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Obama Responds To Criticism Of Small-Town Comment
Here, from Obama spokesperson Tommy Vietor, is Obama's response to Hillary and McCain's criticism of his comment about small-town America:
"Senator Obama has said many times in this campaign that Americans are understandably upset with their leaders in Washington for saying anything to win elections while failing to stand up to the special interests and fight for an economic agenda that will bring jobs and opportunity back to struggling communities. And if John McCain wants a debate about who's out of touch with the American people, we can start by talking about the tax breaks for the wealthiest Americans that he once said offended his conscience but now wants to make permanent."
No mention of Hillary -- only McCain.
Late Update: Here's video of Hillary's hit on Obama:
Late Late Update: HuffPo has posted a full transcript of Obama's remarks.
Very Late Update: Here's Obama's response at a rally in Indiana, mentioning both Hillary and McCain, but mainly McCain:
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That was quick.
April 11, 2008 7:14 PM | Reply | Permalink
What a joke this whole manufactured controversy is.
McCain and Clinton both look like disingenuous idiots when you actually hear Obama's remarks IN CONTEXT. Stuff like this is exactly why you can never take a sound bite hand picked from a 30 or 40 minute speech and run with it.
Obama was truthful like he always is, unfortunately some writers for HuffPost are too lazy and dim-witted to actually comprehend a sentence longer than 5 words.
April 11, 2008 7:46 PM | Reply | Permalink
Really? Were you in SF for his original remarks, or are you taking his word for it? When Wright damned America and Obama was called out for not rebuking him, Obama changed the subject to race. When Obama explains the fact that most Pennsylvanians don't support him by dismissing them as bitter yokels and he's called out for it, he changes the subject again -- this time to "Washington." It seems to me that there is some kind of "victim" and "oppressor" meme that Obama keeps running out to distract people from the real issue which is his attitude toward the majority of Americans he's campaigning to lead. It will be interesting to see how this plays out.
April 12, 2008 9:47 AM | Reply | Permalink
Not this time.
Cue Howard..They're yelling in Baton Rouge
http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=4665827135049266825&q=howard+beale&total=93&start=0&num=10&so=0&type=search&plindex=4
April 12, 2008 10:45 AM | Reply | Permalink
You were in SF and heard him say "Yokels?" Wow,
'Yokels' would be bad for him to have said.
The problem I have with his statement is that it doesn't just apply to people in small towns in the Midwest, it applies to people everywhere who are frustrated with an unresponsive government that serves the interest of a few well to do folks at the expense of the rest of us.
April 12, 2008 10:46 AM | Reply | Permalink
I was in SF only a few blocks away. I didn't hear anything but then I don't hang with the Getty's. Just one of the 1.3 million 50 bucks a month folks
April 12, 2008 10:58 AM | Reply | Permalink
Attn ClintonBushville Lackeys
When you bark, Barack bites
April 12, 2008 11:09 AM | Reply | Permalink
"Bitter yokels?" Is that what he called them? He used the word bitter -- and goddamnit if he isn't right. Hang out in the little ghost towns around my part of the Midwest, where companies have taken off to find cheaper labor in other countries, I'll show you some damn bitter people.
Did Billy get hijacked by Goatlife? Insinuation, no accurate quotes, no links, no sourcing. Just spewing more crap and trying once again to link it all to Wright.
April 12, 2008 11:40 AM | Reply | Permalink
No. Linking it all to Obama.
April 12, 2008 11:57 AM | Reply | Permalink
Billy Glad wrote:
Well said Billy Glad!
Obama's true colors are slowly emerging. As I said in another post, he is so very arrogant and if he held his head any further back, he'd drown if it rained with that nose pointing up to the sky the way it so often does!
Rae
April 12, 2008 12:23 PM | Reply | Permalink
BillyGlad: that may be the single most intellectually dishonest diatribe I have ever read, by someone who is not a declared Movement Conservative (um... you're not, are you?). Let us deconstruct:
"When Wright damned America and Obama was called out for not rebuking him, Obama changed the subject to race."
