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McCain Just After 9/11: "Next Up, Baghdad!"

A bunch of folks have pointed out already that yesterday's long New York Times piece on John McCain's response to 9/11 is really, really good.

With McCain today questioning Obama's judgment on Iraq, this nugget from the Times piece is really worth flagging -- it highlights very vividly just how eager McCain was to go to war with Iraq in the days after the terror attacks:

Within hours, Mr. McCain, the Vietnam War hero and famed straight talker of the 2000 Republican primary, had taken on a new role: the leading advocate of taking the American retaliation against Al Qaeda far beyond Afghanistan. In a marathon of television and radio appearances, Mr. McCain recited a short list of other countries said to support terrorism, invariably including Iraq, Iran and Syria...

Within a month he made clear his priority. "Very obviously Iraq is the first country," he declared on CNN. By Jan. 2, Mr. McCain was on the aircraft carrier Theodore Roosevelt in the Arabian Sea, yelling to a crowd of sailors and airmen: "Next up, Baghdad!"

Recall that a key McCain campaign message is that he hates war and that he, unlike the man he would replace, knows its costs and approaches it with great reluctance. In that context, video of this moment referenced by The Times would be gold.


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Supporting the Iraq War is the original sin. It's the judgment that Obama can use to trump McCain. It boggles my mind that he hasn't been using it much these last couple months.

It's time to re-visit that original decision, for Obama to explain why supporting it (cheerleading for it, leading the way to make sure everyone voted for it, the way McCain did) is a disqualifying moment for McCain...and tying it back to the economy.

http://strategy08.wordpress.com

Obama didn't even phrase his Iraq war opposition that well during the faith forum. That was somewhat disappointing.

Barack Obama's been nothing but a big damn disappointment for weeks now.

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That's a bit extreme. His messaging and media strategy have been. His grass-roots and organizing efforts have not been.

http://strategy08.wordpress.com

That's what I like Obama's campaign, they're great on organizing and grassroots efforts, but they need massive work on their media strategy and messaging. Even Josh pointed that there's been a lack of consistent thematic attacks against McCain:

The lack of any consistent lines of attack against McCain is becoming palpable.
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The only thing that gives me hope is the fact that there is no way the Obama camp has missed this message now. It's been communicated loud and clear via many channels to them.

http://strategy08.wordpress.com

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I totally agree and I think its too late now.

He wasn't ready for this and he shuold have been.

The Clintons were right. He doesn't have what it takes to go up against these guys.

Oh yawn.
Clinton would get her ass kicked if she was the nominee.

And if Obama loses, a lot of the blame will fall squarely on the antics of the Clintons for not getting behind Obama.

There will be nobody to blame but Barack Obama.

Don't bet on it.
If Obama loses, the African-americans will rightly bolt the Clintons or anyone associated with them in droves, and so will people like me.
For the Clintons to be viable, Obama has to win, if he doesn't, they're finished.

Yes he does; Obama has discredited Corsini of swiftboater fame. Missed it, did ya?

get over it. You get what you voted for. I live in michigan so I voted for uncommitted, which basically meant I voted for Obama. Im happy with the way Obama campaigns. They have hit back hard with ads targeting specific states. The faith forum was great. If you wanted a vicious candidate then you should have voted for Chris Dodd... ;-)

Correct, correct, correct! McCain said we'd win in three weeks! WHERE IS THAT IN THE CAMPAIGN?!

Ugh.

Add it to the pile of shit the media won't cover.

Exactly. Let's talk about how uppity Obama is. Or how not ahead he is in the polls. That seems to be more fun. Or requires less journalistic talents.

It's pretty obvious based on the track record that McCain is a big supporter of the so-called Leeden Doctrine:

Every ten years or so, the United States needs to pick up some small crappy little country and throw it against the wall, just to show the world we mean business.

That partly helps to explain Kosovo and Iraq; war for the sake of showing dominance. And that needs to be driven home - as an obvious fatal flaw of the neocon worldview - by Obama.

http://pufferfish.typepad.com/

Please oh please let there be video of him shouting "Next up Baghdad," and that can be followed by the clip of George saying "Bring it on."

Exactly. That should be used to the fullest extent possible. I've given up on the idea of being positive will lead to success. Attach McCain to Bush in every way on the occupation and the economy. Same disastrous foreign policy and same calamatous fiscal and monetary policy.

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Politics as a Rambo movie. Haven't people had enough of this crap? And anybody who even comes close to being a believer in the Ledeen Doctrine - and I believe McCain is one of these people - needs to be kept as far away from the Oval Office as possible. As I'm sure we all remember, McCain was the neo-cons' boy until he lost the nomination in 2000. They only settled on Bush because they had no other choice and got lucky because the guy has a daddy complex and a childish desire to play cowboy.

"Politics as a Rambo movie. Haven't people had enough of this crap?"

No, they haven't. In fact Americans never will.

And there's no candidate who says Rambo more than John McCain.

Hopefully the Democrats will learn their lesson the next time they choose a candidate.

Just what in the hell is up with all of this crazy talk? It's fucking August, not November 5th. Obama hasn't lost the election yet!

Settle down a bit, maybe? Yeah I'm disappointed by his complacency just as much as the rest of you but it's ridiculous to assume it's all over already.

Its August. They're Democrats. Happens every four years with mind-numbing consistency.

From the very tippy top of the anonynous "doners" and "strategists" and "senior officials familiar with the campaign" quoted in the Wapo down to the rank and file, Democrats always get themselves wound up into a state of complete panic and recrimination in August.

Indeed, Obama's own supporters were wallowing in exactly the same angst orgy last August.

And, of course, none of them consider the possibility that the Republican rank and file's ability to take a little adversity and pushback from the other side without dissolving into a big greasy puddle of Technicolor hysteria might be one of things that affect undecided voters decision making.

Unfortunately, the instaneous feedback they get on blogs only makes it worse.

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Is the Ledeen Doctrine that every 10 years "we" should throw some crappy country against the wall to show we mean business?
Add to that the Friedman Doctrine, AKA "Suck.On.This."

I think it's an interesting idea to keep the foreign policy topic but try to throw the ball back at McCain.

I'm just not sure it's a smart idea or that it's going to work. McCain OWNS national security now. For Obama to push back on him with Iraq will mean only one thing: SURGE IS WORKING. And he won't have anything to say.

Obama would only have to say that dozens or more of US solders are dying every month.

The status quo of American soldiers dying every day, while the US is slowly bankrupted, is not "success". Does McCain think the 4000+ dead soldiers is acceptable?

come observer, this is politics. McCain is saying that Obama can't be trusted to protect Americans. He opposed the war, then didn't do anything to stop it. He opposed the surge on the grounds that violence will increase and now refuses to admit it's working. Your line of argument will only work if Obama can keep it to the human cost. The problem is it will be impossible for him to prevent McCain from turning it his around everytime to "can you trust Obama on protecting America"/

This is a BS and GOP talking point (those two acronymns should be synonyms in today's America). The surge was to buy CALM for the Iraqis to solve their politcal problems--it only WORKED if we are now able to pull our asses out while the Iraqis take care of their own damned problems--better known as governing themselves.

Your silly assertion of the "surge worked" in the current environment in Iraqi only supports what McCain wants--American in Iraq for 100 years so we can keep that damned surge working. Do you understand the distinction or have you been warped too much by the GOP noise machine?

You can keep insisting on how things are. It doesn't change anything about how they are used in campaigning and/or how the public perceives them. But you obviously prefer to be "right" rather than be "ahead". Suit yourself, smart pants.

Obama's not ahead?

Yeah, whatever.

Why is it that every time one of you confronts somebody like lalo you end up throwing your hands in the air and saying "whatever?" Is he above your pay grade? He's just a guy in a big hat. Tell him why McCain can't win with that CIC argument even though he's killing Obama in the polls on who can be trusted. I'm putting a blog post together on that question. Give me some input.

The answer to "the surge is working" is painfully obvious. When America needed aMAverick to stand up to Dick and Scooter's lie machine, John McCain put on his cheerleader skirt and beat the war drum. He wasn't just a little bit wrong, he was out in front with pom-poms worng. For a guy who is supposed to hate war, he seems to like getting into them. He's ready to put NATO troops into a conflict with Russia, when we way more need Russia to contain Iran. That's not smart foriegn policy, that's knee-jerk nuts.

That ought to be an argument Obama can win. I just think he doesn't want to be doing much arguing until the convention is over.

Any fool could have told you that if we buy off some of the opposition groups, pave the streets with heavily-armed Americans, and wall off Sunni from the Shia (or allow one group or the other to be run out of town), that the American death rate would drop.

That was not what the surge is all about. It was all about giving the Iraqis a chance to get their political act together. But: no election law, no oil law, no solution to the Kurd problem, continued assassinations (including the deputy leader of the so-called "awakening" group so recently allied with us), Sadrists still very powerful and threatening to resume hostilities, etc. etc.

I take the recent Republican efforts to re-start the Cold War as a confession that their Iraq policy will not succeed, and that they understand the American people are no longer buying the "War on Terror" as a reason to keep those gangsters in office.

"The surge is working!!!"

My reply: "Hey JM, congrats for doing something after you drove the bus into the lake. But you don't get to be the bus driver 'cause YOU DROVE THE BUS INTO THE LAKE!!!"

The man never met a war he didn't like. He "knows how to win war"? Perhaps in his nightmares of humiliation in Hanoi.

The man is obviously mental

The media only covers what either campaign pushes. McCain is pushing a lot more on the media and thus they're getting the coverage they want. The Media has 24 hour/7days a week coverage they need to fill and "No Drama Obama" doesn't fill the news. McCain is giving them Britney and Paris, his smear web ads, complete access to surrogates ready to discuss any and all issues. Obama is always on the issues, and the issues don't pull the ratings.

Here's my post a MONTH ago, explaining why the Obama media team SUCKS.

http://www.dailykos.com/story/2008/7/15/8561/21079/775/551458

You're not alone in making that point. Took Josh Marshall about a few months to notice too. DailyKos, in my view, is entirely about cheer-leading, so I'm not that surprised.

Lalo, even though I've disagreed with you on many points, how do you think the Obama campaign should go on the offensive?

(1) Swallow pride and get hard-hitting surrogates out. Specifically, take Clark from under the bus, clean him up and send him out. Put Kerry under the bus instead, if you need someone down there.

(2) Make up with the Clintons NOW. Beg Hillary to take the "3am" call on McCain's healthcare plan. Beg Bill to take the "3am" call on McCain's economic plan.

(3) Make the Clintons the omni-present reminders of the good old 90s to all those bitter gun-loving voters and women. Take the "mantle". If you really hate the Clintons, you can get rid of them AFTER you get elected.

(4) Go back to big uplifting speeches on becoming our better selves, about not being afraid, blah blah blah. Celebrity meme cannot be taken down anymore, but it can be neutralized. Get back on TV and into headlines with big moving emotional appeals. Let the surrogates do the barks and biting.

You make very good points here, and they definitely provide some fodder for thought.

I am particularly annoyed with the fact that he doesn't have one single good surrogate. None!! That's not right. He can't afford being constantly on defense. He has to stay positive and most importantly keep voters feel as emotional as he did in the primaries.

I agree with all your points.

So two of the four are for Clinton to rescue Obama. Ha!
Fuck you. At least that's what Hillary and Bill will say.

The days of symbolic speeches persuading the the swing vote are over. Trite, boring, preachy. The Obamic "new politics" are dead. Obama will attempt to morph into an old-style politician and fail.

Obama will never, ever swallow his pride. His false modesties cannot hide his true arrogance and self-importance.

When he says it's not about him, it's about him.

Clinton '08 or '12

Fogu, shut up. it's not about the clinton's at all.

Hey, you made the points that he needs the Clinton.

Eat your own words.

I made several different points. And no points about the Clintons being too proud, too mean or too cool for Obama.

They're too smart to get sucked into Obama's failed campaign. They are looking down the road. They'll be there for the photo ops and say a few polite things. They know he's doomed and Hillary still wants to be president.

"They are looking down the road. "

They have to look down the road, Obama handed them their collective asses.

Do you not find it ironic at all that as a Bill Clinton supporter you're complaining about someone else being arrogant and self-important?

Who's supporting Bill? Not me.

Two for the price of one, as they so proudly said....

We should be so lucky, again.

I thought you weren't supporting Bill?

