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McAuliffe: Joint Ticket Would Be "A Great Idea"

This aired last night, but it's worth a quick look as a sign of what's to come.

Here is top Hillary adviser Terry McAuliffe, talking up the idea of a joint ticket in rather glowing terms in an interview that aired on Sirius radio (transcript sent over by the station)...

TERRY MCAULIFFE: Well first of all, as you know Mark, both of them, both Hillary Clinton and Barack Obama are themselves going to have to decide who they think is going to be their best Vice President. For the rest of us it's speculation and presumption and all that.

I'm just -- I'll put on my former chairman of the Democratic Party hat -- I think it's a great idea at the end of this process for us all to be together...

I do get excited about the possibility of having Barack Obama and Hillary Clinton crisscrossing this country in the fall of 2008. I think that would be pretty exciting. But I have absolutely no say in it. Hillary Clinton and I have never talked about it. But as former chairman of the party it does get you somewhat excited.

Prediction: The public enthusiasm among top Hillary supporters for an Obama-Hillary ticket will rise roughly in proportion with their growing recognition that Obama is the party's presumptive nominee.


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No. No. No.

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If she wanted to be V.P., the time to make that move was 2 months ago, not after spending tens of millions of dollars trashing half of the democratic electorate.

Count me as pissed & sitting on my wallet if she gets the nod.

May I just add another emphatic NO!!!

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Yes, you may and I will add mine. NO!

Is that a Rev Wright no, no, no?

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No! No! No!

I agree... McAuliffe needs to go to rehab.

No ! NO! and NO! Clear Enough?

if hillary doesn't get the nomination, barack needs her on his ticket. he won't win without her. and if you think he can really beat mccain on his own in november, you're a dumbass.

he can never win. this nation will never vote him into office.

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The public enthusiasm among top Hillary supporters for an Obama-Hillary ticket will rise roughly in proportion with their growing recognition that Obama is the party's presumptive nominee

Yes.

Nice dry sense of humor, btw.

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thanks

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Greg, that prediction at the end of the post is the sharpest, most-correct thing you've written since I've been reading this blog. Bravo.

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That really was pretty good.

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Who knew that the "former chairman of the Democratic Party hat" allowed for such magical thinking?

There's a reason he's the former head... it has to do with sucking really really badly.

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You are welcome.

Spot on, handsome.

Something tells me I've seen this story before.

Hillary supporters can think of their candidate when they see Senator Obama's vice president pick. Kathleen Sebelius of Kansas, she's a democrat, with the experience, intelligence, and she's a woman.

Obama/Sebelius '08 **==

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Sargent's Theorem.

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Keep Hillary in the Senate!!!

The VP slot would de jure keep her in the Senate (but she's better as the junior senator).

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Thank you for your help:

Keep Hillary as NY Senator!

Good observation about Clinton still being in the Senate as VP...until you start thinking about how Cheney conceptualized the VPency. Can you imagine the damage Clinton could do with Cheney's theory of the unaccountable VP? Add me to the "no" column.

No, take her senate seat from her also

The Clintons need to be taught a lesson.

Obama/Sebelius '08 **==

What lesson would that be, disagreeing without being disagreeable, something you have yet to learn? To think I had the audacity to hope that Obama followers would practice what Obama preaches.

Right on dude. Just because someone doesn;t support a particular candidate doesn;t mean it needs to be full on nuclear war. Hillary and Obama agree on almost every policy position for heck sake.

Quite aside from being an insane pick for Obama, I cannot for the life of me imagine why she would ever want to be anyone's running mate. She wouldn't be a Cheney-type or even a Gore-type VP; the proper parallel, as a primary runner-up, would be George Bush I: 8 years of flying to funerals, toeing the party line, and general irrelevance, in exchange for a chance to run again when she's 69 years old! Versus one of the safest seats in the Senate, where her party stands ready to take a commanding majority, plum committees beckon, and her profile and power will only grow (though the endorsement race shows she's not popular with colleagues there).

That's what drives me batty about this talk: from either perspective, his or hers, it would be the bonehead political decision of a lifetime.

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Exactly. She can gain something here by pivoting back into a driver's seat position if she cuts a deal with Obama by going back into the Senate. Be the vehicle for healthcare reform in the Senate, be the heir apparent for lioness of the Senate. VP is not a viable path for her. This was really her one and only shot at the PPOTUS (which is why she has been going down ugly).

She can get a real legacy if she pivots back into a Senate role and charge hard there to be the power center in the Senate. But that only works if she gets a working accord with Obama and re-aim her life back into the Senate and go out of the race with full-throated support and positioning to help Obama and repair the damage done by the past few months.

Could you be more of a laughingstock shmo, Mitch?

Hillary on point in the Senate for Health Care?

Oh ho ho - ha ha ha!

Just have Big Pharma and the Insurance lobby write the Bill.

Don't be ridiculous without expecting ridicule.

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I think Truman should be the model for how totreat her if you give her the VP slot. Keep her so far out of the loop that she does not even use her clearance.

**Perhaps she recognizes that she's done a lot of damage with people she needs to vote for her to be re-elected to the senate. It's all she's got. She needs to take Bill to a quiet place and get him fixed.

Trust me, she's got a long way to go before she's in any danger in NY (where she's not up again 'til 2012 anyway). She plays the incumbent game very well, brings home the bacon, does well with constituent stuff, massages all the power folks... no Dem will have the $$, name or guts to challenge her, & the state Repubs are a bleeding mess -- only incumbent inertia is keeping them alive.

the way Hillary is going now, she is making it easy for BO to not ask her to be his vp.

I am starting to wonder how much of her campaigning is really for the superdelegates and how much is aimed at putting pressure on Obama to choose her as VP.

I was thinking that too until she spent several weeks basing her entire campaign around how radioactive and unelectable and unacceptable Obama is.

Can you really just do a 180 like that and go from saying "Obama can't win" to "Obama can't win without me in the oh-so-significant VP slot"?

Yes she can!

Very easily. I mean, it doesn't make much sense, but it's well within the realm of stuff politicians do all the time.

I'm not really sure why she wants the job so badly. It means she has a good chance of winning the nomination in 2016, but other than that it really seems like a lateral move. I don't really think it's the best way for her to help the Democratic Party either.