How DARE he?!? When Obama was "called out", he did not address it in the frame YOU desired ("Mr. Dukakis! WHEN are you going to turn in your ACLU card?" Yes, how DARE Dukakis not answer Poppy's question, the way it was asked?).
"When Obama explains the fact that most Pennsylvanians don't support him by dismissing them as bitter yokels and he's called out for it..."
That's right... let's just gloss the hell over the keystone of your argument that he called Pennsylvanians "yokels", and get right to the "calling out" part...
Hey, you know what? Rush Limbaugh's been doing that, for decades! He builds these great argumentative pyramids, in which numerous stones at the base are quickly glossed-over... so you don't really notice that they're lies or inaccuracies. Then, by the time he reaches the top, he's got an argumentative pyramid, built on shit, in which (miraculously) he has won the argument with himself!
Nice try, Ace. PROVE THAT HE INFERRED, IMPLIED OR OUTRIGHT SAID THAT PENNSYLVANIANS WERE "YOKELS". And don't come back, until you do!
"... he changes the subject again -- this time to 'Washington.'"
That son of a bitch! He just keeps ignoring the frame in which you insist on putting him! Say, I've got an idea: why don't you just have someone ask him when he stopped beating his wife?
Regardless of his response, whatever it might be... I'm pretty positive he will not provide you with a date and a time of the cessation of violent activities against Michelle.
And just think... then, you can beat your breast and cry your baby tears again, about how he "changed the subject"! And you know what? Technically, you'll be right! Which I guess means, you've won the argument AGAIN, Rushbo!
"It seems to me that there is some kind of 'victim' and 'oppressor' meme that Obama keeps running out to distract people from the real issue..."
(And again, how dare Obama "distract" people from the frames YOU'VE dubbed "the real issue"? The nerve of that bastard!)
As for "victim" and "oppressor", all I'll say is this:
One of the much-touted "talents" of Karl Rove is the ability to take his clients' weaknesses and negative traits, and paint his opponent with them. E.G., George W. Bush was a military deserter. But John Kerry, certified War Hero, became the War Coward and Phony.
Hillary has been playing the "victim" card for months. I wish I had a dollar for every person who has only recently learned the word "misogynist". Because, as we all know, if you say anything negative about Senator Clinton, wellllll.... you just hate WOMEN! Sound vaguely familiar?
Here's what I want to know, Billy:
Why has Hillary's campaign dipped so frequently into Karl Rove's bag of tricks?
WTF, save your breath; I'll venture a guess myself.
Maybe it's because Karl Rove is stealthily HELPING that campaign? With the goal of setting up the Dem nominee that HE most wants to mow down?
And maybe Hillary (or Penn) is accepting that help, thinking that they're all just different branches of "the money party", and Karl's an equal opportunity Establishment hack?
And that after she gets the nomination, she can then go up against McCain and Rove with her own machine, and somehow win?
Just a theory. But to summarize, really... your arguments and spin are intellectually pathetic. We're a lot smarter and more perceptive, around these parts, than perhaps you'd like us to be.
Our apologies.
April 12, 2008 1:11 PM | Reply | Permalink
Sorry about hitting that nerve. I thought you were fully anesthetized.
April 12, 2008 1:41 PM | Reply | Permalink
After reading your reams of groan-worthy propaganda, I am definitely going to GET anesthecized.
April 12, 2008 2:41 PM | Reply | Permalink
lol
after Obama wins the nomination and becomes president, you will still have to live with yourself.
think about that......
April 12, 2008 11:29 PM | Reply | Permalink
Well at least he responded fast.
Interesting that he'd fail to mention Clinton, though.
April 11, 2008 7:15 PM | Reply | Permalink
I think it is funny. LOL
Ouch !
April 11, 2008 7:17 PM | Reply | Permalink
Umm... he did mention Clinton.
April 12, 2008 2:34 AM | Reply | Permalink
He did well. Clinton is a non-issue. I am glad he just hit McCain. Perfect.
April 11, 2008 7:18 PM | Reply | Permalink
And he is responding precisely as he should respond- being gentler, but essentially keeping his message the same.