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"Obama will never, ever swallow his pride. His false modesties cannot hide his true arrogance and self-importance."
--fogu2

In "straight talk," fogu2, you are saying Obama is "uppity." This is how the McCain campaign is playing the race card. Do you believe for a second that McCain is not arrogant and self-important.

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I agree with all of these, and wouldn't be surprised if all of this came to pass, after Labor Day.

Given that Obama has been running positive national ads, negative local ads that fly under the radar, and has been out of the spotlight for an entire week, I'm not surprised that the race appears to be tightening.

But then, I'm a cynical sort who never thought that this would be a blowout election for a Democratic nominee, no matter who the nominee was, as long as John McCain was the Republican.

McCain has 15 years of myth serving as a foundation for any coverage of him. It was going to be tough no matter who the Dem candidate was.

Now, had Romney somehow managed to squeak in, that would be a different story.

The biggest coup that Obama and his campaign accomplished was discrediting of Corsini and his book, Obama Nation. The campaign responded to this book quickly, professionally, and engaged the media in the actual discrediting of the guy and a book full of lies. Obama also went to Saddleback and got out the damned message for the 1000th time that he is a Christian and he knows his Bible. Let's also tie in the CBN interview with Brody where Obama says, yet again, that there are LIES being put out about him wanting to withhold life-saving treatment from infants in Illions--a lie.

These are very important things that Obama and his campaign are doing. Instead, you are being led around by McCain and are simply ignoring what Obama and his campaign are actually doing with real threats (Corsini) and with opportunities to, yet again, explain Obama to particular audiences where the opportunity may not come again in the campaing.

So, yes, I have very little patience with analysis that only focuses on one tiny area of a campaign. McCain is doing a grand job providing fodder for future commercials and debate points when more people are paying attention and the point gets across with devastating accuracy.

I agree with the crux of it. Obama needs to hit hard. He should have been way ahead in polls. I never thought he could loose but who knows now. His campaign comes across as week. All the 527s that he asked to shut down, should be resurrected.

Yes, yes, yes, and yes.

Include into the mix the following repeated ad nauseum: "John McCain is a liar and a neoconservative."

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If you're talking about a national campaign, I agree with you.

But this isn't a national campaign, no matter how much the talking hairdoes on TeeVee work to convince all of us that it is.

We're only seeing the national results, the national headlines blared by Drudge, its imitator, Halperin, Politico, and the cable news shows.

Obama just spent a week out of the spotlight. I know of no other campaign that did something like that and still wound up in the same position as when the vacation started.

BS again. McCain is being outrageous with his surrogates whining a big one to get media attention and the media in their quest for the next great race and confrontation is all too willing to oblige. This exact same thing happened in the Democratic primary--the MSM declared Hillary was a competitor and she was not.
The Clintons stood on their heads to get MSM attention and they got it. And she LOST.

Obama has this campaign well in hand and needs cool heads among his supporters not the "sky is falling" chicken littles. Think back on the primary and get some confidence in Obama and in his strategy.

Geesh.

OK, Mr. Cool Head. Exactly what's wrong with trying to avoid a potential Kerry re-election while there is still time?

Miss the discrediting of Corsini, did you? You know, that Obama Nation on the top of the NY Times bestseller list? Do you actually believe it was just CHANCE that the MSM discredited the guy thoroughly?

Kerry's primary swift-boater kneed and you missed it?

This was a heck of a lot more important than stopping the idiot McCain who is giving all sorts of stupid statements for the debates and for "last week of the campaign" ads in needed markets.

Look around and find out what Obama has been doing in the times you think he's been sleeping.

I told Pubicola it was about him/her. I think it's about you too...

http://www.openleft.com/showDiary.do?diaryId=7574

Fellow Obama supporters, enough with the handwringing. We nearly passed out from hyperventilation when the Clinton campaign got Samantha Power's resignation and HRC began talking about the "Commander-in-Chief threshold." Obama's campaign steered him through that, through Reverend Wright, through "Obama's not a Muslim, as far as I know," the Somali garb photo, and everything else. His campaign is being run by professionals.

