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Poll Measures Public Attitudes Towards Obama's Denunciation Of Wright
Rasmussen has just released a poll gauging public attitudes towards Obama's recent break with Reverend Wright:
A Rasmussen Reports national telephone survey found that just 30% of the nation's Likely Voters believe Barack Obama denounced his former Pastor, Jeremiah Wright, because he was outraged. Most -- 58% -- say he denounced the Pastor for political convenience.
Rasmussen also says that "Democrats are evenly divided as to whether or not Obama was surprised by Wright's comments on Monday." Rasmussen adds that "just 36% of Democrats believe outrage was the motivation," but doesn't supply a number for the percentage of Dems who believe he was outraged.
The rest here.
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Greg, you have to do a piece on this:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sN_nQOHj__s.
This is more relevant than the most recent poll.
May 2, 2008 10:41 AM | Reply | Permalink
For some reason the link isn't working, here is the story;
http://www.dailykos.com/storyonly/2008/5/2/93316/53926/838/507664
May 2, 2008 10:43 AM | Reply | Permalink
Carville looks pretty jazzy in that cap.
May 2, 2008 10:52 AM | Reply | Permalink
Greg, the story is up on Drudge and ABC, you might as well do a post on it.
http://blogs.abcnews.com/politicalpunch/2008/05/clinton-informa.html
May 2, 2008 11:18 AM | Reply | Permalink
Oh, stop teasing him. You know he's not going to post a story.
May 2, 2008 11:22 AM | Reply | Permalink
He will. Greg has it in him to surprise you.
I bet right now he is scrambling to find out everything he can about Kantor and verify the video.
May 2, 2008 11:23 AM | Reply | Permalink
You know what? I don't think Greg or Eric ever did a post on Hillary's "God Bless Us Rich Folks" gaffe either. And it's not under the "featured videos" section (of course, her statements slamming Rev. Wright are). Greg and Eric, why don't you just give up the ghost and admit your bias? Afraid you'll lose readers? If the shoe were on the other foot and an Obama advisor said these things, there would be post after post ad nauseum (a la William Ayers). The '92 Kantor statements are now starting to leak out to the media so it would really be disingenuous for you NOT to do a post on it, wouldn't it? We expect to see something up about it today - it is newsworthy, regardless of how badly it looks for your girl, and we expect a little journalistic integrity here.
May 2, 2008 11:30 AM | Reply | Permalink
Okay Greg and Eric, now the following have stories on it:
http://wonkette.com/386548/what-clintons-people-really-think-about-indiana
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=132x5779149
http://reddit.com/info/6hxal/comments/
May 2, 2008 11:40 AM | Reply | Permalink
I'm still waiting to see the headline with the big Obama poll lead in NC, instead of the one up there now -- a poll that measures people's reactions to Obama's break from Wright.
May 2, 2008 11:28 AM | Reply | Permalink
since Steph being their man now, I'd've though ABC would hold out longer than TPM
May 2, 2008 11:27 AM | Reply | Permalink
silence from TPM.......
May 2, 2008 11:37 AM | Reply | Permalink
Thanks for posting this. Wow. People have no shame. Amazing. I hope this is all over the place, however, HRC will say it has nothing to do with her. Ms. Excuse.
May 2, 2008 11:40 AM | Reply | Permalink
The link WAS working earlier...
I watched that video once, passed it along to some others, then suddenly, voila, it won't load up.
Something's fishy here?
Maybe it was just getting traffic?
It sure was a piece of work, and it could not have been faked.
(posted below, also)
May 2, 2008 11:43 AM | Reply | Permalink
It's working again for me, it is just getting a lot of traffic right now. Drudge and daily kos and wonkette and now TPM (thanks to us posters, not to TPM itself) are all linking to the video.
It's gone viral in a spectacular fashion.
May 2, 2008 11:47 AM | Reply | Permalink
The fucking moron who posted the video has made it private, thank God.
May 2, 2008 1:27 PM | Reply | Permalink
Obama and Wright's hate of white folks is dividing the party.
He should drop out so we can win this time.
May 2, 2008 10:43 AM | Reply | Permalink
I think the Clinton camps hate of Idiana residents is more relevant. Calling Hoosers "worthless white niggars" is a tad more offensive than anything Obama or Wright have said.
May 2, 2008 10:45 AM | Reply | Permalink
I'd like to see Rasmussen do a survey of "Likely Voters" on Kantor's statements about Indiana voters (by the way, he happens to be a top advisor to the Clinton 08 campaign). That would be some poll, wouldn't it? ;)
May 2, 2008 10:50 AM | Reply | Permalink
You couldn't even do the poll without it looking like a push poll though.
May 2, 2008 10:56 AM | Reply | Permalink
check the video above your post
May 2, 2008 10:46 AM | Reply | Permalink
Obama hates his Mom? I'd say class level is at a low ebb.
May 2, 2008 10:47 AM | Reply | Permalink
LOL 707 LOL 707 LOL 707
May 2, 2008 11:46 AM | Reply | Permalink
By "we" you mean the Republicans, of course. Because they are the only ones who will "win this time" if Hillary is nominated.
May 2, 2008 11:15 AM | Reply | Permalink
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sN_nQOHj__s
May 2, 2008 11:20 AM | Reply | Permalink
I apologize to everyone on this thread for helping to fan these flames. This entire clip is a load of crap. I've watched the original, and I've read what Kantor and Pennebaker had to say. The clip is garbage.
May 2, 2008 1:30 PM | Reply | Permalink
http://www.politico.com/blogs/bensmith/0508/Pennebaker_Clip_Doctoered.html
May 2, 2008 1:31 PM | Reply | Permalink
"Hate of white folks," eh? Well at least he didn't call them this:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sN_nQOHj__s
May 2, 2008 11:25 AM | Reply | Permalink
(chuckling)
I might not agree with a lot of what you say, but that avatar is really funny. I'm sorry, I'm an Obama supporter, but I still think it's damned funny.