Lower class voters, particularly in the poorer regions of Appalachia and the South, have been promised many things in the past by politicians who haven't delivered. Insofar as they are bitter, they have every right to be.
April 11, 2008 7:20 PM | Reply | Permalink
Brilliant. Political aikido: defending yourself without injuring attacker.
April 11, 2008 7:22 PM | Reply | Permalink
I think it would help if Greg put Obama's comments in their full context instead of just those selective snippets. Since you posted the video of Hillary you could also dedicate some space in the post to get the full quote no?
April 11, 2008 7:23 PM | Reply | Permalink
Here are the paragraphs preceding the one being highlighted by these idiots:
Here’s how it is: in a lot of these communities in big industrial states like Ohio and Pennsylvania, people have been beaten down so long. They feel so betrayed by government that when they hear a pitch that is premised on not being cynical about government, then a part of them just doesn’t buy it. And when it’s delivered by — it’s true that when it’s delivered by a 46-year-old black man named Barack Obama, then that adds another layer of skepticism.
But — so the questions you’re most likely to get about me, ‘Well, what is this guy going to do for me? What is the concrete thing?’ What they wanna hear is so we’ll give you talking points about what we’re proposing — to close tax loopholes, uh you know uh roll back the tax cuts for the top 1%, Obama’s gonna give tax breaks to uh middle-class folks and we’re gonna provide healthcare for every American.
He wasn't disparaging them. He was defending them against those on the left who think they might be racist towards Obama.
Just wait until Obama smacks down HRC with this in a way only HE can.
It's gonna be good.
April 11, 2008 7:30 PM | Reply | Permalink
Damn formatting! This should have been in quotes too:
But — so the questions you’re most likely to get about me, ‘Well, what is this guy going to do for me? What is the concrete thing?’ What they wanna hear is so we’ll give you talking points about what we’re proposing — to close tax loopholes, uh you know uh roll back the tax cuts for the top 1%, Obama’s gonna give tax breaks to uh middle-class folks and we’re gonna provide healthcare for every American.
April 11, 2008 7:53 PM | Reply | Permalink
OBAMA: So, it depends on where you are, but I think it's fair to say that the places where we are going to have to do the most work are the places where people are most cynical about government. The people are mis-appre...they're misunderstanding why the demographics in our, in this contest have broken out as they are. Because everybody just ascribes it to 'white working-class don't wanna work -- don't wanna vote for the black guy.' That's...there were intimations of that in an article in the Sunday New York Times today - kind of implies that it's sort of a race thing.
Here's how it is: in a lot of these communities in big industrial states like Ohio and Pennsylvania, people have been beaten down so long. They feel so betrayed by government that when they hear a pitch that is premised on not being cynical about government, then a part of them just doesn't buy it. And when it's delivered by -- it's true that when it's delivered by a 46-year-old black man named Barack Obama, then that adds another layer of skepticism.
But -- so the questions you're most likely to get about me, 'Well, what is this guy going to do for me? What is the concrete thing?' What they wanna hear is -- so, we'll give you talking points about what we're proposing -- to close tax loopholes, you know, roll back the tax cuts for the top 1 percent. Obama's gonna give tax breaks to middle-class folks and we're gonna provide health care for every American.
But the truth is, is that, our challenge is to get people persuaded that we can make progress when there's not evidence of that in their daily lives. You go into some of these small towns in Pennsylvania, and like a lot of small towns in the Midwest, the jobs have been gone now for 25 years and nothing's replaced them. And they fell through the Clinton administration, and the Bush administration, and each successive administration has said that somehow these communities are gonna regenerate and they have not. And it's not surprising then they get bitter, they cling to guns or religion or antipathy to people who aren't like them or anti-immigrant sentiment or anti-trade sentiment as a way to explain their frustrations.
Um, now these are in some communities, you know. I think what you'll find is, is that people of every background -- there are gonna be a mix of people, you can go in the toughest neighborhoods, you know working-class lunch-pail folks, you'll find Obama enthusiasts. And you can go into places where you think I'd be very strong and people will just be skeptical. The important thing is that you show up and you're doing what you're doing.
