obama will resume.
And after the Mile-Hile Hipsterfest McCain will announce.
And the polls will still be even.
Who the fuck cares.
August 18, 2008 8:13 PM | Reply | Permalink
Are we bitter?
August 18, 2008 8:20 PM | Reply | Permalink
I dunno. Are you?
August 18, 2008 8:21 PM | Reply | Permalink
From your tone and your choice of words you seem to care a lot.
August 18, 2008 8:26 PM | Reply | Permalink
Well, in the sense that it will offer new comedy material, I suppose I'm interested.
August 18, 2008 8:28 PM | Reply | Permalink
That was completely worthless. Thanks NYTimes. Slow news day, indeed.
August 18, 2008 8:20 PM | Reply | Permalink
Off topic. Anybody see those wecansolveit ads on the cable news shows. I really like them. Very well made and powerful. The bottom line is renewable clean energy in 10 years. I don't know if that's possible, but I like the ads.
There is another source of energy that doesn't get alot of play, which I think is an awesome idea. Drop turbines in the gulf stream. It constantly flows at a pretty high rate of speed. Why not do it?
August 18, 2008 8:27 PM | Reply | Permalink
The Mayor here is planning that for the Golden Gate Bridge. Decent tidal swings and wave action. Apparently not cost effective though. But hey, who cares, it sounds kewl.
August 18, 2008 8:30 PM | Reply | Permalink
Uh, I wasn't talking about the golden gate wave action. I can see were it wouldn't be that efficient near shore. However, they are experimenting with dropping turbines in the gulf stream. It's a heck of alot more powerful.
By the way, I don't care if it sounds kewl. The issue is generating power efficiently, cost effectively, and getting us off of oil and carbon fuels. If in the short term it takes a substantial investment, so be it. Long term it will pay off.
August 18, 2008 8:37 PM | Reply | Permalink
Those turbines could also alter the Gulf Stream (and the Golf one too, for that matter.) It needs some careful modeling.
August 18, 2008 9:05 PM | Reply | Permalink
Really? I find that hard to believe. I guess it's possible, but I just don't see it. Basically, what they are experimenting with is dropping turbines from raft structures floating on top of the gulf stream. I don't see how that would alter the flow, but I guess anything is possible.
August 18, 2008 9:27 PM | Reply | Permalink
The turbines work by converting some of the kinetic energy of the water into electricity. This means that the water has less kinetic energy after flowing through the turbine, i.e. it will travel (very slightly) slower unless otherwise affected. Depending on the overall reduction, as well as other factors the main one of which is the potentially altered temperature levels of the water (which are one of the reasons for currents to begin with) and other effects of the turbulence, there may be consequences.
For example, we can hypothesise that a significant turbine farm could shorten the stream's effective area by a couple kilometres; this would then affect that area by--for example; there are infinite possibilities here--causing a flow of cooler water into it. This then in turn may launch a cycle of changes rippling from that point onward: the cooler water can cause smaller currents to form (which can then in turn eat away from the stream), one must take into account the solar energy expended to heat the cooler water and how this affects the weather systems in the area. Then there is the sea life. Conceivably some organism could migrate and displace another etc. There would be millions of small events taking place in some reasonably small timeframe and their cumulative effect could be serious.
I mean, it is probably safe enough to build such turbines in some modest amount. But some brainy folks need to figure out what that is--and how it plays with the dozens of other small changes around the oceans. For all I know, any change in the currents could disturb the peace of the good citizens of R'lyeh.
August 18, 2008 10:15 PM | Reply | Permalink
I get it, but I would think that the impact is virtually non-existent. We have to do something and virtually anything that we do will have a cause and effect, such as the effect of polluting the seas and atmosphere and world from carbon emissions. Just hypothesizing, don't you think the impact from carbon shipping, which is inefficient in itself, pollution and emissions is far greater than the sea turbines?
August 18, 2008 10:34 PM | Reply | Permalink
In case you or anyone is interested. Here is a piece on the turbine thing. Really interesting. I was wrong about the raft thing. The turbines are moored to the sea floor with bouys at the surface. Fascinating.
http://www.npr.org/templates/story/story.php?storyId=16713781
August 18, 2008 9:45 PM | Reply | Permalink
Strange to find myself basically agreeing with foguDuex.
This is an one issue contest this year . . . No Republican pResident in 2009. VeeP means zip . . . No matter who it is . . . including Senator Clinton and her boy-clone Bayh.
August 18, 2008 8:29 PM | Reply | Permalink
Yeah, but, we're talking about a young, charismatic black man who is going to be president (which is awesome).
If he is, totally hypothetically, somehow incapacitated, Obama's choice for VP will be president. Let's choose someone good.
August 19, 2008 9:43 AM | Reply | Permalink
Don't believe everything you read in the New York Times.
VP gonna be Chet Edwards of Texas.
