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Poll: Obama Ahead In Pennsylvania
A new survey of Pennsylvania form Public Policy Polling (D) gives Barack Obama the lead here. The numbers, compared to last week:
Obama 49% (+4)
Clinton 46% (+4)
A caveat: PPP has been the outlier among pollsters, the only one to give Obama the lead. That said, they've had a fairly good track record this primary season.
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PPP surveyed over 2,338 Pennsylvania voters. That's the largest sample size ever polled.
April 21, 2008 10:02 AM | Reply | Permalink
Pffffffffffffft !!!!!!
April 21, 2008 10:10 AM | Reply | Permalink
I'll repeat what I just said on the last poll:
And I'm sooooo sick of polls and trying to identify trends and reactions to this hyped story or that hyped story. BAHH!!
F the polls, they all read the same thing:
"Hillary isn't going to win PA and every other remaining state by 20+ points so this thing is over!"
April 21, 2008 10:02 AM | Reply | Permalink
The hoards of Republicans who have temporarily registered as democrats will certainly see to that!
April 21, 2008 10:11 AM | Reply | Permalink
I was thinking, this is a key moment for Republicans take advantage of getting rid of their long time enemy Hillary Clinton.
Rush Limbaugh has toned down his operation chaos, like because he knows that his plan has done its job in creating chaos in the Democrat party.
For those Pennsylvanian Republicans that registered Democrat if they want to pursue their lost ambition of defeating the Clintons they should follow Limbaugh's "Take her out, end all doubt" strategy.
http://www.rushlimbaugh.com/home/daily/site_021508/content/01125109.guest.html
April 21, 2008 10:25 AM | Reply | Permalink
Mmm, Shephard's Pie...
wait, wait, Rush is evil!
April 21, 2008 10:32 AM | Reply | Permalink
That's "hordes", not "hoards."
No one can hoard Republicans.
And back off on the avatar, my face is itchy.
April 21, 2008 1:59 PM | Reply | Permalink
PPP's record:
OHIO (actual: 54C, 44O)
PPP (D) 3/1-2/08 1112LV 51C 42O 7U
PPP (D) 2/23-24/08 600LV 50C 46O 4U
TEXAS (actual: 51C, 47O)
PPP (D) 3/1-2/08 755LV 50C 44O 6U
PPP (D) 2/23-24/08 434LV 48C 48O 4U
SC (actual: 27C, 18E, 57O)
PPP (D) 1/24/2008 595LV 24C 19E 44O
WISCONSIN (actual: 41C, 58O)
PPP (D) 2/16-17/08 822LV 40C 53O 7U
PPP (D) 2/11/08 642LV 39C 50O 10U
April 21, 2008 10:21 AM | Reply | Permalink
Thank you for reporting this seanh
To Eric: Not a "fairly good track record"??? , better than all of the rest, and perfect in predicting winners, and closest to spread than all others.
Go Obama. Victory is already assured even before PA casts a single vote.
MSM-manufactured continued race will die if Clinton winds only by high single digits.
Clinton exits the race by thursday if she loses by a single vote, and may exit by Thursday if she wins by 5 points or less, especially given her financial woes, reported today by FEC filings.
April 21, 2008 10:35 AM | Reply | Permalink
Thanks. Looks like pretty good results.
We can only hope they're right in PA as well.
April 21, 2008 10:37 AM | Reply | Permalink
THIS IS EXCELLENT NEWS!! FOR HILLARY!!!
April 21, 2008 10:32 AM | Reply | Permalink
I hope PPP is the most accurate. But to echo wwjb's sentiment, once the results start coming in tomorrow night, all of these pre-election polls will be long forgotten, and they will be irrelevant except as forensic evidence on who got it right and who got it wrong.
April 21, 2008 10:38 AM | Reply | Permalink
The forensic evidence so far is on PPP's side. Their South Carolina forecast is especially impressive, with every other pollster miles off target. If precedent is to go by, if PPP looks like an outlier, it might be everybody else that's off. Tomorrow will be the big test. If Obama wins, my professional regard for PPP will be galvanized.
April 21, 2008 10:50 AM | Reply | Permalink
Remember that the other really good one is SUSA. They're outliers in the other direction. I wonder what's going on?