Reading this I have the same chill in by back than when I read that they have stopped doing security controls in one of Obama's rallies in Texas, Please, no.

they're going to get her in the White House one way or another--Hillary will probably want a bedroom there. I think Obama should then sleep with one eye open.

Spoken like a follower of Gandhi who would practice non-violent protest violently. To think I had the audacity to hope that Obama followers would practice what Obama preaches.

Blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah . . um . . . blah, blah, blah {laugh} . . . blah, blah.

Not.a.chance.

If I were BO, I wouldn't want her as my heir, lusting after my position with every fiber of her being.

Yeah I would seriously fear for my life.

The thing is though, none of the crackpots or GOP would try to take him out with Hillary waiting in the wings.

As long as the Beef-eaters are well-stocked, Hillary as VP has more pros than it does cons, if you ask me.

Why would it have to be a right wing crackpot that wants to take him out?

Actually, it doesn't really have to be life or death. Hillary could simply leak information or stab him in the back somehow in attempts to get him to resign.

I used to worry about HRC pushing for VP. I think at this point, Obama can not offer and not even have to explain.

Yep. Hillary is headed back to the Senate.

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Positive reinforcement is the way to go:

Keep Hillary in the Senate!

I agree with this. Be positive, but firm.

Hillary for Senate! Why mess with a good thing!

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Definitely! Don't mess with Hillary! She must remain where she is!

Hmmmm........lemme think....hmmmm...Hillary for VP huh? That sounds even more lame when I say it out loud.

No way!!! N...O

The thinking goes that she pressures him about the VP slot as she and her supporters will feel she's "owed" the VP slot, or she'll and her hard working, non-college educated white people will take their ball and go home. Tsk, tsk, tsk.

If he doesn't give her the VP spot, she just might go "nuclear"!

Nice try, Terry!

Hillary Clinton and I have never talked about it.

In a pig's eye. There is no way that he would let a bomb like this drop without clearing it first.

Bless my stars. I cannot believe that she wants the job. I am not wild about the idea, but I am even less excited about losing, and if this is what it takes to unify the base in order to win, I would count it an acceptable price to pay. I still find the idea very hard to credit, but I am increasingly coming to the conclusion that this is what her present campaign is all about - forcing the situation to a point where Obama has to pick her as his VP.

Obama doesn't need her to win. And certainly doesn't need to make any sort of decision now. All he needs to do is secure the nomination (officially), make some very flattering speeches aimed toward Hillary and her supporters (how much he respects her, how historic this race has been, how she has been such a trail blazer, etc.), let some time pass, let nerves calm, then ask whoever he thinks is the best for the spot.


Moreover, the thinking has been done on this already. You can sure that Axelrod, Obama and Plouffe had this figured out a long, long time ago. McCain's choice may cause them to give pause. Then again Obama may preempt McCain, despite recent goings on with Clinton.

Obama already knows who he wants. And the candidate he wants probably knows he or she is wanted. Something this important is not going to be left to the last minute.

When the announcement comes, it will be unexpected. The choice will be super appropriate and logical, even though "no one" or "nobody", as the media like to say, was expecting it.

Sorry to rain on your parade, but Barack Obama does need some kind of reconciliation with Hillary Clinton's supporters to win this election. Saying that her supporters can just be dismissed with a few compliments and not adjustments to his platform (i.e. - real universal health care) or, at the most, Sen. Clinton on the ticket, is offensive.

He won't win this election on the coalition he has built so far. That's just the truth. You aren't going to win elderly women and a lot of working class Democrats by having college kids put up Shepard Fairey posters in the neighborhood.

This has to be some kind of healing in the Democratic Party.

I agree with everything you say, Missouri Voter, and I also say if it turns out to be her so be it, but I'd rather see him take a Republican. I think a Republican is how he gets out of taking her.

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I would be exciting to watch as Hillary talks about how he couldn't have won "white voters" without her help... NOT!

Is is 1991 again? Did is just say "...NOT"? Did I fall asleep watching Wayne's World or something?

More like BORAT.

The Clintons only wish it were 1991 again.

Nowhere in here does he say who's on top of the ticket.

Remember they tried offering the VP slot to Obama weeks ago.

I noticed that one right off the bat. When did we all become such parsing cynics?

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That was the first thing that came to my mind.

As for when I became a cynic, it was in 1969 when I saw "Z".

Parsing is almost reflexive now. In a sense it's the true legacy of the Clintons' career in public life.

Sure, it's a great idea for Terry McAuliffe. With a joint ticket, he might still have a job when this is all said and done.

McAuliffe: Joint Ticket Would Be "A Great Idea"

Translation: We are beaten. Only losers talk up a joint ticket.

Senator Obama will make his own selection, and Terry McCauliffe will not be consulted.

Even if he wanted to Obama can't put Hillary on the ticket. She took that possibility away with her Commander in Chief Threshold BS. Obama can't put someone on the ticket who has said publicly not only that he does not pass the test to be Commander in Chief but that his opponent does.

Yes, that's right. I believe Nancy Pelosi made that exact point the last time this idea was floated. Clinton kind of screwed herself in that regard.


Even if he wanted to Obama can't put Hillary on the ticket. She took that possibility away with her Commander in Chief Threshold BS. Obama can't put someone on the ticket who has said publicly not only that he does not pass the test to be Commander in Chief but that his opponent does.
To be fair, she later... uh... "clarified" by saying that it was entirely conceivable that Obama would be able to cross "the Commander in Chief threshold" in the following month or two.

Of course, that's fundamentally absurd; possibly even more absurd than the notion that there actually is some "threshold" that he has not crossed. But nonetheless, that's what she said.

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The public enthusiasm among top OBAMA supporters for an Obama-Hillary ticket will rise roughly in proportion with their success in growing monkeys in their rectums which then take flight upon their unnatural births.

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There is no reason for Obama to choose Hillary and thousands of reasonf for him not to.

Just having a Clinton on the ticket will drive up Republican turnout.

Bill came upon his turrettes syndrome late in life, but now that he has it he is a HUGE liablility.

What about those donation to the Clinton Library and the Clinton foundation?

How 'bout them pardons? Obama may be too nice to bring it up, but the Republicans sure won't be. Remember that Iraq Oil for Food Scandal? Who was involved with that? Mark Rich, that's who.


I would love it if some surrogate came out and said she couldn't be VP because she hasn't been vetted this campaign.

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NO kidding!

That would be funny!