August 18, 2008 8:44 PM | Reply | Permalink
Henry Waxman for V.P.!
August 18, 2008 8:50 PM | Reply | Permalink
Unrelated but important:
http://media.photobucket.com/image/mccain%20bush%20cake/Xneeohcon/bush_hurricane_cake.jpg?o=2
Send it to everyone...
PD: Is going to be Biden. Everything fits. Just read his statement on Georgia. I'm fine with it.
August 18, 2008 9:09 PM | Reply | Permalink
Oh, you mean the guy who last week was saying how wonderful McCain is? I don't think so.
Feingold is great at being the really liberal Dem maverick who takes the idealistic liberal positions. A good leader of thoughts; not so good at leading people or movements.
August 18, 2008 9:13 PM | Reply | Permalink
I reeeaaaallllyyy hope it is none of those three, both because not of them really appeal to me, and because I really want the prognosticators to be completely wrong, and for it to be someone they hadn't suspected. I'm so sick of the veepstakes questions.
August 18, 2008 9:27 PM | Reply | Permalink
Olbermann's Special Comment on McCain:
http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/3036677/#26279420
August 18, 2008 9:50 PM | Reply | Permalink
From the front page - Rep. Lewis doesn't have a clue why McCain keeps mentioning him, and hasn't had any relationship in the 22 years they've been in Government and McCain doesn't consult with him now or ever.
And this was from one of the questions both candidates were fed before hand. So given the time to think about the question he names Gen Petraus, Meg Whitman and Rep. Lewis.
Is Lewis the only black man McCain knows? Did Whitman win the paper-rocks-scissors match with Carly Fiorina? And Petraus is one of the brilliant military leaders of all time?
August 18, 2008 10:18 PM | Reply | Permalink
The Petreaus bull really sticks in my craw. He is not even in the top 100 of all time and we don't live in a military dictatorship, at least officially. I personally don't give a shit what petreaus has to say on a strategic level. Tactical yes, strategic no. Where in the hell is our diplomacy and strategic involvement in iraq and the region as a whole? It's non-existent. We are just supposed to blindly follow a military officer who wrote the thousandth book on counter-insurgency, which may or may not work. Who the f*ck cares? I sure don't.
August 18, 2008 10:39 PM | Reply | Permalink
Okay if it's as early as Wednesday, well then that has to be Kaine. I mean you're not going to go to Virginia and name Bayh or Biden. Unless it;s just they NYT reading the tea leaves and seeing that since Obama is in Virginia and Kaine is a finalist, if Kaine was the pick, the news would break on Wednesday. However if Obama leaves Virginia on Wednesday without an announcement, then you can effectively cross him off the list, and since Bayh seems to be a netroots non-starter, that would mean Biden.
I'm feeling Kaine now. It was described somewhere that Obama's head says Biden but his heart says Kaine.
August 18, 2008 11:18 PM | Reply | Permalink
Webb, or someone that is a surprise. I don't think it's kaine or biden. They both emphasize an alleged obama "problem." Also, forget about bayh. I'm still hoping for webb, but I'd bet the farm on none of the three alleged front runners.
August 18, 2008 11:42 PM | Reply | Permalink
nothins gonna happen for a couple days.
they just came out with this news to change the subject from obama's poor showing at the saddleback forum.
August 19, 2008 1:36 AM | Reply | Permalink
Because it definitely won't be anyone on any MSM "short list":
Most likely: Wes Clark
Possible: Bob Nelson
Dark Horse Liberal Heartthrob: Russ Feingold
August 19, 2008 7:14 AM | Reply | Permalink
Bill Nelson. Or Bob Graham. Hard to tell in Florida.
August 19, 2008 8:30 AM | Reply | Permalink
Correct.
Chet Edwards of Texas.
August 19, 2008 9:31 AM | Reply | Permalink
Not Biden, he wants to retire as Sec State.
Nor will Obama pick any other Senator or Washington Insider.
And he needs a woman.
So it is simple.
Kathleen Sebelius, early adopter who has already proved her value and abilities in the primaries, good solid midwesty (nothing exotic there!), an executive, Washington outsider, and oh yeah, she's a woman. Older white bread sorta woman!
She has all the advantages of HRC but none of the baggage.
A warm motherly figure to counterbalance BadBoy Barack.
Talk about reassuring to those older white voters!
And PUMA wannabe's are going to oppose her?
As to the National Security card well that's a hand Obama's (and surrogates like Biden) gotta win for himself.
People are not going to think (as but one example) "Oh we'll be safe 'cause Wes Clark won't let Obama nuke Russia!".
Nope, Americans have to believe that Obama is a safe choice for Commander in Chief.
We all know that, right?
Thus the struggle to make it an Economy election and to paint McCain as Dr. Strangelove.
So Sebelius it is and I'm giving 5 to 1 odds.
August 19, 2008 7:44 AM | Reply | Permalink