April 21, 2008 11:20 AM | Reply | Permalink
SUSA is Clinton +6, which is no outlier. I believe Strategic Vision has the largest Clinton margin out of all the pollsters.
April 21, 2008 11:45 AM | Reply | Permalink
Obama 49% (+4)
Clinton 46% (+4)
How do get both ponies to +4 in a zero-sum two horse race?
April 21, 2008 10:51 AM | Reply | Permalink
Undecideds making up their mind.
April 21, 2008 10:55 AM | Reply | Permalink
Bullshit.
PA is worse than Ohio in demographics, and we saw what happened there.
Once again, the MSM Clinton allies threwthe kitchen sink at him, including a rigged ABC debate, just like in the final week of Ohio, where they slammed him with all sorts of crap that turned out to be false (NAFTA in CA, Rezko, etc)
Only, PA is closed. So I'd say OBama is lucky to escape from PA with less than a 15pt loss.
Lucky. PA is tough for him. This could be ugly!
April 21, 2008 11:07 AM | Reply | Permalink
Maybe PPP will prove to be the South Carolina PPP and the Iowes DMRegister poll all over again.
If we see a spike in turnout in Philly, Obama can win. That's how Rendell won.
April 21, 2008 11:12 AM | Reply | Permalink
I do not believe these results, but they would be lovely if they were true. That said, I am expecting a 6 pt win for Sen Clinton and I will consider that a very felicitous result for us Obama supporters.
April 21, 2008 11:15 AM | Reply | Permalink
All I know is I'm heading to the polls tomorrow to cast a vote for Obama!
April 21, 2008 11:25 AM | Reply | Permalink
I am ignoring all polls on Pennsylvania. They're all over the place, and my poor heart can't take the roller coaster ride.
April 21, 2008 11:41 AM | Reply | Permalink
Taking the average at pollster.com, we've had a consistent difference of 6%, so that's my optimistic prediction:
http://www.pollster.com/08-PA-Dem-Pres-Primary.php
For the record, flyonthewall, who knows polls better than any of the rest of us losers, expects more of the undecideds to break Clinton, so he/she projects a bigger loss for Obama.
April 21, 2008 11:50 AM | Reply | Permalink
Interesting catch by poster Scott...
Obama: "I'm predicting it's going to be close and that we are going to do a lot better than people expect."
http://tpmcafe.talkingpointsmemo.com/talk/2008/04/obama-says-pa-is-closer-than-p.php
A surprising statement.
April 21, 2008 12:06 PM | Reply | Permalink
May I say, I don't usually do much calling, but I called Lancaster, PA on Saturday afternoon before the whistlestop came through.
All but one of the people I reached was already srongly for Obama and getting out the vote. And a lot had re-registered to vote for him, not cynically, but honestly, and a couple had never voted before, including one who was 80 years old; another reported that her 85-year-old life-long Republican parents had re-registered to vote for him; another when I repeated this story said she also had changed her registration; another was working hard on her undecided husband but Barack clearly had her support (good talk even though her husband had handed me off to her despite her protest to him, "but I'm cooking!" (4:00))
One ostensible undecided turned out not to be undecided about who he preferred after I set the script aside and just spoke from my soul and largely about issues that white people supposedly don't think black people care about (because we both id'd race probably accurately immediately by voice pattern, and he had his guard up, and I heard it) - and it turned out it he was already for Obama, but he, too, had never voted before (mid-30s? maybe my age (44)?). But he was already gearing up to go to the whistle stop, he knew what time the scheduled stop was, he knew how many had turned out in Philly on Fri, he was on board. He's just always outvoted in PA and in his area of PA in particular and so normally doesn't see much point in voting.
And the one true undecided simply hadn't had time to pay attention - she has a very busy life - downplayed the difficulties of it - and had only started to notice the campaign - (with a slightly aggrieved tone at first: "they've been campaigning for a week and a half!"). But she wanted to listen, she wanted to believe (and she preferred talking about this to dealing with her ?daughter's loud argument with somebody or other in the background, which periodically required both of us to pause until we could hear one another again). We, too, had a good, thoroughly unscripted conversation. I could tell I needed to introduce her to Barack so I went with biography; it worked for me and I was pretty sure it would work for her. I urged her to seek the counsel of her friends and neighbors, because by then I knew who her friends and neighbors were probably going for him.