April 11, 2008 8:12 PM | Reply | Permalink
Well done! I think it's time Obama make sthe race about him and McCain.
Between NAFTA, Welfare reform, the 'renovated Churches' scandal, Colombia, and a host of other issues, Clinton might be smart not to draw out this fight.
April 11, 2008 7:25 PM | Reply | Permalink
No mention of her. Perfect.
April 11, 2008 7:31 PM | Reply | Permalink
This is too little, too late. Obama needs to address his hate and racism directly. He's made multiple comments, such as 'typical White person', and has yet to address any of these, like this one about small town people, with an apology and a real, substantive explanation for his hate and racism. He is an increasing embarrassment and it is difficult to see how people can overlook his comments in their haste and seeming blindness to support him.
Matthew
http://www.TheProblemWithObama.com
April 11, 2008 7:32 PM | Reply | Permalink
Matthew, you'd think it was "too little, too late" if Obama committed hari kari two seconds after inadvertently offending you.
April 11, 2008 7:39 PM | Reply | Permalink
Matthew, now now, why are you here again trying to rattle the cage. Go work on your website, the one bashing Obama. Are you experienced enough to handle a bi-racial candidate, I don't think so.
April 11, 2008 7:57 PM | Reply | Permalink
Right back at you Racist Scum Bag!!!!!!
April 11, 2008 8:14 PM | Reply | Permalink
Well said, liam.
April 11, 2008 10:44 PM | Reply | Permalink
Wow, I just looked up "projection" on Wikipedia and found out where Matthew's old avatar went.
April 11, 2008 8:42 PM | Reply | Permalink
Matthew Weaver is now whoring his anti-Obama site. But he used to whore his personal website, TheIndependentView.com, until somebody went there and reported on his anti-Semitic and racist posts there.
Now Matthew has apparently taken that site down. But as of a few days ago, he was still demanding that Israel be excluded from "membership in the community of nations".
If Matthew Weaver is going to continue to be allowed to post here, he should explain his remarks and explain what's been going on with his website (including allowing commenters to see it as he has been whoring it for months, and to read his I/P and other "personal opinion" posts.
If he can't explain what he meant by excluding Israel from the community of nations - an idea that sort of suggests how its proponents intend to carry it out - then perhaps he could explain why he thinks that the Holocaust, while perhaps real, is not as important as it used to be.
Or maybe he could just be banned (please).
April 11, 2008 8:56 PM | Reply | Permalink
I denounce Michael Weaver's anti-Israel statements!
I also denouce Mr. Weaver's blatant disregard of his previous avatar. By choosing Barack Obama as an avatar, he's clearly anti-everyone else in the world. That's a lot of inner-city people you're offending Mr. Weaver. Stop being an anti-everyone elsist.
I also denounce Mr. Weaver's use of a circle with a line through it? What, open circles not good enough for you, tough guy??? What have open circles ever done to you??? Just because open circles are indecisive, doesn't mean that they're not geometric shapes too. STOP being prejudiced to our other fine American geometric shapes!!!
Lastly, I denounce Mr. Weaver taking down his hate-filled website. If you're gonna be an honest broker, why hide it? Only pussies wear sheets on their head, you wear your hate proudly. After all, you use your real name as you've told us on so many occasions.
April 11, 2008 9:44 PM | Reply | Permalink
theindependentview.com is still up.
April 12, 2008 2:43 AM | Reply | Permalink
Hey...check out this video. You'll love it.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Sc9PepjyDow&eurl=http://www.dailykos.com/
April 11, 2008 9:49 PM | Reply | Permalink
This is a near perfect response. He needs to repeat this every single day until April 22.
April 11, 2008 11:45 PM | Reply | Permalink
Wow, Obama's genuinely ticked at McCain and Clinton, and he's absolutely right. They're acting like they're blind to how angry people are. Either they really are that out of touch, or they just don't want to talk about it. Or know how to talk about it. And that's the problem. Nothing happens because politicians won't talk about realities faced by the voters. Until now.
April 12, 2008 12:08 AM | Reply | