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GOP Consultant On CNN: Sometimes It's "Accurate" To Call A Woman A "Bitch"

Hmmm. This isn't very nice.

On CNN a few moments ago, analyst Jeffery Toobin argued that Hillary was right when she said in an interview that coverage of the race has been "sexist," buttressing his case by pointing to a recent newspaper column suggesting that Hillary is a "white bitch." Toobin, unsurprisingly, took issue with this, saying that it was "appalling" that this was considered acceptable.

GOP consultant Alex Castellanos, someone who presumably was on CNN's panel because he'd been invited by the network's producers, disagreed. Check out what he had to say about it...

"Some women, by the way, are named that, and it's accurate," Castellanos said. He went on to buttress his case by pointing out that Hillary is "abrasive, aggressive, irritating."

What's amusing about this is that Castellanos actually argued that it's sometimes accurate to call a woman a "bitch" as a way of making the claim that Hillary was wrong to argue that there's sexism in our political coverage. Pretty twisted stuff.

Hard to imagine that CNN would invite this gallant and chivalrous fellow back on the air, isn't it...


127 Comments

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Is it sexist to call a guy being abrasive, aggressive, irritating a dick?

You tell me the next time they call someone a dick on CNN. I'll bring the beer and popcorn.

"DICK" AIN'T SON OF A BITCH bloodsucker friend ...

good lord.

No more surprising than MSNBC continuing to put Pat "One of Us" Buchanan on the air, Greg.

This is beyond the pale. He should be fired for this.

Can't we all just talk about the ISSUES?!?!?!?!

For once I agree with the troll.

I love you, gotalife.

OMG, you're multiplying!?!

Gotalifefan will be so happy!

Like crabs.

;-)

Multiplying? No. Gotalife, along with Fogu2 and, I'm hearing, Dembillc (Really?) staged what might be called The Space Revolution today and entered true Troll Retirement in a sign of Democratic Unity.

Former fellow performers, seeing an easy path to attention, responded by posting Ghost Performances in what look like their names - though they're poorly structured, and in some cases Simply Scatalogical performances that don't rise to the level of proper review.

The real Gotalife and Fogu2 have updated their avatars in a further sign of unity - so they're easy to tell apart.

It's been a sometimes confusing Trollus Historia today. But it's been heartwarming in all the right ways.

Haven't been on in a while. But, I must say BEST AVATAR EVER!!!!!

I Know! I love Gene Shalit and his puns!

is anyone surprised?

Castellanos is a notorious shit. Also, he's a race-baiter. I am not at all surprised he said that.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Alex_Castellanos

I think this is the kind of garbage that BOTH Clinton and Obama supporters can stand against.

Hillary is a strong, independent woman, as is Michelle Obama, there's nothing "bitch"y about that.

It's time to unite against this kind of GOP bigotry.

I thought had MSNBC had the corner on sexist windbags. How could they let this gem get away?

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Is it sexist to call a guy being abrasive, aggressive, irritating a dick?

Yes indeedie. Someone on a major network called David Axelrod a dick?

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So Jon Stewart is a sexist pig for calling Carlson Tucker a dick?

Learn something new every day.

You really think it's sexist?

I don't think Hillary is a bitch and I'd never condone anyone calling her one, but I think some women are bitches and some men are dicks.

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I don't disagree.

You should hear the some of terms I use to describe John "4 more years" McCain. And don't even get me started on GWB and Cheney. But that's in private talk, not in a newspaper column or on CNN. It is absolutely unacceptable for columnists in newspapers and on TV news to use that kind of language to describe any woman, no matter how personally unpleasant they may find her.

And, Mr. Castellanos, "bitch" is certainly not an "accurate" description of Hillary Clinton. A bitch, to be "accurate," that is, to be literal, is a female dog. When I say that you are a jackass, Mr. Castellanos, that is not an "accurate" description of you, it's a metaphor for "contemptible."

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Ugh.. Tucker Carlson... I am in total brain fart mode tonight.

jon stewart is an entertainer/comedian who is supposed to push boundaries. i don't expect to hear wolf blitzer talking about clusterfuck to the white house either (although I'd pay to see that). If you don't see the difference between a poltical commentator and a satirist, far be it from me to explain it to you.

Forget about Wolf Blitzer or Jon Stewart.

Do you not think some women are bitches and some men are dicks?

Yes, I do.

This reminds me of when Barack Obama was on The Daily Show talking about how the media had called him naive for saying he wouldn't use nuclear weapons on small areas like training camps even if they were for Al Qaeda. Then Obama talked about how military strategists came out agreeing with him and of course then the media started to back step from what they had asked.

Then John Stewart replied with something like, "They probably wanted to say "Oh no, we agreed with you, we just didn't know you could say that on TV."

Unfortunately, Clinton is lately trying to make sexism into the nuclear weapons part of this example, and I don't know how many women will stand up and say "yeah, sometimes women are bitches".

But they totally should. =-D

I personally refer to things people do as bitchy or dickish. I try not to equate someone as a whole with either of those charcteristics as both men and women can do bitchy or dickish things. I thought it was rather dickish for Obama to call that reporter "sweetie" to dismiss her while she was doing her job and asking him a question. I thought it was rather dickish for Senator Clinton to do that whole celestial choirs opening spiel about Obama. I thought Obama was rather bitchy when he refused to debate Hillary and ran away because he had the lead. I thought Senator Clinton was kind of bitchy with the whole Bill Richardson judas thing.

Of course Senator clinton can at times be a bitch, she can also be driven and compassionate and committed and tenacious etc etc etc. To just call her a bitch is such an insult.

dijamo --- Are you being sexist when you say (or think) those things? I certainly don't think so. So while neither term should be used to describe the totality of a person (of either gender), I think you would agree that someone can legitimately say "when you act that way you are being a bitch" and not mean it in a sexist way. ---- In other words "bitch" and/or "dick" are terms that may have their origins in gender-related traits but, as you demonstrate, nowadays refer to specific types of behavior and can be applied to people of either sex. Ergo, it's not automatically sexist to use them.

Interesting observation on MSNBC - Rachel Maddow apparently interviewed Geraldine Ferraro and, someone who listened reported, there was a true generational gap: things that Ferraro felt were offensively sexist simply didn't register with Maddow. I don't think it's necessarily age-related (I'm only slightly younger that Ferraro), but there is some truth that sexism is in the mind of the person hearing something (and whether something was intended to be a sexist slur may well be in the mind of the person speaking).

Dijamo's problem is that she's intelligent and has something of a definition for the slurs and invectives she uses. The vast majority of people are just regurgitating stuff they hear and piling on like fans watching a gladiator fight.

When Obama was ducking Hillary on debates, this is the first thought that ran through my mind: why is he acting so bitchly / like a punk?

When expressing those thoughts to others I said and I quote "If I were Obama, I'd take the chance to get assertive," "Be a man," and called him "COWARD". All terms that I think accurately describe why he was coming across as bitchly to me. Did I resort to actual calling him a bitch or a punk? Absolutely not. Yes I know that in my private thoughts I use those same gendered defintions of bitch that society uses - one of either an aggressive, hard hitting, tough as nails woman or a weak, emasculated and cowardly man.

When expressing myself to others, I try to avoid perpetuating those stereotypes and say what I actually mean. I could call someone a dick or I could call them an obnoxious arrogant windbag.Bitch and other derogatory names/insults are just shortcuts to avoid saying directly what your real issue is with the person.

I find it unacceptable that on a major media news program someone can say criticism that Senator Clinton is a bitch in the media is not sexist because some women ARE actually bitches. I find it more unacceptable that people and so-called democrats are defending that shit.

So she's a Bitch Plus?

Are you suggesting its ok to call her a bitch as long as you recognize her other qualities; the totality of her personality and accomplishments? That's weak.

Bitch Plus. Funny. You could use that term for Hillary if you want to define her as primarilly a bitch (however it is you define that term)and any other qualities she has are secondary/not as important.