And that whistle stop drew thousands (3k low estimate, high estimate was 7-10k!).
That congressional district (16) is not getting more than a 2-2 delegate split, but Lancaster proper? I predict a big win for Obama, and a lot of new votes towards the statewide total. And the Republicans may even need to watch out in that district in the future.
I am back from being Obamatized (worn out - a friend's locution) to being energized - and PA is in play. A win is unlikely, but close is possible. If you have time to make calls today, do!
April 21, 2008 12:06 PM | Reply | Permalink
I think Genghis has it about right. Most polls in the last five days have it between 5 and 10 percent for Hillary, and the undecideds are down to about 6 to 8 percent. Give her a two-thirds share of the late deciders, roughly in line with previous results, and she has a win in the low double digits.
But Obama could keep it to single digits, and that would be a pretty significant outcome given all the factors that work against him in this state.
April 21, 2008 12:06 PM | Reply | Permalink
I'm an Obama supporter.
Nonetheless, the black vote is overrepresented in this poll. PA's black population is 10.4% and there is an 18% representation in this poll.
And this poll includes the leaners, the other polls did not. So, the actual numbers, if you want a real 1:1 correspondence with the last polls, is:
Obama: 47
Clinton: 43
April 21, 2008 12:45 PM | Reply | Permalink
Nonetheless, the black vote is overrepresented in this poll. PA's black population is 10.4% and there is an 18% representation in this poll.
It's a closed primary, and African Americans are disproportionately registered as Democrats in PA.
That being said, I'll be really, really shocked if Obama wins tomorrow.
April 21, 2008 2:50 PM | Reply | Permalink
I'm still calling it for Hillary by 8-12 points.
But, that said, PPP has a damn good record and that is one seriously big-ass sample PPP used. 2% is the smallest margin of error I ever recall seeing in a statewide poll. I don't recall seeing any SUSA poll with an n > 700.
With a sample that big, you've also got to give the demographic and regional breakouts in the cross-tabs a lot of respect.
Another straw in the wind. That that dip in Gallup rolling national average (which was never replicated by Rasmussen, fwiw) just boomeranged back big time. It makes one wonder whether Hillary has done something that turned a lot of lukewarm supporters off or, alternately, that her math problems finally hit home with a few percent some more. (CBS News apparently did a story on the math last night, btw.) It's also possible, I suppose, that Obama is getting the same kind of anti-MSM rebound that Hillary got in New Hampshire.
And, one last straw: Zogby has cast his chicken bones into the charmed circle drawn on the floor and says he sees the undecideds breaking for Hillary. Zogby is like the Colonel Klink of pollsters when it comes to correctly calling these "late breaking trends:" whatever wire in the bomb he says to cut, clip the other one.
But I'm still going with Hillary by 8 - 12. That's my call and I'm sticking to it. I refuse to get my hopes up.
April 21, 2008 2:21 PM | Reply | Permalink
I remain similarly pessimistic, until he actually wins...when I will claim I said that all along and will trust that no one will be disturbed by my flip-flop.
April 21, 2008 3:49 PM | Reply | Permalink
One of the advantages of the Obama campaign is its appeal to nontraditional voters. Republicans are NOT voting for him to create chaos ( granted a few are); many are simply voting for him because of the inspired message he presents.
If you haven't noticed the registered Republicans disgusted by the damage caused by the neocons to the country and the world abandoning the party for something new and inspiring you just aren't paying attention.
April 21, 2008 4:10 PM | Reply | Permalink
I'm thinking of hoarding republican'ts just so that they can't bugger any more pages or start anymore wars. If you really think we need one. I will have them stacked in the root cellar.
April 21, 2008 9:50 PM | Reply | Permalink
Clinton exits the race by thursday if she loses by a single vote, and may exit by Thursday if she wins by 5 points or less, especially given her financial woes, reported today by FEC filings.
If she were a reasonable person in this regard, I would agree with you.
But then again if she were a reasonable person she'd look at the math and know it's over. She hasn't.
What does that tell you?
April 21, 2008 10:43 PM | Reply | Permalink