Here is what I think is going to happen:
1) The campaign is going to keep their responses fairly restrained this week. Doesn't mean they won't strike back, but it won't be as shrill as McCain's campaign is right now.
2) They are going to go into the convention with a lot of positive energy. That's an absolute key in cementing the narrative: Obama is an all-American family man, not the oh-so-feared angry black man (even if his anger is directed at an imbecilic war-monger who is slandering him).
3) VP selection.
4) Obama campaign, VP included, kicks in the media offensive into gear.
5) As the campaign heats up, Obama raises over $100 million in September.

On that last point, I stopped donating for a few months after the primary because I had donation-fatigue and nothing was really pissing me off in the way that Clinton's attacks had. Now that McCain is ramping up the sleaze machine, I'm starting to get angry again and my money has once again started flowing to Obama. All my donations up until now have been for $50-$100, and I gave $50 last month. Watching McCain try to re-ignite the cold war, call Obama treasonous, and refer to "President Putin of Germany" has me thinking it may be time to drop $1,000 into the Obama campaign.

Yes, we can afford to give McCain another month or two of headstart.

I don't know why Democrats are so afraid to appear angry. Howard Dean got screwed big time for his "primal scream" gaffe, and I still have no idea why. He would have made a great president! Now Obama is keeping his outrage under wraps so he won't seem like an "angry black man".

WTF!

Are we, the Democrats, not truly angry that we've lived through nearly 8 years of Republican tyranny? Are we not sick and tired of the same old hateful politics?! I'm mad as hell, and I don't care who knows it. I want Obama to get angry and swell up and show America that he isn't going to be the big sissy that Republicans infer he & all Democrats are.

I'm telling you, if Obama (who is the candidate I plan to vote for) doesn't stand up to John "The Maverick" McCain, then we will have ANOTHER 4-8 years to stew in our angry juices, because we'll have another crusty, old, Republican war-monger at the helm!

Then go out and tell your cubby-mates that--or your neighbors--or anyone you can grab. And start your conversation with this aggressive attitude.

I'll help with bail money, BTW.

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Well, it's obvious that neither Obama nor any of the other major Dems has enough of a spine to call McCain (or Bush/Cheney) on this, but it really couldn't have been more obvious from the beginning that Iraq was simply the wrong stinkin' country:

http://www.asecondlookatthesaudis.com

And how do the tough guys explain their willingness to let the nation most responsible for the rise of Al Qaeda and the attacks on 9/11 get away with it scot-free? I bet Tom Loeffler knows the answer.

To quote Steve Doocy of Fox and Friends fame:

"This...is...HUGE!"

By the way, here's what I'm referencing:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nw6LBbeXTww

McCain,s Georgian lobbyist was pre-war Iraq lobbyist.

Hogwash.....Did you people miss the Bush/Kerry election. They took a draft dodging coward and got him re-elected over a accual war hero. Obama better get up off his ass and get to gettin

Did you miss that Obama discredited Corsini and his book, Obama Nation? Also, Obama took every opportunity to appear before audiences where a significant number believe that he is not a Christian--those opportunies don't arise at a drop of a hat and may not arise again in this campaign.

It took fine work to disappear that book, you know.

McCain is burying himself and providing great fodder for the debates and late in the campaign ads (when McCain wil be short on funds and probably even more short-tempered than usual).

John McCain scares the heck out of me. He has said he would still go into Iraq today even if he knew then what he knows now. This tells me he has no problem with invading any country he sees fit. He has no problem with the go it alone strategy. He has no problem with fighting 2 or more wars at a time. He has no problem sending our troops anywhere in the world without the essential equipment, proper training, or proper exit strategy to get us out. This is what I hear when John McCain says the Iraq war was a good idea. If I were running Obama's campaign I would counter McCain's crap Obama doesn't want to win the Iraq war, with McCain has lost credibility when he claims He would repeat the same course the Bush doctrine says that invading Iraq was and still is a good thing. We have lived thru almost 8 years of Bush cowboy mentallity. We don't need 4 more years. I find it hard to believe how any American could fall for this crap that talking tough in a campaign means we will be safe. We are not safer today politically or with our economy. He knows nothing about the economy, so where I sit his whole presidency will be war, war, war. (bomb, bomb, bomb Iran).

Take your calm attitude and ask this question very calmly of your co-workers, family, friends, neighbors. Then listen to their responses. Stay calm in the conversation and get their key points. Perhaps you'll find that McCain's aggressiveness is not as popular as you suppose.

Sen John McShame seems to love 2 things:

1. Cute, young blonds

2. War

What a kick for a President he will be!

lol

Sign me up for the blondes.

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Another warmonger Arizona Senator running for president. Time to revisit the "Daisy Ad".
In your guts, you know he's nuts.
Extremism in the defense of John McCain is todays' vice.

To all the ney sayers who think Obama isn't doing enough...let me leave you with this...

ROPE-A-DOPE...

Reel in your opponent, absorb his best shots while he exhausts himself and then...put him on his back..

Be patient "my friends"...

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McCain has no ideas beyond the military. In April, he said his solution to America's education problems is to bring military people into schools. He calls it "Troops to Teachers"
http://www.boston.com/news/politics/politicalintelligence/2008/04/at_his_high_sch.html

I guess these worthies would be found in the diminishing percentage of our military who, in order to enlist, did not need waivers for misdemeanor or felony convictions, psychological prblems, or poor performance on standardized tests.

Why isn't the MSM covering stories like this? And how McCain has been conducting a shadow Russian foreign policy reminiscent of the Iraq Study Group cabal? Especially when one of his principle advisers has an egregious conflict of interest? Isn't that NEWS?!

Bu whining incessantly about Obama's allegedly favorable treatment, McCain has clearly bamboozled the brain-dead MSM into guilt-wracked prostration. Hey, so-called newspeople -- GROW UP AND DO YOUR JOBS!

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I am a big fan of Biden. I think Biden would shred McCain for sure.

Biden is so good that he was almost our nominee. Oh, wait.....

I'm not sure I agree that this was a good article at all.

While the substance of it-- McCain's war talk, the misdirection from Al Qaeda--speaks to his idiocy--I the article is framed remarkably uncritically. It repeats the "straight talk" bullshit, it subjectively chooses to characterize McCain in terms of being a war "hero" (which I still fail to see)rather than a corrupt Keating Five leftover (granted it could be ironic--but the info just isn't there to force that reading); this phrase: "the leading advocate of taking the American retaliation against Al Qaeda far beyond Afghanistan" leaves it implicit that there was actually AQ involvement in Iraq/Iran.

When it finally hits a critical graf, it's in terms of vague "critics" rather than a flat recognition that everything he said and advocated was at odds with reality. This is a McCain whitewash piece--it just depends on you not to know the facts, and invites readers to ignore them in favor of partisan perceptions.

The info may be damning, but it's still the bland Times left-right horse race style. It's shit.
-j

This thread is a cluster jerk. Obama has to get back to war or peace as the only real issue. If the voters decide they want to try a peaceful path to our future as a great power, Obama can win. If they decide they want to continue on the path of a military-industrial complex enabled foreign policy, McCain will win. The only way Obama can win now is to show the voters the difference between peace and war and become the candidate for peace. Even if he loses that way, we all will have won something at least.

I agree that he has to show that McCain will be the path of war and conflict. I don't think it should be the only issues, but it is one way to neutralize McCain's "strongest" issue.

Another in the list of things the corporate *#$%@s will avoid like the plague (which Obama and his campaign would have railed against, ala the tree in the forest):

http://thepage.time.com/2008/08/18/obama-team-blasts-mccain-fundraiser-with-ralph-reed/

McCain's support for the Iraq war isn't just the original sin noted above. It's also a great take-down line that I hope Obama is saving up for the debates. When McCain goes after Obama and says that he has never taken an unpopular position, Obama only needs to say: I opposed the Iraq war back when that was not a popular position. E tu?

Point, set, match.

This is important to get out. I never heard this before today but heard it from several sources today. This demonstrates why this man should not be in charge of our military. He was ready to go after Saddam Husesien and to war with Iraq with absolutely no cause, no suspicion of WMD's. He just wanted to go get them. He is a dangerous man.

Obama should be crucifying McCain over the latter's eagerness to go to war in, Iraq of all the unlikely benighted places. Why isn't this happening?

McCain said it would take "three weeks" to win. Only reason I know that is from reading the posters on this site. Why?!

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