Is it okay for me to call Obama a Dick Minus since I find him arrogant, obnoxious and pompous minus assertiveness that I would like to see in my next president?

I find that tone rather infantile and undeveloped, but if that is the level of debate, then let's have at it.

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I was unaware that Wolf Blitzer described anyone a bitch on television.

ANd yes, I am well aware of what satire is, but given that the majority of the things on CNN are not news (and I include all the "analysis" therein to not be news, just big production versions of what we the unwashed masses do in the blogsphere) your counterpoint is rather off the mark.

Jon Stewart also said he thought Barack would make "kind of a dicky boyfriend". Which was in response to Obama's "likeable enough" comment. Stewart's comment was on a comedy show, and was pretty funny. If it had been on a news show, I would expect a more sober analysis.

This is something that supporters of both Clinton and Obama should rise against and deem unacceptable.

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Whatever. Get over yourself.

What this asshole said was deplorable. We all agree on that.

Get over yourself--you can't handle the truth.

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I've frequently referred to Bush as a dickhead and a putz. And I've called Cheney an evil prick.

I know it's not the same thing - but I just can't resist yet another opportunity to say that Bush is a dickhead and a putz and Cheney is an evil prick.

BRAVO! Mission Accomplished.

ABC:

Obama Takes in More Than $31 Million in April ABC News has learned that Sen. Barack Obama, D-Ill., hauled in $31.9 million in April (including $600,000 for the general election) to continue his battle for the Democratic nomination against Sen. Hillary Clinton, D-N.Y. Two hundred thousand new donors joined Obama's effort last month. Obama has an mighty $37.3 million on hand with $9.2 million tucked away for the general election. Camp Obama proves (again) that big money comes in small packages. It's been a pattern since last year but the numbers are still impressive: 1.475 million total donors overall making 2.93 million contributions. The average contribution is $91. The clicks come in small waves: 94% of the contributions to Obama's effort were under $200, 93% of contributions were $100 or less, 77% were $50 or less, and 52% were $25 or less. - jpt

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Is this the same $20 million in Monopoly money that Clinton claimed to bring in last time which turned out to be loans and creative accounting to hide the debt?

Plus over 20 million in debt.

Here's what kos just posted:

"Running a campaign into the ground, fiscally mismanaging it, and entering the general election tens of millions in debt is so electable."

http://www.dailykos.com/storyonly/2008/5/20/202339/321/434/519247

dude, you're sexy

The question is, how much of Hillary's 20M is for the general, and how much is available now?

Also, I'm a bit surprised at McCain's number. For some reason, I thought he's be a little less than that.

$1,000.

Maybe.

;-)

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And how much of it actually exists?

Not including her ~$20 million in debt?

???

More news will come out soon I'm sure. ABC only had these figures.

But I highly DOUBT this includes her debts and that would mean she raised 40 mil.

Na uh.

great, give her ammo to whine about sexism and injustice some more. And of course she and her surrogates will start pointing to this as an example when asked why they assert that Obama is sexist. It never ends:

http://www.thepersonalispolitical.com/2008/05/hillarys-gender-baiting-campaign-is-in.html

Perhaps this might bring some of those Hillary
supporters, who say they will vote for McCain,to their senses.

Paging Geraldine Ferraro. Paging Geraldine Ferraro.

What say you now; Ms Ferraro?

Email from Barack Obama just arrived:

The polls are closed in Kentucky and votes are being counted in Oregon, and it's clear that tonight we have reached a major milestone on this journey.

We have won an absolute majority of all the delegates chosen by the people in this Democratic primary process.

From the beginning, this journey wasn't about me or the other candidates. It was about a simple choice -- will we continue down the same road with the same leadership that has failed us for so long, or will we take a different path?

Too many of us have been disappointed by politics and politicians more times than you can count. We've seen promises broken and good ideas drowned in a sea of influence, point-scoring, and petty bickering that has consumed Washington.

Yet, in spite of all the doubt and disappointment -- or perhaps because of it -- people have stood for change.

Unfortunately, our opponents in the other party continue to embrace yesterday's policies and they will continue to employ yesterday's tactics -- they will try to change the subject, and they will play on fears and divisions to distract us from what matters to you and your future.

But those tactics will not work in this election.

They won't work because you won't let them.

Not this time. Not this year.

We still have work to do to in the remaining states, where we will compete for every delegate available.

But tonight, I want to thank you for everything you have done to take us this far -- farther than anyone predicted, expected, or even believed possible.

And I want to remind you that you will make all the difference in the epic challenge ahead.

Thank you,

Barack Obama

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I know it is boilerplate form the Obama campaign, but there has been no counting of votes yet in Oregon. Just daily tracking of how many ballots have been received and verified against the signature records. We do not have any tabulation being performed yet.

He actually doesn't need Oregon to hit the mark - via Chuck Todd.

Bu,t Oregon will quite possibly hit the other mark of the numbers HRC is using that include Florida & Michigan.

He's right, it's not about him. Anyone could have done the same thing.

Obama is losing the popular vote. He should drop out now and endorse Hillary.

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Except that here in reality he isn't.. and he won't.

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In what world is he losing the popular vote? The fantastical one where MI & FL count, but caucus states don't? Seriously, Clinton supporters need to learn how math works in reality.

U.N.I.T.Y

you ain't a bitch or a hoe -- Queen Latifah

Come on everybody lets show our Faux Hillary our support, lets go to HillaryClinton.com!

I just got Obamaed. And it was great!

And sometimes, it's accurate to call a guy a total douchebag.

CNN will probably give him a regular slot. It's--apparently-- totally fine for MSNBC to have Pat Buchanan and his racist drivel, and it's totally fine for someone like this to get on the air. For god's sakes.

But, you know what? The next president is going to be either a woman or a black dude, so they can all just shove it up their narrowminded little heinies.

This is the sort of thing that exists to be mercilessly lampooned by Jon Stewart.

That is a fundraiser for Clinton.

What a fighter like Clint Eastwood said today.

Hillary!

Hillary!

Hillary!

Clinton Eastwood is a Republican and is supporting McCain.

Yesterday Hillary placed a big wet kiss on Turdblossom, so Republican Eastwood just gave her back some tongue.

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Actually Eastwood is an independent who supported Perot back in the day.

Eastwood/Perot
Norris/Huckabee.

I'm sensing a trend.

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I see no trend there.

Someone who voted Perot is a totally different political animal than one who votes Huckabee.

http://www.politico.com/news/stories/0508/10481.html

Cut the bullshit. Eastwood is backing McCain.

"Though a longtime follower of John McCain โ€” dating back to the Arizona senatorโ€™s 2000 run against George W. Bush in the GOP primary โ€” Clint Eastwood thinks Clinton deserves some serious respect. And enough already with the calls for her to quit."

McCain also does not want her to quit. Notice the pattern.

Eastwood is just saying similar things to what many of us have said (and by the way, he supported Ron Paul this year):

โ€œEverybodyโ€™s trying to talk her into folding, but it doesnโ€™t seem like the spirit of Americana,โ€ Eastwood told Politico.

โ€œPut yourself in the place of [Clinton]: Youโ€™ve gone out there and made a thousand speeches, and youโ€™ve shaken a million hands and youโ€™ve been out there working your ass off,โ€ Eastwood said. โ€œAnd then somebody comes up and says, โ€˜Why donโ€™t you just drop out of it?โ€™โ€

The actor/director/producer/jazz aficionado said Clintonโ€™s fortunes could change: Barack Obama could trip over himself again, as he did with the controversies over his association with the Rev. Jeremiah Wright and Obamaโ€™s remarks about working-class voters clinging to their religion and guns.

โ€œI watch Clinton and feel kind of sorry for her and wonder, โ€˜What are all these people telling her to run away for?โ€™โ€ Eastwood said. โ€œSheโ€™s showing her strength by hanging in there.โ€

Politico noted that this is not the first time that Clint Eastwood has channeled Billy Glad and won't be the last.

This is total trollgate!

I am the real gotalife.

the Other is a BS fraud.

This morning I said I would vote for dem nom. Now they are going after me.

They're the ones on Kool Aid.

ONE OF US! ONE OF US! ONE OF US!

Drink the kounter kool aid.

Actually Goatlife my favorite flavor of Koolaid is Cherry!!!Keep posting Goatlife!!!

What a "Gelding," right, Josh Marshall!

It's not the first time this guy has said something that makes me want to punch the tv screen.

First, I have to say, I think saying either "dick" or "bitch" is an accurate descriptor for ANYONE, as an official contributor on the air on a national news network, is disrespectful and completely inappropriate for the situation.

Secondly, no, those are completely different words. Power dynamics are important. History matters. A slur or insult for a group that has historically been oppressed is always much more insulting an inappropriate than one for the group that has been on top. The N-word carries much more power and history than "cracker," and "bitch" carries much more power and history than "dick."

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So all the women who think and call other women, many who do so about Hillary Clinton I might add, are sexists or are just victims themselves of the male paradigm of culture?

Not quite buying it.

No, women own the word. Like gay people use "fag" and black people use the n-word. It's about reclamation.

When someone from the oppressive group uses it in a completely derogatory manner, that's completely different.

And for the record, yes, many women ARE a) sexist or b) victims of the patriarchal paradigm of culture, absolutely.

And finally, saying any slur or swear word is an appropriate term for someone as a national news network contributor is disrespectful and inappropriate.

Ferocia, you are as wise as your secret weapon is aerosoled.

Hot tranny mess!

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Actually, there IS a proper time to refer to a female as a bitch........

And that time is when a female dog gives birth to a litter of puppies........

As far as i can make out, that is the ONLY time when it is appropriate.......at least on a network cable channel discussing human events.

It is not appropriate to call someone a bitch on national television, however...Hillary IS a self-serving, delusional, BITCH. I have zero qualms about saying it.

Unless you're Hillary Clinton celebrating the fact that Tina Fey delivered a faux-"endorsememt" and announced "Bitch is the new black."

So if a woman (say, me, perhaps) calls another woman (say, Hillary or Geraldine, perhaps) a whiny bitch (not so good), or one heckuva bitch(better), or America's Chief White Bitch (outfuckingstanding!!!!) it's all about the "relevance." If it's perceived as a compliment Hillary has touted it. If it is a slam, it's sexist.

ain't that a bitch? just when you think you have it figured out... sheeeeeeee-it.

Greg, try looking up the column Toobin was referencing. He completely misrepresents it. The column by Maureen Dowd was quoting a joke by the comedian Penn Jillette. If this was an Obama supporter making that much of a leap, I'm sure you'd throw in a line pointing out that they were being dishonest. Too bad you've never held the Clinton supporters to the same standard.

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I think bitch is a slur against woman just the same way we have slurs agains blacks, asians, and mexicans.

People need to monitor their speech.

Can't we call her a schmutz, nudnik, noodge (this would be my preferred option), nebbish, ganef, or dybbuk? All these options are quite useful and share the advantage of "bitch" in that none of them have to be bleeped.

Hmmm... yes... Obama is the one that's sexist...

For every one of Hillary's supporters who said they would not vote or would vote for McCain... THIS IS WHAT YOU GET!

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Sometimes it's accurate to call a Repugnican a filthy Nazi dirtybag and pedophile.

Come on folks. I'm no lover of Toobin, but this is just achingly PC. And in a little while, no one will care about/be shocked by the B-word. I'd be interested to know the ages of the people who are so shocked by the word. Younger people simply do not give the word the weight that older people do. I'm 34, and can say that most people my age say the word quite freely. I work with lots of younger people at my job, and I can tell you that the word has more stigma at all for them. They'll call women bitches, girls will call men bitches, and they'll even punctuate their sentences with it.
Why do some people assign such weight to the b-word? If you don't fear it, you remove it's power. And unfortunately for the b-word haters, Dave Chappelle and Snoop Dogg are more influential cultural forces than the uptight PC police.

"the word has more stigma at all for them" should read "no more stigma at all for them".

To those who think this word is so awful--why do you give this word so much weight. I'm not meaning to be patronizing. I'm honestly interested in the answer.

The word represents a mentality that once existed, and still exists in most of the world, including America, that women who aren't entirely focused on raising a family at home and try to gain for purely personal reasons are somehow going against societal decency.

By the way, anyone have that clip from CNN showing a woman from Kentucky saying that Clinton running for president was "evil" because "the woman's place is in the home?"

Hmm...I never even considered the idea that the b-word means "that women who aren't entirely focused on raising a family at home and try to gain for purely personal reasons are somehow going against societal decency." as you put it. Why do you assign this meaning to it? I understand the argument some people make that says that people will call a woman a bitch when she is displaying any sense of aggression or drive, which would be expected or applauded if demonstrated by a male. I understand this argument--I don't agree with it.
To me, getting all worked up about the b-word is essentially counter-productive to gender equality. The belief that "Bitch is a horrible word...women must be protected from it at all costs" comes from a mentality that sees women as weak and in need of protection. I for one think that women strong enough to be able to handle this word. Thinking that women must be shielded from it assumes weakness. And that's what's sexist.

Sorry, I'm 25, and I find the word offensive still.

Why is it so offensive to you? Honest question.

iceberg, what if i were to say you're mom's a bitch?

you cool like that?

Actually, my mom kind of is a bitch.

It draws females as lesser creatures, in this case dogs.

When you call a woman a bitch, you aren't calling all women bitches. I bet at least half of the people who use the word are unaware of the dog thing. The word has taken on it's own, independent meaning in this sense. And again...assuming women need to be protected from the word is assuming female weakness. That's the real sexism.

Also, if calling a woman a bitch is reducing all women to animals, why do I here women (including older women) calling other women bitches all the time? And save the bullshit about "taking back the word"

I ran this through Babelfish's sex->race converter:
---------------------------------------------------
When you call a black a nigger, you aren't calling all blacks niggers. I bet at least half of the people who use the word are unaware of the subhuman thing. The word has taken on it's own, independent meaning in this sense. And again...assuming blacks need to be protected from the word is assuming black weakness. That's the real racism.

Also, if calling a black a nigger is reducing all blacks to animals, why do I hear blacks (including older blacks) calling other blacks niggers all the time? And save the bullshit about "taking back the word"
---------------------------------------------------
So now it's all clear to me - I hope it's clear to you as well. I tried to run previous posts on the bitch issue through Babelfish as well, but unfortunately the server crashed, though they think they can revive it.

All this discussion on whether or not the world bitch is ever appropriate to be used is totally missing the actual point. I'm 23, and I use bitch myself. That doesn't mean I'm not offended when a male, Republican strategist acting as a CNN contributor says that "bitch" is an accurate descriptor for some women within the context of a mainstream news report on national TV because he finds her "aggressive, irritating, and abrasive." Those are EXACTLY the characteristics that people assign to strong, driven, outspoken women and then demean them using the word "bitch." It's all in context, and this example is COMPLETELY different than me hanging around with my friends.

I understand the difference in context. But that doesn't change the larger point. Toobin said that "Some women, by the way, are named that-[bitch], and it's accurate." I think he's absolutely right. I like women that are strong, driven, and outspoken. That's not what a bitch is. We call guys who are "aggressive, irritating, and abrasive" dicks, pricks, cocks, and all other sorts of gender-specific insults. Why not have a gender specific insult for women that display the same behavior? That's real equality, my friend.

First of all, Toobin is the analyst who agreed with Hillary's assertion that sexism is more acceptable in the media than racism. The person who said "bitch" is accurate for some women is Alex Castellanos.

To answer your question, the reason bitch isn't acceptable in this context is because when a man is ambitious, outspoken, and driven, he's not called a dick or criticized for being abrasive, irritating, or aggressive, he's lauded for his characteristics. When a woman exhibits them, however, she's an abrasive, irritating, and aggressive bitch.

The idea that the use of bitch by men to describe some women on national primetime news, even if those women are abrasive, irritating, and aggressive (which are subjective claims, by the way), is somehow real equality is absolutely ludicrous.

Sorry about the name confusion. I haven't actually watched the clip. I respectfully disagree with your assertion that the b-word is used to slam women who display "ambitious, outspoken, and driven" behavior. You yourself admitted that you use the word with your friends. Do you say it about women who are ambitious and driven? Or do you say it about women who demonstrate other qualities? Since you use it yourself, it's odd that you would make such a broad claim that the b-word is always a slam on women who demonstrate a positive ambition.
You said "The idea that the use of bitch by men to describe some women on national primetime news...is somehow real equality is absolutely ludicrous." Why is my assertion ludicrous? You seem to believe that women are soft, frail creatures who can't stand the pain of hearing a gender specific insult. I think that belief comes from a (probably unconscious) residually sexist belief system, one in which we must protect the virtue and frailness of womanhood. That's a Victorian outlook--and we all know how enlightened they were about gender issues, right! I'm quite comfortable in 2008, myself.

That is s-u-c-h utter BS.

Men who are ' strong, driven, ambitious and outspoken' are just as likely to be referred to in the pejorative as 'dicks'. It is largely a question of degree--pushed to excess, all such traits are negative.

No bitches, no dicks, just douchebags, please.

If Barak were to say to Hilary at the next Dem partay, "Hilary, don't be a douchebag" or "Hilary, that's complete and utter douchebaggery", I'd be okay with that.

So much for women voting Republican this fall.

If the pantsuit fits...

When SNL's Tina Fey did her 'b**** is the new black' spiel, the Clinton campaign embraced it wholeheartedly - can't have it both ways. Sorry.

That's been the 'problem' w/ her campaign. Uber-frontrunner w/ tons of money that she pissed away - as well as her 'brand' name and Superdelegate lead before contest begins - only to suddenly be the 'victim' after you implode. Jeez - we all have archival access to all the positively, inevitable media for her BITD. It wasn't until Doyle pissed away $30mil unnecessarily in a NY Senate campaign and Penn and Bill frittered it all away that we heard about sexism.

There was no hue and cry re 'b****' when she got to use that and Barack's pillows in the debate re the first question crap. Both ways - no.

Saturday Night had already posed Hillary as the witch a month or two before.

Trying to pull out your self-respect when someone's calling you a bitch is perfectly reasonable. Men argue, women bitch. It's the unlevel playing field, and you act like Hillary's trying to have it both ways. She's just trying to have it ONE FAIR WAY. She's moving around trying to find a strategy that works. After a year of Chris Matthews making comments like, "she makes me want to cross my legs", she finally slammed him - she got his colleague suspended over the "pimp" comment and she so demeaned Matthews by giving him a hug and a pinch on the cheek. He looked like a 3-year-old leaving his mother for daycare. A sexist image she placed on him after a year of sexist indignity.

wow, all this commenting energy spent dissecting the word 'bitch' and who can use it and who can't.

Seems pretty simple to me; black people can call themselves 'ni&&er'. White people can't call them that.

Women can refer to themselves as 'bitch' if they want. Men can't call them that. As pointed out above, it has a lot to do with the past history of oppression.

Name-calling is inherently stupid. It undermines the credibility of any argument one might have. Now, one could describe bitchy/dickish behavior -- without using those terms -- but with specific examples for support.

Name calling just makes a person look ignorant, or as being from West Virginia. Wait... that's redundant.

Man, if I made a list of every politician that I thought was a bitch or a dick, my hand would fall off. To be sure, they come in different flavors such as corporatist bitches or war mongering dick, etc., but they convey they get the same general point across. Most politicians are repugnant and inadequate human beings.

Irrespecitve of how innapropriate for Castellanos to say what I was already thinking on national TV,if politics has become so precious that we, as private citizens on a message board, castrate our language and leave it to late night comedians "push boundaries" and to deliver the truth while we get fucked over by politicians, then this ship is surely sinking.

The fact of the matter is that our domain of choices as voters has shrunk so alarmingly that the majority of our options are bitches and the tactless dicks who get on national TV to bash bitches.