Still chuckling.
May 2, 2008 2:05 PM | Reply | Permalink
So if voters believe that it was political expedience, do they also believe that the rejection wasn't sincere?
May 2, 2008 10:43 AM | Reply | Permalink
Honestly, I don't think outrage was his main motivation, but I for one do still find him sincere. Now, all we need to do is find 100 more people and we have ourselves a poll!
May 2, 2008 11:33 AM | Reply | Permalink
Has Hillary ever denounced Mickey Kantor and his racist views? For 15 years since he called the people of Indiana 'sh*t' and 'white ni**ers', he's remained a close Clinton confidant. For decades, Hillary and Kantor have been close personal friends. Will she denounce him now? Why didn't Carville and Steph. tell Kantor he was out of line when he made the comments?
Link contains the video.
http://www.dailykos.com/storyonly/2008/5/2/93316/53926/838/507664
May 2, 2008 10:45 AM | Reply | Permalink
right on!
May 2, 2008 10:46 AM | Reply | Permalink
It doesn't seem Greg or Eric want to talk about this...
May 2, 2008 10:51 AM | Reply | Permalink
There's no way that this will appear as a post on TPM - it just ain't gonna happen.
May 2, 2008 10:53 AM | Reply | Permalink
What do you want to bet it will be among the first 10 comments on every thread they do today?
Except for the threads that happen between noon and one central time, I'll be at lunch then.
May 2, 2008 10:57 AM | Reply | Permalink
LOL!!!
May 2, 2008 11:14 AM | Reply | Permalink
The only way TPM (or the MSM for that matter) will report on this is if Reverend Wright appeared in the background of the video. THEN it would be newsworthy.
May 2, 2008 11:15 AM | Reply | Permalink
Actually Drudge now has it linked and ABC is reporting on it.
http://blogs.abcnews.com/politicalpunch/2008/05/clinton-informa.html
May 2, 2008 11:20 AM | Reply | Permalink
Good! I hope they give it as much airtime as they have the Reverend Wright debacle.
May 2, 2008 11:21 AM | Reply | Permalink
This is exactly why TPM will remain a second rate news site. They'd rather parrot the dictates of conventional media than prioritize groundbreaking stories of their own.
May 2, 2008 11:37 AM | Reply | Permalink
Kos currently has over 750 comments on the Kantor vid. *Someone* wants to discuss it...
May 2, 2008 11:22 AM | Reply | Permalink
Well...I'm not so sure now.
Someone emailed me an audio clip from the original movie with the sound increased.
It certainly doesn't sound like 'In the White House right now' like some are claiming, but it doesn't sound like the N-bomb is dropped either. What some are saying in the n-word sounds more like 'ticker'.
So, I'm now of the opinion that it is inaudible. I retract the previous comment. I jumped the gun, but it certainly sounded much like the Kos diarist described on my first several listens.
May 2, 2008 1:25 PM | Reply | Permalink
I just wish that rather than focus on distractions like Wright, we talked about what's happening to average families. Think about what this says about the state of our economy. When families are hawking their prized possessions for pennies on the dollar, the real economic shock is yet to come.
May 2, 2008 10:47 AM | Reply | Permalink
Wright won't just be a "distraction" in the fall if Obama is the nominee. The GOP will toot him for all he is worth, and it isn't just about race - if Obama had similar longstanding ties to a white preacher who said that same stuff about 9/11, McCain would get just as much mileage out of it.
Don't say Hagee is worse, because it doesn't matter - no one in either party or the media believes for a moment that Dems will hold McCain's feet to the fire with Catholic voters over that Scarlet Whore of Rome stuff.
The question for Obama isn't about the merits of the Wright issue, which are insignificant, but whether he can push back effectively, including keeping Wright from shoving his face in front of any more live TV cameras. If Obama can't push back in a Democratic primary, how the hell is he going to push back in the general election?
May 2, 2008 12:08 PM | Reply | Permalink
It would be most interesting to see what the percentages were of those who actually SAW the press conference, versus those who heard about it through the media.
May 2, 2008 10:47 AM | Reply | Permalink
Um, I see are unhinged about a video in 1992.
Nice try to divert from Wright but it has no legs.
The truth is Obama and Wright are dividing this party and you are doing too with this crap.
Like I said, his whole message of unity is a lie and you are proving it.
May 2, 2008 10:48 AM | Reply | Permalink
So pretty much whatever Clinton and her surrogates do and say is OK, right? You are a complete joke - the best thing about Obama getting the nomination will be that we don't have to read idiotic, delusional posts like yours anymore because hopefully you will go away.
May 2, 2008 10:52 AM | Reply | Permalink
It has nothing to do with Hillary.
A desperate attempt to smear her with another race card.
You folks are pathetic with your race cards.
It is you dividing the party.
Stop it or are you trying to lose?
May 2, 2008 10:58 AM | Reply | Permalink
You sound desperate.
Don't worry, I'm sure according to Hillary's advisors we are nothing more than "worthless white niggers."
May 2, 2008 11:01 AM | Reply | Permalink
Hey, she's had way MORE than a 20 year relationship with that guy. Do you expect me to believe she never heard those sentiments before? Reject and Denounce Hillary. Get right on it!
May 2, 2008 12:11 PM | Reply | Permalink
O honey - well maybe gotnolife will, but the rest I guarantee you will change nyms or not and come right back and troll for McWar.
You watch.
;)
May 2, 2008 11:10 AM | Reply | Permalink
Yes, Tena, you're right. But somehow it's more disheartening and downright aggravating to fight with people in your own party, you know? If they come back as McWar supporters, I'm ready for them and will fight with relish!!
;)
May 2, 2008 11:16 AM | Reply | Permalink
O god yes.
That's one reason I know some of these assholes are Repub trolls.
They're working that seam.
Like anything anyone does on a comments board is going to make that much difference in the real world.
The actual news about the Clintons is bad enough - ya know? She's morphed into John Tower with all this bristling military talk.