You said what I was thinking - where are they going to put Bill? And don't even try to tell me he'll be quiet and stay on the porch. Bill Clinton has spent 8 years making lots of money on the grounds of his influence and he has to try to make good. I also think the argument that Sentor Clinton supports are all going to turn to McCain is just silly.

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Imagine that -- Terry Mac is excited.

If McAullife is in fact launching a trial balloon from the Clinton campaign about this possibility, I have to say that it seems to me yet another instance of how tone-deaf they are over there. Clinton represents the very past that Obama has been running in opposition to. But more to the point: in such an administration, Bill as a presence would create, at best, an awkward dynamic between a President Obama and a Vice-President Clinton. Bill has shown on this campaign that he, um, doesn't take direction well, even when it's for the greater good of his wife's candidacy; it's difficult to see how, within the orbit of the Executive Branch again, he'd be any more amenable to direction-taking.

At worst, such a choice would bear a strong resemblance to Bush's choosing of Cheney: Obama can't handle himself, so he's asked a steadier, more-experienced hand to join him on the ticket. I'd think even Clinton supporters whose greater interest lies in the strength of the Democratic Party's ticket can see the potential problems with the optics of such a ticket.

Just to be clear here: I think Obama has proven himself to be more than capable of handling himself.

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Thanks for a thoughtful comment.

And I agree with you. The dynamics of Obama, Clinton and Clinton are just too tangled to be good.

Me too. He has stood up to similar ham-handed attempts to bully him throughout. For now, he'll keep saying that the question is premature, then he'll say that he's looking at vp candidates, then he'll announce who his non-HRC vp is and that'll be that.

I think it would be a disastrous ticket. It gives us all the racists who wouldn't vote for a black plus all the sexists who wouldn't vote for a woman PLUS all the people who make up her 53% unfavourability ratings.
BUT if past performance is a prime indicator of future behaviour, and it usually is, if she wants it, I'd suggest Obama will give her it. All his natural instincts go for `reconciliation and redemption` - he's let her off the hook time and time again in this campaign - `she's run a terrific campaign`... He's a compromiser. He inntuitively always wants to make his enemies his friends. He's inclusive. He'll want to unite the party. I'd bet over all his supporters' and not least Michelle's protests, if she demands it, he'll give it. (Unless he can heed the sage counsel of his staff and senior party people and get her to accept paying of her debt as the deal not to demand the VP.)

Obama will do it only if he believes he has to do it to win in November. There would be no other reason. Certainly not her trying to force him. He has more political power than she does now.

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He's said over and over: The campaign is about us. Us is the folks he needs to compromise with! Not her! The campaign is not about her! US!

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Bingo!

Like the VP slot is some kind of second runner up prize...Nope.

She didn't "deserve" the Presidency, she doesn't "deserve" the Veep position, either.

Obama can do better.

No means no. No is always no. When they say no, they mean 1000 times no.

I'm predicting Napolitano or Sebelius.

No plus no equals no
All nos lead to no no no
Finger pointing, eyebrows low
Mouth in the shape of the letter O
Pardon me -- No!
Excuse me -- No!
May I stay?
Can I go?
No, no, no
Do this -- No!
Don't do that -- No!
Sit, stay, roll over
No, no, no
Finger pointing, eyebrows low
Mouth in the shape of the letter O
Red means stop. Do not go.
No, no, no

A "They Might Be Giants" fan! I commend your taste.

A "They Might Be Giants" fan! I commend your taste.

I thought he made it up. In any case, I agree. NO NO NO!

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I do too, even though my 4-year-old daughter tests my appreciation by playing "Here Come the 123s" at least 3 hours every day. Sometimes she substitutes her own lyrics, and that's always fun, but after enough consecutive repetitions, even music you like can begin to wear you down.

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I am so sick of all these damn Godfather tactics from Clinton and her aides.

No one is owed *anything*.

Obama earned the nomination pure and simple and he gets to pick who is best able to carry his message.

Besides, her negatives with voters will not go down just because she's in the veep slot. Obama is smart enough to know this.

I find solace in the comments that seem to show reality is finally settling in. Perhaps now the tone will change and Senator Clinton find her road out in her own time and fashion.

This can go a long way to jump starting the effort for the common goal of ending the eight-year disaster we've all endured.

As to the joint ticket. I think I need more time to make a more reasoned assessment. In the meantime, it seems I'll have plenty to read.

I will be perusing a series over at the New Republic that can be found here:

(http://blogs.tnr.com/tnr/blogs/the_plank/archive/2008/05/08/ed-kilgore-on-the-unity-ticket.aspx)

NO. NO. NO. NO. NO. NO. & NO.

That wouldn't not be turning the page on the past and only inviting in the stench of scandal after scandal after scandal that will undoubtedly follow the Clintons into Obama's administration.

NO. NO. NO. NO. NO. NO. & NO.

Oh, and OF COURSE Terry would want it. Just like snake oil salesman, Harold Ford does. As will Evan Bahy.

The DLC is dying right before their every eyes. HRC as VP is the ONLY way to keep the DLC's life support machine on.

The DLC is dead. Long live the Democratic Party!

Can I bump a NO from you..coz I run of No's for Hillary and Need one more NO.

I meant I ran out of Nos for Hill...

I meant I ran out of Nos for Hill...

No 'borrowing' necessary. It's all yours.

See what being cute gets ya?

:-P

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Extraordinarily well said. You have hit squarely on its head the final nail in the coffin carrying the DLC to its resting place.

Long live the Democratic Party!

Given how much of Obama's campaign relies on themes of unity and moving past existing political division, I think it would be much less discordant to offer Clinton his VP slot than you do.

Again:

NO. NO. NO. NO. NO. NO. & NO.

That wouldn't not be turning the page on the past. It would only inviting in the stench of scandal after scandal after scandal that will undoubtedly follow the Clintons into Obama's administration.

That is short term thinking, you're doing; the kind of thinking that lost us both house of congress for 12 years. The kind of thinking that caused Hillary to cote for the Iraq war. It's the DLC way of thinking. Expedience isn't what's best.

What better way to close the book on the past than make our decisions based on fifteen year-old Republican smears?

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By not grabbing back a hold of it and actually move past the Bush/Clinton/Bush brand of politics.

this attempt at logic is idiotic. using the same formula, we should advocate for Obama to pick President Bush as his VP.

the fact is, it's time to turn the page on all of it. the Clintons, the Bushes, and the entire left v. right dichotomy. Hillary Clinton embodies counterproductive partisanship and petty politics more than any person in either party outside of the current administration. we want to move past that, not invite it to play a more significant role.

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At this moment, with all the recent memories of how Hillary has handled her campaign, I cannot abide the thought of Hillary as VP or even in Reid's Senate leadership role.

Why give manipulative Hillary any role that sets her up with any real power to sabotage President Obama as he works hard to change the old games in Washington?

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What DonnaG said.

Whether you agree with him or not, Obama has campaigned on the idea of being a uniter. Clinton is a polarizer. It makes no sense whatsoever.

Oil and water.

Hillary is not a team player. She'd be a horrible running mate. It would end up being the start of her 2012 presidential campaign--because this is, after all, all about Hillary.

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That's right. She's shown the willingness to do anything - even damage the party - to be the prez. She won't want to wait until she's 68. Trip Obama and come back in 4 when McCain drives the country deeper into the ditch - that would be her next strategy.

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Fuck Terry.

Hillary Clinton and Barack Obama are themselves going to have to decide who they think is going to be their best Vice President.

Like Clinton has a leg in this stupid idea of pairing them.

She sure as hell does have a leg. She has the potential to deliver FL and AR, which means she offers as much as any Democrat in the country.

When's the last time you voted on the basis of who the vice president was?

**She has NO leg. She has cankles. We don't need no steenking cankles. Hell to the Damn NO.

who in their right mind would want bill clinton hovering in the background of their presidency as he would should hil be the vp?

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I just have to say to everyone above: I've been laughing the whole way through these comments--thanks for the fun!

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If you were Obama, would you want Bill walking around the WH?

John McKay: I hear your advance work is unbelievable.
Bill McKay: (frowns)
John McKay: Hey Mabel, guess what? Bud here's running for the Senate.
Mabel: (patronizingly) That's real good, Bud.

****

Can't any longer play off black against old - young against poor. This country cannot house its houseless - feed its foodless.

If I were Obama, I'd give Bill a very prestigious ambassadorship: he could be the first American emissary to Alpha Centauri.

Them space chicks are hot!

Ouch - I didn't even think of that angle.

Okay ... I'm now ready to cast my vote:

NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO!!!!!!

Hillary for Senate Majority Leader! Hillary for Governor of New York! Take my Senator, please! (Before she ruins our presidential ticket...)

Big question about Hillary as veep: What does Bill do?

No way it would work.

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What does Bill do?

I think the better question is Who, not what.

If I were Obama I wouldn't let Bubba anywhere near Michelle. He'd be playing footsies with her as they all stood at the victorious podium on election night.

The roadblock won't be Hillary so much. It will be good ole Bill.

And I can't see actually wanting Hillary a heartbeat away from the Presidency anyway. But it's still up to Obama and he doesn't need to make any sort of decision now.

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One of the most enjoyable side effects of this election is having Terry McAuliffe consigned to his proper place in the dustbin of history.

Carville, Begala--you're next--buh-bye!

Putting Hillary Clinton on an Obama ticket would be like partnering Roseanne Barr with Fred Astaire.

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Putting Hillary on the ticket would diminish Obama's integrity. She has smeared him, called him not ready to be C&C, demeaned his policy positions, demeaned his judgement. How could she possibly speak in his support. Oh Yeah, she has no problem doing a one eighty because she really has no concrete principals.

A good analysis of why this is a bad idea is in TNR:

http://blogs.tnr.com/tnr/blogs/the_plank/archive/2008/05/09/michael-tomasky-on-the-unity-ticket.aspx

One problem is that I think a Clinton choice would be aimed solely at Democrats. It would be popular among them, but what about non-Democrats? Let's note something that's been little remarked upon so far this season. People keep talking about the stunning turnout in these primaries, and, for primaries, this has surely been the case. About 33 million people have voted.

But how many people voted in the last general election? Around 122 million. With interest seeming higher this year, and if Obama can indeed register many new voters, there is every reason to think that 100 million more people will vote on November 4 than have voted cumulatively over the last 18 weeks. Hillary on the ticket would clearly go down well among a large majority of the 33 million who've voted. But what about the other 100 million? How would putting Hillary Clinton on the ticket strike them?
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Wow. Even a pro like Kennedy needs a spokesperson to come back and clean things up because he's so disgusted with Clinton.

I hate the idea, but I think its necessary. For one, Hillary isn't just ANY second place finisher. She's a national brand within the party and the wife of a former President. She has a HUGE base of supporters, many of whom will pitch in both time and money to see her make it into the WH. Also, it isn't like she got clobbered in the primaries. If anything, she has demonstrated that her supporters were willing to stick by her through four months of campaigning. That's saying something.

There is virtually no other Democrat who ....

A) ... has a national following.
B) ... can generate money and enthusiasm within the same ballpark as HRC
C) ... has gone through a rigorous vetting process and been adjudged to be commander-in-chief material.


There has been no vetting of either of the Clintons since they left the White House. That was eight years ago.

Bill's work as a consultant for Dubai on the ports deal, alone, could take up, what, four weeks of press attention during the general election.

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I concur.

This thread seems full of 'bitter voters'

C'mon, guys, Hillary supporters need to have a bone thrown their way.

Bone, then may be Secretary of Textiles on something, but VP....No way.

or the supreme court or whatever ... just not VP!

Watching that campaign would be like watching Curb Your Enthusiasm.

Why does she deserve a bone? Because she demands it? It's his decision. His criteria should be a. a leader that can step in to be pres. b. someone who brings in votes or at least doesn't take them away. He might be thinking, c. someone who shares his vision of unity... which is definitely NOT the Clintons. Then there's d., someone who hasn't said that he's unfit to be CinC.

**I am standing here with four fingers down, and the middle up. Bone enough for ya?

On point b)What money - her own? The big secret is all the money all her supporter are going to give has been given. And she blew it.
I don't think any of Obama campaign money was from his pocket. I am really amazed that you would say Clinton will generate money for Obama.

Sounds like a winner to me. Nothing says change like having the former president's wife as your VP, with Bill Clinton running around the White House as a bonus.

And as an added benefit, Obama gets to answer the "Hillary has said McCain is more ready to be president than you. So is your VP a lier or not?"

Yep, I am all over this idea.

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Yeah, I can see the Republican adds now: "Not ready on day one, but his VP is." You already burned that bridge, Hillary.

You know, here I thought that Obama talked a great deal not only about change, but also about unity, moving past old divisions and working with old adversaries. I like Barack Obama and I like his message, and I think that selecting Hillary Clinton as his VP would actually embody it very well.

Obama will have no problem working with her as a senator from New York, but there are MUCH better tickets than Obama/Clinton. If that wasn't the case then I'd say suck it up and put her on the ticket. Why would Obama want to instantly rejuvenate the Republican base by waving the Clinton red meat in front of them?

Obama is about making the right long term decisions, not the short sighted quick fix ones.

I have no doubt that he and Clinton will be able to work together fruitfully if he wins the general. But politics also involves a lot of symbolism, and a lot of the reason that people are objecting to Clinton being Obama's VP is because of exactly that symbolism.

But it would also have some really positive symbolic effects to go along with the negative ones.

I actually do think that there are better choices for VP than Hillary Clinton, and I honestly think she'd be doing herself a disservice by taking the job. But just because she's not the best choice doesn't mean she's not a good choice.

Yea, but I tend to want to go with the best choice.

A very good article. I thought the analysis in Mark Schmitt's piece is good as well.

http://blogs.tnr.com/tnr/blogs/the_plank/archive/2008/05/08/mark-schmitt-on-the-unity-ticket.aspx

The talk about Clinton as VP, as well as rumors about Obama taking on her campaign debt is very frustrating. IMO, not only should she not get the VP slot, she should be downright shunned for the type of campaign she has run. For her to get the nomination now, isn't she advocating a superdelegate override that would have huge implications and a devastating effect on the party? Isn't her message now that we should override and ignore millions of votes (and something like 80% of the black vote) in order to appease white voters? Isn't that her argument? Wouldn't that scenario have a major effect on race relations in the US?

I understand that scenario is certainly not going to play out. But the fact that she is still pushing the idea is so hurtful and damaging that I just don't understand how anyone could consider the idea of her as VP or even the idea of "debt forgiveness". Besides, Obama's message is that of a new Washington, new ideas, etc. Offering her the VP slot or paying her debts just because that's "how it's done" strikes me as old politics in it's worst form.

There would have been a greater possibility of this had the Clinton campaign not floated the idea of a Hillary-Obama ticket when Obama was already ahead.

But I don't see it making sense for Obama - it lets the GOP play both the race card and rehash all the old (and, who knows, new real or manufactured) Clinton scandals at the same time. Running against Hillary Clinton and her liberalism has rallied their base for the past 16 years, and they'd love the chance to do so again.

As Nancy Reagan used to comment: "Just say No."

Another example of the Clintonistas who smoked, but didn't inhale, or was that inhaled, but didn't smoke? MacAuliffe is the epitome of a loser. His Big Blue (Screw the Rest of You) State strategy didn't work in 2000 and 2004 and there is ABSOLUTELY NO REASON to even allow Hillary close the water closet of the Oval Office.

Let me be more extreme.

Given the poor (sore) loser behavior of Hillary Clinton's campaign and their Swift Boat tactics of the past 3 months against Barack Obama, I say, Clintonistas, that $10.5 Million of self-loaned debt you've given to your campaign.... you're on the hook for that money sister.... every F'ing cent of it!

As reported in the Daily Kos today, Clintonistas have turned the screw-u on Michigan's delegation who brokered a compromise to have their delegates seated, and the pledged votes allocated 69-59, with a 10 vote margin to HRC. NOOO, wasn't good enough for Empress Hillary.

Keep up bad behavior Hillary. The only Political Party that will seat you will be the Joseph Lieberman Independent Democratic Party of Connecticutt. Normally, I'm not one to advocate piling on, but given HRC's conduct following her NC loss and the virtual tie in Indiana (Thanks, Rush Limbaugh, you moron).... this political candidate doesn't deserve a note of recognition.

Sister Clinton, you've got three weeks to shape up your attitude and get with the program. Unify the Democratic Party so we can go out there and kick John McBush's ass around the nation this fall and allow may other Deomcrats to take over for mindless Repug's in the House and Senate.

No Frigging Way!

Her appalling behavior the last couple of days is leading me to believe that she isn't even worthy of Senate majority leader. It is even more appalling considering that she wants $11M paid back to her and Bill and $20M to retire their other campaign debt of which half is owed to Mark Penn! Yeah right.

Obama should just continue to take the high road, act Presidential, take on McCain without even commenting on her, and let her go off and do what she needs to do until she completely runs out of money. Then, he can graciously bid her well and pick Webb, Richardson, or Bayh as his running mate.

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Hillary for Jr. Senator of NY.

NO May be Jr. Senator from AK.

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You forgot a "No".

heraldsquare

Should I take that as a no ?

Obama-Clinton ticket definitely not a great idea. If the nomination is swiped from Sen. Clinton, Obama will crash and burn in November and the Democratic Party will be a train wreck. Hillary supporters will be voting McCain. McCain will be president, and we will see a third term of Bush under McCain and Roe v. Wade may vanish.

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"If the nomination is swiped from Sen. Clinton"

Heh. I thought you were serious, then I saw this and realized your post is snark.

Obama should offer to make her the first Supreme nomination. The SC is down one woman and will likely lose the other soon enough, so he'd probably want to nominate a woman anyway. She can make the best use of her legal mind, and 'fight for hard working white people' in a black robe instead of a pant suit. She may even make some good decisions and won't be able to start a war. Best of all we won't have to hear her. Richardson as Sec of State, Edwards as AG, and some old white guy as VP so fewer of the seniors won't be scared. Bada bing, done. Roll them out before August.

"Best of all we won't have to hear her."

This is why she'll never accept it. No appreciable public forum.

I would NOT vote for Obama even if Hillary were the VP candidate.

I Hope like HELL she does NOT even consider this for a minute !

In the event she does NOT get the nom. and I'm still holding out hope that the SDs will see that we need her as the nom to win the GE....

but if they feel they just have to let Adlai Stevenson Obama have it, then she can run again in 2012. I just hope the Dem. party will forgive her for losing. They normally won't accept a candidate 2nd time around like the repugs do.

But another upside of her not getting the nom. is that it will be fun to watch Obama go down in flames while we vote for McCain.

rae

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Rae, you're a joke. No real Dem flakes off over this. No progressive flakes off over this. Nobody who hates the last 7+ years of Bush & Co. flakes off over this.

Whatever you are - troll or not - you are not a Democrat, you are not a progressive, and you aren't really afraid of 4 more years of Bush policy.

Call it what it is... what are you ashamed of?
Progressive = Liberal.

You "progressives" are pathetic trying to change your image by changing the term to "progressive". Who do you think you're fooling?? It sounds like you're ashamed of what you are.

As for what I call myself, I'm not either. I'm an independent. Your comment shows you know very little about the politics of this election.

There are about 35% of the voters out there, just like me so hate me or not, you're stuck with us. Just another reason your far leftist elitist Kerry/Kennedy/Stevenson remake, will LOSE.

New Flash Missy--- Hillary already lost, so you need some of that Hope we talk about...Hope Obama looses, Hope Hillary Runs Again and Hope...heck of a lot of hope for four fucking years....

Keeping hoping sissy.

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SImple, the good word 'liberal' has been given a bad name. Just like what you're doing to independent. I too, am an independent. I'm an independent who's frightened by Bush policies. I'm a part of the 35% you mentioned. Your vapid comments are not representative of the entire 35%, 'my friend'. And the racist types like you I don't care about voting for McCain - he can have you. Good riddance.

No no no... I'm talking about the 35% of Hillary voters that have vowed, no matter what, they will NOT vote for Obama.

So NO, you're NOT part of that 35%.

And just to rub it in a little more...

Your guy can't win without us.

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So you give less than a shit about any of the things Hillary Clinton claims to be a fighter for, up to and including making sure Roe v. Wade is not overturned. For you it is nothing but a vitriolic cult-of-personality fanboy/girl thing and not about positions, principles, policy, or governance.

Any Clinton supporter who claims that they are either sitting it out or voting McCain who is the polar-opposite of what Clinton says she stands and fights for, is an utter fraud.

So why do you support Clinton yet hate everything Clinton says she is fighting for so much?

How can you really care about what she says she cares about if you are so willing to knowingly work against what Clinton says she is fighting for by either sitting it out or voting McCain?

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(crickets)

The term "progressive" has been around in political circles for over a hundred years, sister (see: LaFollette, Bob - and that's just off the top on my head). The only people who don't know this are the ones living under a rock...or a bridge. Hey, you know who lives under bridges? Trolls!!!

Okay in four years...countdown begins...1600 days or so to go.....make a chart or something...keep yourself busy...later bye...

For now....as we hear all the time in New York City

Stand clear the closing door please...


What do you say to the primary voters that followed the process and elected Obama as the democratic nominee?

I don't think the super delegates are giving Obama anything- he earned it through superior campaign management, fund raising and well, being the better candidate.

How do you spin a Clinton primary victory via super delegates as something that doesn't smack of undeserved entitlement? I thought the whole process of voting for a democratic nominee was part of the vetting process.

Also, why would you vote for McCain over Obama if you really believe Hillary is a superior candidate on the issues? It seems odd that instead of picking someone that is nearly identical to Obama on the issues, you would choose McCain who doesn't represent any of Hillary's platform.

This kind of spite and infantilism is precisely why I don't like the Clinton campaign.

This is silly and illogical. If you say you would vote for McCain over Obama, then why would you vote for Hillary in the first place? Her platform is nearly identical to Obama's.

Obama wouldn't be be given the democratic nomination, either- he has earned it by obtaining more votes and more delegates. His campaign management and fund raising has been vastly superior to Hillary's.

If Hillary usurped the nomination, how is she supposed to spin it to the states and voters that followed the process and voiced their choice: Obama?

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So you give less than a shit about any of the things CLinton claims to be a fighter for, up to and including making sure Roe v. Wade is not overturned. For you it is nothing but a vitriolic cult-of-personality fanboy/girl thing for you.

Any Clinton supporter who claims that they are either sitting it out or voting McCain is an utter fraud.

So why do you hate everything Clinton says she is fighting for so much?

How can you really care about what she says she cares about if you are so willing to knowingly work against what Clinton is fighting for by either sitting it out or voting McCain?

Sheep-dip indeed.

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(crickets)

LOL. I am sure that's what is happening right now.

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May I just add my simple, humble NO FUCKING WAY to this page?

And additionally, after making 4 or 5 donations to Barack I would be really pissed if he used my money to help pay off the debts she ran up trashing him and insulting every decent, thinking, hard working American who has any sense of decency. She can ask Elton flipping John to do another fundraiser to reimburse her for her self-indulgences - but not my money, honey.

Hmmmmm..........

This trial balloon appears to be going over like a lead balloon.

Wave!

THIS...

IS

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EXCELLENT

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You misspelled excrement.

NEWS

FOR HILLARY!!!!!!

Al over at The Field posted a good list of Vice President choices for Barack Obama.

Strategically speaking, the democratic party would benefit a great deal more if Hillary stayed a senator of New York. She's on the Committee on Armed Services, the Committee on Environment and Public Works, and the Committee on Health, Education, Labor and Pensions. Veep is a show horse position and in my opinion her status out ranks it.

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Missing one great choice: AL GORE.

Yeah, I know, "why would he ever want to do that again?"

Just 4 years Al, c'mon. You get to be in charge of environmental policy, run (fix) the EPA, and you keep a low profile - none of the usual veep BS. Just stay behind the scenes and help make things happen - like Cheney, only for the side of good instead of evil? Whaddaya say ol' buddy, one more round just for kicks?

And send Bubba on a long cruise around the world. He looks like he's going to burst a blood vessel any minute now.

On reflection... I have come to the conclusion this is a bad idea. My rationale? Two words.... Lanny Davis.

Ha! And my two words: Bill Clinton

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Yeah, can't you just see him second guessing Obama every step of the way, blaming him for anything that goes wrong and trying to take credit for anything that goes right?

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And my two words: Hillary Rodham Clinton.

Not gonna happen. Uncle Teddy says so.

And she won't bring that much to the ticket. And there is too much bad blood between them.

I would say he should choose Tim Kaine or Jim Webb.

McCain would run ads with video of Obama's own running mate saying that Obama isn't qualified to be commander in chief, but McCain is.

What's she going to say?

Maybe: "I must have been tired all of the times I said that."

Or: "He wasn't ready a few months ago, but campaigning against me prepared him for dealing with terrorist attacks at 3 a.m."

Or: "I was lying. Don't tell me you still take anything I say seriously!"

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No, she'd just cackle.

Bender - when you're right, you're right.

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As distasteful as this may seem, and I know there are a bunch of you who object, it IS actually a smart and proper use of campaign funds. The point of that money we donated is to win. If giving the Clinton campaign $12.5 mil to close up shop ensures the win, then WTF, just do it and get the deal done. Of course, it should be highly conditional on her stopping the race-baiting and negative attacks on Obama, a set end date with an announcement from her that she's done, etc. Once all conditions are met in good faith, they get the money.

I haven't really thought about it but I don't like it on principle. Also, her supporters are already saying it's a "pay off." Nonsense but I don't want to feed that.

I know it's a lot of money but the Clintons are loaded and Bill's future income is enormous. Christ, they could write a check for it today.

I don't think this is even legal.

As someone in another thread said, their Godfather tactics are sickening. Nobody owes her anything. If she lost, she lost. She lost in February but was in denial. Her campaign was profligate. Too bad, so sad. Make some speeches and pay it off yourself.

But Obama has already won and people are listening to Hillary less and less. Everything she says now is being put into the context of a sore loser.

A month or so ago this made some sense. Now, not so much. That money would be better spend buying ads against McCain or helping other congressional candidates win their races.

And that is exactly how Obama should frame his response. Put Clinton on the defensive by painting her as the one trying to take money donated by millions of small donors away from the effort to help Democrats in the fall.

She's rich. She can handle it. Think of the working class people Hillary or was that just a slogan.

It will have a substantial impact on his future ability to raise funds through his grassroots efforts.

Yup, BO is not stupid. He is not about to kill the golden goose (geese as it were). Billary can go suck a lollipop.

Ha. Obama ain't Black, he's PINK!

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You already lost. Go away.

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As is the color of your douchebag.

Strictly from the standpoint of compensating for his perceived weaknesses, I do not think she would be a good choice for Obama. I don't know anything about Jim Webb's abilities as a campaigner or his willingness to be tapped, but he has all the right attributes on paper.

YES.
YES.
YES.

I concur.

This brings up an issue that I have wondered about for a long time:

Every time that I've voted in a Presidential election, I was given a choice for "President and Vice President". I think that I instead should be given a choice for "President" and a choice for "Vice President".

Of course, in the past, this concern was entirely theoretical.

In the past.

Obama considering Hillary for nomination to Supreme Court.

I assume this is not because I suggested it here ten minutes ago.

Link?

There's no real upside for Obama. Hillary has a lot of baggage and there are many who would never vote for her under any circumstances. Having her on the ticket will trigger all of the old right wing talking points that bedeviled her during the nineties.

Obama can easily find someone else to will balance the ticket. Edwards, Hagel, Nunn, Richardson. There are plenty of choices.

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You can't have a VP who can't control his & her ego.

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When Terry McAuliffe says a joint ticket would be swell, he means with Hillary ON TOP. Why is everyone assuming he means that Hillary would be willing to be Obama's running mate?!?

Obama has a lot of better choices available, ones that would unify the party and help his chances in November, without the downsides Hillary herself would bring.

If Hillary weren't turning into the Dem Katherine Harris, she'd have a wonderful future in the Senate.

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Look, I know this is one big fat party foul, but...

THIS IS GREAT NEWS! FOR HILLARY!

This seems like it has some advantages support-wise, but I think it's a bad idea. Some Clinton supporters my in fact vote McCain, but the number will be very small. If he has her as VP (2 for 1, natch, enter Willy...) I can see how every single press conference during his term will go. Any decision taken, every statement made, any position moved towards, the first question you'll hear is "Have you discussed this with the VP or the former President?" Having those two anywhere near his administration will be All-Clinton, All the time. I can't see Hillary approaching that job as anything less than the Co-Presidency (after Cheney, she'll even have some precedent, god help us...)

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And that would mean that Big Dog Bill would be behind the scenes trying to control everything.
No, no, a thousand times no. This isn't 1980 Bush v. Reagan primary season.

No way Obama - Inouye

Hello, new to this site but being reading post here for a while. I truly disagree with Hillary as VP. I am not older enough to remember JFK and Johnson but JFK was set up!! You must trust your VP and Hillary wants to be the President at any cost.

I doubt Clinton wants to be tied to another loser.

She will try again after 4 more years of mcsame.

Nice work Obama kool aid drinkers.

Still waiting on your hero to lead.

I doubt if ever will, all he has to do is write a speech.

it appears as usual you OBAMA folks don't really give a darn about those who Strongly support hilliar. what you should realize it that joint ticket may be the only way you get a lot of our support come the general. we will either stay whom or vote mccain.

i really think you guys don't truly think it possible for many to sit this one out.

aren't you the same moron who posted ugly smears against Obama week after week...two words for you...f.u.

one word - Seconded.

Got alife Inouye is the only one that can shut down the right wing...They can not Deny:
That he comes from poor background
Earned the medal of Honor
Has more legislative experience of any of the above combined.
Bipartisan
Get a life gotalife
Obama Inouye 2008!


And by the way can not be accused of playing the race card.

kordo - Totally. Both Hillary and Bill love the spotlight too much to play second fiddle to Obama. It's hard to imagine her quietly toeing the line. Ditto Bill.

As Diana said about the menage a trois she had with Charles and Camilla, the presidency would be a little crowded.

And what would President Obama do, if the husband of his VP, gets caught in another Bimbo Eruption. Hillary will not dump the creep, and President Obama will have his Presidency severely damaged, because he did not use good judgment, by not picking Hillary.

No one can control Bimbo Bill, and Hillary will not dump him, so that makes it far too risky to put her on the ticket.

Let us start with a clean slate, instead of another blue stain waiting to happen.

Anyone who says that they will vote for McCain or stay home is not a true Democrat, and does not care if the Far Right Wingers stack the Supreme Court for decades to come.

We do not let such Faux Democrats dictate who the VP will be. Piss off Right Wing Arse Trolls.

I've said it before, but I'll say it again. If Obama doesn't see that she's impeached, I'm voting McCain.

If Obama doesn't see that she's impeached, I'm voting McCain.

Yeah, we know. And if Obama doesn't personally come to your little troll house and offer to make you Secretary of State you're also voting McCain.

Our only solace is that we know Gramps wasn't your first choice.

Try giving your sense of humour -- assuming you have one -- some exercise, and your knee-jerk snark a rest.

Loosen up that eye patch, Bubb - I think it's cutting off the circulation to your brain.

Oh ... were you kidding in the first place?

In that case, death by snark!

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Huh?

Actually "FreeBubba" is a very apropos moniker because what we really need to do is put Bubba in a padded cell until:

1) mid-November

or

2) whenever his brain starts functioning normally again.

... whichever come first.

Noooooooooooo!

Ay! Now we have to defeat Hillary for VP too?

It's a bad idea.
It's a very bad idea.
It's a really really horrible idea.

Obama's mama didn't raise a fool. He's not going to hitch his wagon to the most loathed Democrat in the country and her reckless, radioactive husband and his undisclosed foreign billionaire contributors. Can you imagine Obama wanting to watch Bill, ostensibly campaigning for Obama, barnstorming the country talking about how great the Clinton years were?

And why hand the GOP the most hated brand name in Dem politics, Hillary Clinton, as a golden campaign issue?

Obama knows full well that the Clintons would simply set up a rogue shadow presidency on his watch, Cheney-times-two. They'd buy him a world of trouble.

Obama's defeated Hillary once; why give himself the burden of living cheek to cheek with her sour vengeance?

From the horse's mouth to god's ear.

Well put!

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"rogue shadow presidency"

Yes, and consider that bill would be Mr. President, even though his wife was VP - and that would leave Barack as President ..... (with two shadow presidents)

Pathetic....monkey chatter....no more no less...

M

Major Manure from one of the Major Manure Spreaders of the bought and paid for Manure Machine.

Hillary Clinton let me do something I never thought I would. Vote for a woman for president in an Oregon primary (where it actually mattered)
I don't think you understand how important it is for me to be able to do that. No, I KNOW you don't know how important it is for me to be able to do that.

now. go on, razz me, be mean spirited to me. denigrate me with your sharp and excellent minds how my sacrifiecs for the freedom you just take for granted don't mean anything now that you have that freedom. . .

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Huh?

Morrigan - It's fabulous that you were able to vote for a woman for president. Seriously - no razz. Lost in the commotion is the wall that Hillary has completely broken down here ... win or lose. Her gender has never even come up in this race. In fact, most of the criticisms leveled at her are the opposite of what you'd expect if her gender were an issue. For example, she's accused of being overly macho towards Iran. So Hillary has broken the gender barrier and that genie will never go back in the bottle.

Now ... as an added bonus, you also get to vote for a black person for President.

And finally, you would have (hopefully) cast both votes even if the candidates were white males, because they're the two best candidates period.

Most of the posters here would not begrudge you your vote. Support whomever you feel you should in good conscience.

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Not only is it very important that you're ABLE to do that, it's very important that you still DO that.

I would vigorously defend your right to vote for the candidate of your choice, whether I agree with your choice or not. I'm glad you took part in the Democratic primary. It's much better than the apathy of millions who won't vote this year.

I don't think a presidential nominee advocating for change in Washington and a new kind of politics ought to be rewarding 'politics as usual' and 'kitchen sink politics' by saying okay now you can be my VP. Or okay here... let me pay off your debts and all of your own money that you spent that you shouldn't have. That's rewarding irresponsibility.
We are crying out for change and that includes not having someone like Hillary on the ticket. I really want John Edwards to be VP even though he has said he doesn't want the job. I hope Obama tries again to persuade him. I think he is the best man for the job.
I am not very excited about anyone else.
I wrote to the Obama campaign asking them to hold very separate and clear fundraising efforts if they want to raise money to help Hillary with her debts and then I realized that I would be willing to pay $25 to keep her OFF of the ticket! I suprised myself with that. I don't like the idea of a lesser known more obscure VP candidate. I guess I would prefer Bill Richardson after John Edwards only because I think we need all of our democratic Senators working in the senate and can't afford to lose one. I would like to see a hands on VP that will roll up his sleeves and get into it with Senator Obama... bringing about the changes we are hoping for will take some work and a great team makes it much more possible.

I prefer Edwards for Attorney General. That would put him in the ideal position to implement his platform. Plus ... if it turned out that his senate seat was the difference between 59 and 60, it could be put off two years.

Please, tell me this is just a bad joke.

Someone should call ems!

The obama crowd have overdosed on their koolaid. They're so giddy with the fact that their guy only lost Indianna by 2 points instead of 10, that they're talking gibberish.

What the hell are you people muttering? bunch of rubbish that makes no sense except maybe to yourselves. LOL LOL

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So you give less than a shit about any of the things Hillary Clinton claims to be a fighter for, up to and including making sure Roe v. Wade is not overturned. For you it is nothing but a vitriolic cult-of-personality fanboy/girl thing and not about positions, principles, policy, or governance.

Any Clinton supporter who claims that they are either sitting it out or voting McCain who is the polar-opposite of what Clinton says she stands and fights for, is an utter fraud.

So why do you support Clinton yet hate everything Clinton says she is fighting for so much?

How can you really care about what she says she cares about if you are so willing to knowingly work against what Clinton says she is fighting for by either sitting it out or voting McCain?

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You've got it: it's more important that HRC be the nominee than it is to stop the all-out assault on the Constitution that's been the Dubya administration. If HRC loses, so must America. Or in Fox-speak, "Why Do HRC Supporters Hate America?"

cuz Rae-K is for J-Mc-K

But, you've been reading this "rubbish" and responding for two hours. Don't you have anything better to do?

i've been a big obama supporter, and have absolutely hated hillary at times. on the other hand, there are times when i really like her, namely when she focuses on health care.

fellow obama supporters, it is officially time to let go of our hate. if you really are a progressive, you will give her the benefit of the doubt - she wants to win and what's best for the democratic party. please stop hating - IT's DOING NOTHING BUT HARM!

i think an Obama/Clinton ticket is intriguing personally.

granparocks

I agree, Obama/Clinton will full of "intrigues" bullshit.

i've been a big obama supporter, and have absolutely hated hillary at times. on the other hand, there are times when i really like her, namely when she focuses on health care.

fellow obama supporters, it is officially time to let go of our hate. if you really are a progressive, you will give her the benefit of the doubt - she wants to win and what's best for the democratic party. please stop hating - IT's DOING NOTHING BUT HARM!

i think an Obama/Clinton ticket is intriguing personally.

sorry for the double post