Still, even though I wish for better, I can't help but point out that, while Clinton's campaign has been devoid of anything remotely resembling substantive politics, she has made it very clear that she is a selfish bitch.

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Let's just be safe and use the all encompassing Asshole.

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Castellanos - future member of the Washington Post Writer's Group.

Our offense has probably caught Hiatt's eye, and he's setting aside column space as we speak. If he gets a reaction burning a cross, he'll be put on staff.

the number one political team on television ???

smells like number two to me

So, if being "abrasive, aggressive, irritating" are the benchmarks, then can we all call Dick Cheney a bitch?

gary

Alex Castellanos should be taken off CNN!

What an IDIOT! I'd expect that of MSNBC But NOT CNN!

Just another asshole.....

To those who are making the n-word/b-word parallel--sorry, but it doesn't work. When you use the n-word, you're implicitly slamming all blacks as inferior. When you call a woman a b****, you're only referring to that person in particular. Try to make your case on its own merits, and quit making false parallels. The fact that people are relying on these fake analogies shows me that they don't have a real argument.

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Congratulations. I'm linked here by Digby, who uses this comment thread to demonstrate that alleged progressives have no idea what sexism is.

http://digbysblog.blogspot.com/2008/05/you-can-believe-us-by-digby.html

Digby is no Clintonista and goes out of her way to excuse Senator Obama from the dreadful conduct of the MSM and the blogosphere during this campaign.

Embarassing.

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Congratulations. I've linked below to Digby, who cites to this very comment thread to demonstrate that many "progressives" have no idea what sexism is.

http://digbysblog.blogspot.com/2008/05/you-can-believe-us-by-digby.html

Digby is no Clintonista and goes out of her way to excuse Senator Obama from the dreadful conduct of the MSM and the blogosphere during this campaign.

Embarassing.

Sorry, but I'm calling bullshit on this. And I think the amount of self-righteousness here is ludicrous. This analogy doesn't work because while the n-word automatically slams all blacks, the b-word just refers to one woman--or, increasingly, one man. Again, the younger generation understands this--those not blinded by self-righteous victim-stance taking do, anyways.

I registered just so I could comment on this thread, specifically to the ridiculous nature of iceberg's increasingly nonsensical tail-swallowing.

1. How do you get that calling someone the n-word is slamming all blacks, but calling someone the b-word is NOT slamming all women?

2. Women do not need to be protected from this word. People in general need to be more respectful of other human beings. Using that word as a pejorative is not being respectful of another human being.

3. Women have the right to use that word when describing themselves or when joking with friends who have already signaled that such use does not offend them. It is NEVER ok, for women OR men, to use that word as a pejorative.

4. It is never ok for a man to call a woman a bitch on national TV or any other public forum. That is sexist, unprofessional, and rude. It is RARELY ok for a man to EVER call a woman a bitch.

5. Regardless of the fact of the source (as part of a comedy routine), this incident has CLEARLY dragged out into the light of day the fact that sexism is still alive and well, and just waiting for a little encouragement to rear its ugly head.

6. Women do not FEAR this word -- we hate it, and with good reason. Here's a good way to figure out how it feels to be called a bitch. Imagine having a conversation in a crowded room with someone -- friend, coworker, boss, lover. Now imagine that, in the middle of the conversation, that person slaps you hard across the face. Now get up from your computer and go get someone to REALLY enact the above scene. THAT is how it feels to be called a bitch.

Yeah, I totally agree with iceberg. When *I* call someone a nigger, I'm always only saying it to a specific person, so I don't see how it could have anything to do with other black people.

...

I love it when someone tries to claim that it's, like, so progressive, young, and *hip* to use loaded slurs. Notice iceberg hasn't replied when they get thoroughly owned in a comment, just kept spamming the post lower down? Here's a tip for you: quit while you're behind.

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At the end of a job interview, my wife was told, by two fifty something year old men, "The most important thing is to make sure you're not the wicked witch of the West."

Yaaaay!!!!

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