And don't get me started on Bill. *sigh*
May 2, 2008 11:37 AM | Reply | Permalink
Yes we will, because he'll jump to McCain. His is a special breed of ignorance.
May 2, 2008 11:43 AM | Reply | Permalink
"dividing the party"? By registering more voters? or by increasing turnout?
May 2, 2008 10:57 AM | Reply | Permalink
good point!
May 2, 2008 11:54 AM | Reply | Permalink
I guess if you aren't a Clinton supporter you must be a "worthless white nigger" huh?
May 2, 2008 10:59 AM | Reply | Permalink
How many times are you people going to play the race card?
It backfired once and will again.
Are you trying to lose?
Stop playing the race card.
May 2, 2008 11:17 AM | Reply | Permalink
Take your own advice and stop mentioning Reverend Wright in 90% of your posts, unless you're going to give equal time mentioning Mickey Kantor.
Obama chose his pastor, Hillary chose her friends and advisers. No one's sh*t smells any sweeter than anyone else's.
May 2, 2008 11:20 AM | Reply | Permalink
So quoting Hillary officials is playing the race card now?
Nice logic.
May 2, 2008 11:22 AM | Reply | Permalink
What race card, idiot?
You fookin idiot. Carville, Stephinfechitopoulos and Mickey (O I'm not really as greasy as I seem - sike!) Kantor are calling white Indianans "white niggers" in that vid - did you look at it?
Dude - it's them - they said it. They brought this up. They made this happen.
May 2, 2008 11:49 AM | Reply | Permalink
I'm an Obama supporter, and even I think it was insincere. Frustrating too. Rev. Wright is not very far outside of mainstream but he has been swiftboated as some crazy "wackadoodle". Now Obama has bought in to it. This is another symptom of Obama allowing Clinton define the race.
He really needs to stop doing that!
May 2, 2008 10:50 AM | Reply | Permalink
You must be joking. Which mainstream are you talking about? The one that believes the US Gov't created AIDS, or that US Terrorism led to 9/11? The Press Club Q&A showed that the caricature of Wright presented by the soundbytes is a deep part of who the man really is....And Obama was sincerely rejecting that, because that kind of focus on racial division and historical injustice is totally contradicted by Obama's forward thinking and inclusive message. Wright may have helped Obama grow, intellectually, spiritually, emotionally, whatever....But it is clear that the student has learned all he can from the teacher, and has moved on. Of course it is political calculation when the man in question is running for President, but I have no reason to think Obama is lying when he says he is offended and outraged by Wright's race-baiting and hatred.
May 2, 2008 11:14 AM | Reply | Permalink
Sorry Stirling, but you're just wrong on that. Be it for political expediency, principle, or whatever, Obama had to repudiate Wright once and for all.
It wasn't about Hillary defining the race. She's disgusting and will do whatever she has to in order to command attention anyway. This was about everyone else defining the race.
Obama had to make this go away, and indeed it is starting to recede, even if the effects on the polls will be felt for a little while.
May 2, 2008 11:19 AM | Reply | Permalink
I say both are true, with a political response the action you take after you're outraged.
May 2, 2008 10:52 AM | Reply | Permalink
This is part of the problem with polls--and, by extension, the news media that covers them. Polls perpetuate an oppositional, dualistic mindset. Did Obama do what he did because of sincere outrage? OR because of political expedience? Most people with half a brain (apologies to gotalife) would have to know it was some combination of the two, and that one being true doesn't exclude the possibility of the the other being true as well. Instead, we get a media culture that reduces every decision to a debate over "sincerity" or authenticity."
May 2, 2008 10:55 AM | Reply | Permalink
Nailed it.
May 2, 2008 11:15 AM | Reply | Permalink
Push polling is front paged at TPM. How far we've come.
May 2, 2008 10:56 AM | Reply | Permalink
The obvious motivation was that Wright betrayed him. Obama explicitly refused to disown the guy a month ago, and Wright turns around and returns the favor by mocking and sniping at Obama in a smug way. He jokes that he'll be VP, and hints that Obama secretly shares his views.
Wright is a selfish arrogant asshole. That's the motivation.
May 2, 2008 10:57 AM | Reply | Permalink
Ding! Ding! Ding! Give that man a prize!
May 2, 2008 11:17 AM | Reply | Permalink
Holy crap, I don't know what to say about this, I think it speaks for itself. You have Michael "Mickey" Kantor, Chairman of Bill's '92 campaign, friend of the Clintons since the 70s, a Clinton appointee, and current advisor to Hillary's campaign, calling the people of Indiana "shit" and "worthless white niggers" (I'm not even sure what that means), while James Carville and George Stephanopoulos look on:
http://www.thepersonalispolitical.com/2008/05/hillary-advisor-called-indiana-voters.html
May 2, 2008 10:58 AM | Reply | Permalink
He was also US trade representative and the Secretary of Commerce.
May 2, 2008 11:34 AM | Reply | Permalink
I think Obama was probably "outraged" that Wright was embarrassing him. I don't know if he was outraged by the comments, which seemed more "goofy" then "hateful."
What's obnoxious about this poll is that it asks what people think about Wright, it doesn't ask whether they care, whether it would affect their vote in the general.
Because frankly, I have no idea why anyone would freak out about this stuff. I probably wouldn't vote for Wright myself, but it's not like he's any worse then, say, Kucinich on the 'whackadoodle' scale.
May 2, 2008 11:00 AM | Reply | Permalink
Can I ask if this matters, really?
I'm not bitching, Greg - but doesn't this kind of poll sound like some Women's slick poll - how to find your Romance Quotient?
Seriously - I'm not bitching, but this strikes me as rather Cosmo.
;)
May 2, 2008 11:00 AM | Reply | Permalink
Greg this election is over. So can you now please post this video from 1992.
LOL.
May 2, 2008 11:01 AM | Reply | Permalink
They are unhinged with desperation.
Fun to watch their heads explode.
May 2, 2008 11:19 AM | Reply | Permalink
How is any poll asking about Wright not a push poll?
May 2, 2008 11:03 AM | Reply | Permalink
Here's how I see these nonissues becoming important to voters:
step 1 - press goes nuts on first report
step 2 - the furor dies, so someone stirs the pot
step 3 - now the press really goes nuts and now people who otherwise didn't think it amounted to a hill of beans are asking themselves: "Wait a minute, maybe there is something here."
step 4 - the media has an orgy of nonstop coverage of this nonoutrageous nonissue, and people start feeling some outrage.
step 5 - they are polled on this nonissue and now it is firmly in their heads that something is wrong here - where there is smoke there is fire.
Success.
May 2, 2008 11:05 AM | Reply | Permalink
Step .5: Blumenthal of the Clinton campaign relentlessly flogs rightwing talking points to the press. Relentlessly. Press sits on the information. Blumenthal works harder. And harder.
ABCNews falls first, and starts the avalanche of reruns of "God damn America".
Then, the press goes nuts.
Blumenthal smiles.
May 2, 2008 11:09 AM | Reply | Permalink
Yeah.
I can't over that. I really loved Sidney.
I can't believe it but that's how it always is with the Clintons and the people around them. I thought Sid had integrity.
There isn't one of them who has the slightest clue what that means.
May 2, 2008 11:11 AM | Reply | Permalink
I'm less disturbed by Blumenthal and more by the complete lack of acknowledgement on the part of sites like Talking Points Memo that Blumenthal was doing this crap.
May 2, 2008 11:16 AM | Reply | Permalink
I could not say WORD! strongly enough.
I don't know what's going on around the internet, but I do know some things.
I know about some groups - the Townhouse Group, Josh. I know y'all get together and decide on what stories you're going to find relevant - or you used to, when Gilly was still alive cause he blew the whistle on y'all.
The election has gotten total crap coverage online.
May 2, 2008 11:23 AM | Reply | Permalink
Good one TenaX!
People like Greg and Eric (and of course the main stream centrist media-MSM, CNN et al)are all guilty of perpetuating this cycle of weightless poll-based "news".It seems like TPM is now fully devorted to non-issues while real issues that matter to americans remain on the fringes of political discourse.
Why are'nt we discussing real issues? Or even poll testing real issues? Why Greg? I would like a poll (I use the word "like" here advisedly) that is asking how much further damage Hillary's "oblitergate"comments are doing to our already shredded global image.Especially now that Iran have made an official complaint to the UN about it. As much as I detest polls, I especially loathe the pointless ones that get recycled by our delusional media including, without limitation, TPM, hereafter referred to as GregEric schoolyard! 'nuf said!
May 2, 2008 11:30 AM | Reply | Permalink
Damned if you do and damned if you don't. You can thank the Republicans and the Clintons for destroying a 20 year relationship. I've got of relatives and friends who think the sun shines out Rush Limbaugh's oxycontin lined sphincter, yet I don't denounce them.
May 2, 2008 11:07 AM | Reply | Permalink
I so agree. It's sickening - none of that should have happened - none of it. The whole thing was faked outrage deliberately manufactured over what is a very personal relationship. An 80 year old man who is obviously a man of passion about his beliefs and is 80 years old, and I know how people get at 80 - my mother was beyond irrational at times and she had her mind - she never lost a step. But emotionally? The older you get the less able you are to corral your emotions. Wright got hurt and I'm sorry he decided to go on a rampage, but really his rampage was only upsetting to some white folks. Because the problem here has always been:
Rev Wright isn't grateful enough.
But this shouldn't have happened - It's a nasty mark on our country that it did, IMO.
May 2, 2008 11:16 AM | Reply | Permalink
Agree. The double standard applied to Wright is a joke. But he went way overboard by deciding to show the world he is bigger than Barack Obama. He is an asshole, but it is just guilt by association to link Obama to his loony theories.
May 2, 2008 11:20 AM | Reply | Permalink
I was so unhappy to find Rev Wright so very deeply nastily publicly angry.
I sort of think Obama was too; at least that's how I took his second statement. I think Wright hurt Obama here, as well and it kills me that this relationship is in such a state over nothing.
It could have been prevented.
May 2, 2008 11:26 AM | Reply | Permalink
hallelujah!
me too!
May 2, 2008 11:18 AM | Reply | Permalink
More Clintonian logic on Kantor:
* Your surrogate's comments count, mine don't.
* The 90's prosperity counts, but not any comments my surrogates made in the 90's.
Reject and denounce... What say you, Hillary?
May 2, 2008 11:08 AM | Reply | Permalink
Hillary says, "Shut up, you worthless white n@ggers!"
May 2, 2008 11:10 AM | Reply | Permalink
wow.
That sounds worse every time I hear it.
May 2, 2008 11:12 AM | Reply | Permalink
yeah, and we have video and they were talking about the voters of Indiana and George Stephonopolis is doing a town hall with Hillary this weekend...
Hillary's chickens have come home to roost.
May 2, 2008 11:26 AM | Reply | Permalink
I'll send you $20 if he brings it up.
He won't.
It's ok when a Clinton advisor says something like this, because that was 16 years ago.
Don't you get it?
This is not going to be mentioned by MSM. Not.Going.To.Happen.
May 2, 2008 11:34 AM | Reply | Permalink
As I've pointed out on this thread elsewhere Drudge is running a piece on it, ABC is running a piece on it, Wonkette is running a piece on it...
May 2, 2008 11:42 AM | Reply | Permalink
It is enough to make one despair of the future of this republic. How, in heaven's sweet name, can it possibly matter why or when Obama did or said anything vis-a-vis Jeremiah Wright? I would be hard pressed to imagine an issue more trivial or irrelevant to my own well being or that of my neighbors and fellow citizens. Lord have mercy...
May 2, 2008 11:13 AM | Reply | Permalink
The one redeeming factor of all this is that it does at least testify to the fact that, for all the noise about his decline, Obama is still comfortably in the lead. If he were not, Republicans (and their affiliate outfits like Rasmussen) would not be working so hard to keep this story in the headlines.
May 2, 2008 11:15 AM | Reply | Permalink
Absolutely correct.
May 2, 2008 11:17 AM | Reply | Permalink
Yep - that's the enduring lesson of this whole nasty couple of months:
they threw everything at him: the toaster, the blender, the microwave, the SubZ, the Viking Range, the espresso machine, the sink, the electric wok - and he's still standing and he's still ahead.
Someone posted the analogy several days ago of the tortoise and the hare and damme it sounded just about right at the time and still does.
May 2, 2008 11:22 AM | Reply | Permalink
You forgot the backyard barbeque....she tossed that sucker at him too.
Of course she stopped to have a cold one with the good folks first. Because she "gets" the worthless white ni&&&ers, err, uh, I mean, working class white voters.
May 2, 2008 11:35 AM | Reply | Permalink
Wasn't it just a month ago that Clinton was telling us that thisi election isn't about who you'd like to have a beer with?
And yet, there she went, downing shots with the guys.
It's amusing that no one has pointed out this hypocrisy. Or, to be more charitable, seeming change of heart.
May 2, 2008 11:40 AM | Reply | Permalink
i hate to say this, but articles like this are moving me away from TPM. i've woken-up and gone to bed with this site since it launched; now i'm starting to just not care... because you sound just like everyone else.
you guys are supposed to be smarter, better, faster, stronger than this. or at least, not as blatantly dumb.
greg, especially, but now it's seeping onto josh's front page, too. c'mon, guys.
May 2, 2008 11:15 AM | Reply | Permalink
I, for one, will be very surprised if Kantor's "white n*gger" slur gets any coverage in the MSM. And if it does, it will be downplayed and excused away. The MSM -- including some of the writers on this site -- are in the tank for Hillary. There's a vested interest in keeping the horse race going, so they would be poking themselves in the eye by reporting this.
May 2, 2008 11:19 AM | Reply | Permalink
It's not going to get much play.
It's ok when white people slur whole groups of individuals.
It is most profoundly not ok when a black man is angry, and says unacceptable things.
May 2, 2008 11:24 AM | Reply | Permalink
I don't know ... we'll see if Keith picks it up tonite. He posts on Daily Kos sometimes and there's a huge diary up on it, so maybe it will happen.
May 2, 2008 11:34 AM | Reply | Permalink
I have a sneaking suspicion it may grow some legs.
I guess we'll see.
May 2, 2008 11:39 AM | Reply | Permalink
Polls(P), ads(A), super delegates(S).
Is that all there is? Because it sure is the only thing you get on TPM Election Central. Go down the page, and you have: P, A, S, P, P, P, A, P, A, S, P, S, S, P.
And then, right at the end of the page, last posting is the only one about something non-classifiable. Read it soon, because daily Gallup is coming soon and it's going to take it out.
This ain't a horse race, guys.
May 2, 2008 11:22 AM | Reply | Permalink
"God bless us for being rich people!" -- Hillary Clinton
May 2, 2008 11:23 AM | Reply | Permalink
No post or video on that here either. Greg and Eric, really, what's up????
The "latest videos" list has 5 videos - 4 are pro-Hillary and only one is pro-Obama - his ad response to the gas tax holiday. Clearly there have been other Obama videos that have come out that would qualify for "latest" (including Hillary's "God Bless Us" video). Where are they? I tell you, this site is really getting obnoxious.
May 2, 2008 11:46 AM | Reply | Permalink
I, for one, would have liked to have seen one additional question in that poll:
"Do you give a rat's ass about Jeremiah Wright?"
May 2, 2008 11:23 AM | Reply | Permalink
Wow video is shocking- granted it was 16 years ago but if they are holding Obama accoutable for something his pastor said 7 years ago, what is the difference?
Posting on TPM etc....*crickets*
May 2, 2008 11:25 AM | Reply | Permalink
Wright will be back because he is writing a book and will get paid for speeches.
May 2, 2008 11:27 AM | Reply | Permalink
Speaking of books, Jeff Sharlet's book, The Family: The Secret Fundamentalism at the Heart of American Power is due out this month. I wonder how Americans will respond to Hillary's Hitler-lovin' preacher...
http://www.thenation.com/doc/20080331/ehrenreich
May 2, 2008 11:44 AM | Reply | Permalink
I will be impressed if I see this appear anywhere in the MSM today....
Kantor is not some peripheral player in the Clinton's political life either. This guy is one of the old time gang.
http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-srv/politics/special/clinton/stories/kantor012998.htm
May 2, 2008 11:29 AM | Reply | Permalink
Was this poll taken before or after White N*ggergate?
http://www.dailykos.com/storyonly/2008/5/2/93316/53926/838/507664
May 2, 2008 11:30 AM | Reply | Permalink
"Lamont",
I just watched that video once, passed it along to some others, then suddenly, voila, it won't load up.
Something's fishy here?
Maybe it was just getting traffic?
It sure was a piece of work, and it could not have been faked.
May 2, 2008 11:41 AM | Reply | Permalink
I'm stunned that as many as 30% believe it was outrage and not political convenience that forced Obama to denounce Wright. That number must include mostly Obama supporters, and I honestly don't believe most of them are telling the truth. I think everyone knows Obama was acting out of pure political motivation, but some chose to answer otherwise. His supporters aren't THAT naive.
May 2, 2008 11:33 AM | Reply | Permalink
"How could she sit in the [briefing room? war room? pew?] with him for 20 years?" ...
May 2, 2008 11:33 AM | Reply | Permalink
"58% Say Obama Denounced Wright for Political Convenience, not Outrage".
In other words, Obama ia a liar.
May 2, 2008 11:33 AM | Reply | Permalink
Oh, shut up. You Hoosiers are shit.
May 2, 2008 11:41 AM | Reply | Permalink
So why do even *more* Americans find Clinton dishonest, Sparky?
http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2008/04/15/AR2008041502883.html?nav=rss_print/asection
I need to get me a pair of those shades that let you ignore contradictory evidence...
May 2, 2008 11:41 AM | Reply | Permalink
To borrow a phrase from one of your heroes, "It depends on what your definition of "ia" is."
May 2, 2008 11:42 AM | Reply | Permalink
This poll presents a logical fallacy known as a false dichotomy or false dilemma. Only two choices are presented when there are other possible options. The results, therefore, are worthless.
May 2, 2008 11:37 AM | Reply | Permalink
We need a poll on how the public is responding to Hillary's break from Mickey "Hoosiers are shit" Kantor.
Oh, that's right... Hillary hasn't broken from Kantor.
May 2, 2008 11:37 AM | Reply | Permalink
that would take something akin to an operatin to separate conjoined twins. Rven if they "publicly" part today, they will still share cocktails tomorrow.
And it won't be a shot and a beer this time, that's what Indiana's white ni***rs drink.
May 2, 2008 11:49 AM | Reply | Permalink
Was Hillary aware that Kantor was making these outrageous, racist statements in her and Bill's own offices?
Does she reject and denounce Kantor?
Why is Kantor an advisor to her campaign?
Is she electable now?
What will McCain do with this tape?
Democratic voters need to know.
May 2, 2008 11:41 AM | Reply | Permalink
LOL!
Seriously, we need to do our best to push this story into the msm before this Tuesday.
May 2, 2008 11:45 AM | Reply | Permalink
Well, when I last went to YouTube it had about 500 view and now it has over 11,000 - methinks it's starting to get legs. Good - we'll see if Keith picks it up tonight. It's been covered by ABC's Tapper so that could give it some "legitimacy" with other media outlets.
May 2, 2008 11:52 AM | Reply | Permalink
I think we can put to rest the Clintons are dividing the party.
It is Obama and his supporters. Period.
May 2, 2008 11:43 AM | Reply | Permalink
O, I think the party will live. I really do.
May 2, 2008 11:46 AM | Reply | Permalink
Thanks for your concern, I'm sure we'll be OK, given the millions pouring in to Obama-DNC fundraising coffers. Thanks for caring though. It's sweet.
May 2, 2008 11:53 AM | Reply | Permalink
The Wright issue should be shut down. It's getting tedious and insulting.
By the same token, the 1992 clip should not be allowed to define Clinton.
There's double-standard out there, for sure...probably because people think they know Clinton better than Obama and Obama needs to be "vetted." Or maybe because Clinton has more media/insider connections and fewer scruples about using those connections however she can.
Regardless of the reasons, I am glad to be on the side that is playing the game more decently...and winning because of it (despite it?).
And I still say, let's not condemn those Clinton methods so quickly...they will turn around and help Barack Obama soon.
If Obama supporters attack Clinton too much, it reduces her ability to help in the general. Bush is a huge liability to McCain in November, let's not make the Clintons equally toxic to Obama.
May 2, 2008 11:43 AM | Reply | Permalink
My only issue with what I think is an excellent statement is the ommitted part about what Hillary is doing to the democratic party. You said we shouldn't attack her so bad that it reduces her in the general. I think she has done things on her own like using tactics that most of us denounce. She has not acted like a democrat, more like a conservative the last few months. So if the Dems embrace that behaivor, then I dont want to hear them crying foul when it happens to them, and we all know it will. Looking to the general and forward, I dont want to hear them crying thats all, if we/they don't draw a line in the sand and say we are better than that. That would be hipocrisy!
May 2, 2008 12:07 PM | Reply | Permalink
"reduces her ability to help in the general."
You mean, like, the way she helped Kerry in 2004?
May 2, 2008 12:09 PM | Reply | Permalink
I still thing Greg needs an editor. Posts like this add very little. This poll tells us nothing, and is about nothing.
Is this poll indicitave of how the Wright controversy is affecting the race? I would argue that it is not, since we can't infer from it anything about how people will vote.
Does it reflect people's attitudes about Obama? Not really. I'm sure there are a lot of people that would say it was smart to politically distance himself from Wright. And I'm sure there are a lot of people who think that the motivation was both, but since that wasn't a choice, they get recorded as either one or the other.
So what does this poll tell us, besides that Greg needs to think harder about what belongs on this page?
May 2, 2008 11:46 AM | Reply | Permalink
Clinton is a sleaze bag.
May 2, 2008 11:46 AM | Reply | Permalink
Kantorgate is a perfectly legitimate campaign issue.
Hillary has made a huge point of declaring that she has been "vetted," but I doubt the Indiana newspapers that have endorsed her are aware of this.
Er, I mean, they weren't before myself and others began emailing them...
May 2, 2008 11:47 AM | Reply | Permalink
Right the fuck on!
I don't think Obama needs to touch this. I think it can develop its own momentum.
YouTube has a way of spreading this stuff but fast and but widely. That's how Wright got to be such an issue.
May 2, 2008 11:50 AM | Reply | Permalink
This is much bigger than Wright, this is tantamount to "Macaca."
May 2, 2008 12:11 PM | Reply | Permalink
If Kantor was an Obama aide, Eric and Greg would have posted it hours ago.
May 2, 2008 11:51 AM | Reply | Permalink
Whats tragic is the way they poll the candidates. Maybe Im being sensitive as an Obama supporter, but some so-called objective person, please look at how they broke down the polling on Obama, and tell me do you feel they does things with McCain and Hillary. Maybe they do, but I dont feel like they do
May 2, 2008 11:58 AM | Reply | Permalink
So, the majority now see Obama as a liar. The only surprise is that it took so long. Is this the lasting effect of Wright that he outed Obama for lying for political purposes and this, coming from his pastor, spiritual advisor, mentor, and friend of over 20 years, is more confirming than anything the media, critics, or Clinton could do?
As this settles in he gets higher negatives than Clinton and risks approaching Bush in low credibility. Bad for him, great for Clinton and McCain.
Matthew
May 2, 2008 12:04 PM | Reply | Permalink
I think there is a difference between presumming someone lying and having documented video and audio proof of someone lying. Take Bary Bonds, he testified that he did not knowingly take steroids. Because the government didnt have at the time someone who would testify that they physicaly seen him do it, kinda made it hard to call him a liar about that in a court of law!
Matter of fact merging the fact that people lie, everyone, I do it, you do it, and we know politicians do it, with calling someone a liar based on several lies, to me is just flat out disingenuous! Im sure everyone on this board that has posted here has lied about something, yet they are not looked at as liars. Im sure some of us know people that because they lie often,now have earned the title of liar and are not credible! I personaly would have never called HRC a liar, until the pattern emerged! It was more than one,and some where just flat out unnecessary lies! Thats just my opinion and you know, I'm one of those Obama supporters so somehow Im jaded....I know!
May 2, 2008 12:18 PM | Reply | Permalink
Word.
May 2, 2008 12:48 PM | Reply | Permalink
When I posted that the video of Kantor wasn't working, it said that 208 people had viewed it...
It is now up to 11,000!
No wonder it was slow to load...
Watch this event if you want to see what "viral" means, someone mentioned it earlier, this will be a great lesson in how the internet manages to get the truth out, when the MSM abdicates its public duties.
The last time I remember such an event, the word "Macaca" was attached to it.
I don't know who took the video, but they seemd a lot like a fly on the wall...
And isn't it amazing these geniuses allowed themselves to be taped? This toothpaste will never fit back nto the tube...
...even if she "rekants" this won't bode well for Hillary.
Not surprised, though at the elitism, remember Gollum Carville's "drag a $20 bill through a mobile home park" comments.
For Democrats, these guys are awful elitists.
May 2, 2008 12:06 PM | Reply | Permalink
As long as companies like Rasmussen do this kind of cheesy, sleazy, worthless poll that does absolutely nothing to advance the political discourse, they will continue to lose any respect people might have had for the work they do.
May 2, 2008 12:18 PM | Reply | Permalink
Here goes my conspiracy theory moment...:). They do these polls so that the media has the ability to keep talking about it! That was my point with the way they poll Hillary vs Obama vs McCain. I dont think they poll all of their controversies equally! Me thinks it's a rackit!
May 2, 2008 12:21 PM | Reply | Permalink
Rev. Wright, spreading the gospel of hate.
Sen. Obama spreading the message of deception.
Obama the Deceiver. Do we really need another arrogant president who is ready and willing to deceive the American people for his own agenda. Bush and Obama are opposite sides of the same coin.
Clinton is the right choice for the nomination and presidency.
May 2, 2008 12:18 PM | Reply | Permalink
josh is on blumenthal's mailing list. he knows where it is coming from.
May 2, 2008 12:23 PM | Reply | Permalink
There's nothing left to talk about except that there's nothing left to talk about.
May 2, 2008 12:29 PM | Reply | Permalink
Oh, no. Let's talk about how the Clintons have chosen to remain friends with a person who thinks Hoosiers are sh*t. White ni**gers. Let's talk about that a lot. Let's talk about it as much as you've been talking about Reverend Wright. I think there's PLENTY to talk about, hot dog. This is the fun part.
May 2, 2008 12:32 PM | Reply | Permalink
You bring a smile to my lips and a chuckle to my throat, dear Mr Glad. I am obliged to you as ever.
May 2, 2008 12:55 PM | Reply | Permalink
Billy's right. I think the frustration is if we could get the MSM to really talk about it, some of us would let it alone! We want the double standards to stop!
May 2, 2008 12:37 PM | Reply | Permalink
I know you're still stuck in the Plessy v. Ferguson days, and the "one drop rule," but Obama is half white. I don't think he hates half of himself.
May 2, 2008 12:42 PM | Reply | Permalink
Who's that happy? Who's still stuck in those days?
May 2, 2008 12:50 PM | Reply | Permalink
Oh shit.....I watched the clip again....I think the only thing we can say for sure is he said those people are shit!...That worthless white Nig didnt seem real to me. Somethings strange on that part...
May 2, 2008 12:47 PM | Reply | Permalink
Yeah, I'm sure he hates his mom and his campaign director and his half-white siblings and Senator Durbin, the senior senator. And BTW, did you notice in Oregon (according to Rasmussen) he is leading the white vote 50-44?
May 2, 2008 12:48 PM | Reply | Permalink
Let's say the video is real (I don't think so).
Even so, what's the point of dredging up something from 16 years ago relating a different campaign - Clinton/Gore and a different cast of characters?
Would this then also tarnish Gore? if not, why not?
Let's stop the foolishness and get this primary season over.
May 2, 2008 1:06 PM | Reply | Permalink
Not exactly. Kantor, the guy who said the people from Indiana are "shit" and "white niggers" is still a close Clinton friend and campaign advisor.
May 2, 2008 1:13 PM | Reply | Permalink
Clinton wants to play the guilt-by-association game, then this is completely valid.
May 2, 2008 1:14 PM | Reply | Permalink
This crap is getting totally insane.
For once I'm in agreement with the Obama camp: Let's just get this crap over with. I am so completely sick of this Rev. Wright stupidity I almost want Obama to get the nomination. Almost.
Let's just move on.
May 2, 2008 1:13 PM | Reply | Permalink
Come on East...what will it take to get you on the good guys side?.......Kidding of course about good guys(maybe) but whats keeping you from understanding the better for the party of the two candidates?
May 2, 2008 1:34 PM | Reply | Permalink
Oh, don't lose faith now. Who will we have to argue with? :)
I agree, though. This family fight is getting a bit tiresome. I'd like it to just be over too.
May 2, 2008 1:39 PM | Reply | Permalink
the Kantor video is gone from the utubes.
it was there 5 minutes ago, and now it's gone
poof
May 2, 2008 1:15 PM | Reply | Permalink
I saw the original video from the documentary and he definitely says something about Indianans being "shit" but I'm not so sure about the n-word part. if someone did fake that it sucks because the shit part would have been enough
May 2, 2008 1:17 PM | Reply | Permalink
Even that has been debunked. It was something to the effect of, "shitting in the white house."
May 2, 2008 2:15 PM | Reply | Permalink
I do want to add: The "white nigger" shit is fair game, precisely because the personal association continues.
It doesn't matter where it comes from - that kind of crap needs to be called out, loudly and publicly. Rev. Write got pulled up short for his racism; Kantor deserves nothing less.
May 2, 2008 1:17 PM | Reply | Permalink
He didn't say it. The clip was bullshit. I may not like Hillary, but I HATE bullshit.
May 2, 2008 1:32 PM | Reply | Permalink
now, it's gone at DKos, too (upthread links broken now)
dropping fast after ABC quashed it
May 2, 2008 1:19 PM | Reply | Permalink
Good.
May 2, 2008 1:34 PM | Reply | Permalink
Nope -- longer version is here. Check in ~ 4:48.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4_wKOgMNs0U
May 2, 2008 1:34 PM | Reply | Permalink
It's crap. Let it die. There was no naked lady in Cheney's glasses and Kantor didn't insult anyone.
May 2, 2008 1:43 PM | Reply | Permalink
I'd love to hear Wright's side of his relationship with Obama, for example whether or not Obama knew full well about Wright's opinions all along over the years. And if so, whether or not Obama agreed with his opinions. True, Obama purports to be surprised by those opinions now, but that's just his side of the story. Like Wright said, Obama is a politician, and we all know what politicians do.
Standing back and looking at the big picture, it's funny that Obama himself is now saying he is outraged by some specific opinions which Wright voiced on Monday. And those are the very same opinions that we Obama-skeptics have been outraged about all along. But we were lectured by the Obama supporters that we were taking those opinions out of context, blah blah blah, and we needed to listen to all 30 years of Wright sermons blah blah blah. Just goes to show ya.
May 2, 2008 1:42 PM | Reply | Permalink
Of course he agreed with his opinion--have you heard Wright speak? He's frikking brilliant. And he's right, too. The thing that pissed everyone off was Wright's appearance at the National Press Club. He made and ass of himself, he made the church look bad, and he screwed Obama.
The Wright controversy is over. CNN hasn't had a word about it today. Neither does the Times, the Post or any other paper. Wright can say anything he wants now. Obama has cut him loose. All Obama needs to say is, "There he goes again..."
Find something new to obsess about.
May 2, 2008 1:48 PM | Reply | Permalink
I stand corrected. The Post is still talking about it. Fucking wingers.
May 2, 2008 1:49 PM | Reply | Permalink
http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2008/05/01/AR2008050102903.html?hpid=opinionsbox1
Two days after the Sept. 11, 2001, attacks, Jerry Falwell, appearing on Pat Robertson's "700 Club," declared: "I really believe that the pagans, and the abortionists, and the feminists, and the gays and the lesbians who are actively trying to make that an alternative lifestyle, the ACLU, People for the American Way -- all of them who have tried to secularize America -- I point the finger in their face and say, 'You helped this happen.' "
May 2, 2008 1:52 PM | Reply | Permalink
Did Hillary or McCain title one of their books after a Robertson sermon? Did either of them attend his sermons for 20 years, describe him as a mentor and almost a member of the family, and have him on their campaign staff? Were Hillary or McCain ready to have Robertson say a prayer at their campaign kickoff announcement?
Yes, I'm sure they'll happily accept endorsements from almost any nutcase out there. But that's not the same thing as sleeping with one.
May 2, 2008 2:08 PM | Reply | Permalink
Yaaaaaaaaawwwwwwwwwnnnnnnnnnnnnnnn!
I will be at happy hour tonight hopeing that the American People are ready to grow up!
May 2, 2008 1:58 PM | Reply | Permalink
Not you hrebendorf....Talking about the Wright Comment.....Yaaaaaawwwwwwwn!
May 2, 2008 2:00 PM | Reply | Permalink
4 shoa hrebendorf!
Stemper...I hear "doesnt matter if we win, those people are shitten" Im thinking he is talking about the people in the whitehouse....and the White Nig part.....sorry, there is no there there!....While adjusting my tin foil hat state, this clip has been leaked by someone in the clinton campaign. Im done commenting on it personaly, hope everyone else lets it die. Obama is winning, and will win as long as we dont fall for the okie doke.....Just my opinion!
May 2, 2008 1:56 PM | Reply | Permalink
Obamites strrrrrrrretching for something.
Those quotes aren't even real. If you listen to the actual clip in the extended version you realize the first supposed quote is not correct and the second one is non-existent.
that first youtube vid is a fraud. Pretty much just like Fearless Leader Obama. A fake, a freaud, an actor, a deceiver.
If this gets pushed it will completely backfire on Obama.
The Wright Wing controversy will continue becasue it is real and goes to the character, or lack of it, of Obama.
May 2, 2008 2:01 PM | Reply | Permalink
well, obviously Obama never had any great objection to this nutty apeshit ignorant Wright non-sense. In fact, it's the same non-sense peddled by the Criticial Race Studies people at Harvard Law. And it's a measure of how far out of touch Obama really is that he never grasped just how nutty this shit sounds to regular people i.e. outside of Cambridge and nutty AA-churches.
On another note, I am reading some modern Chinese economic history. Man oh man, they are going to eat your lunch. While your Ivy institutions colldle intellectuall ridiculous and socially/economiclly useless AA studies departments and womyn's studies departments, the Chinese are studying engineering etc full-stop. Guess which will be more valuable in the 21st century? balther about patriarchy and Tuskegee, or machine-building?
May 3, 2008 4:26 AM | Reply | Permalink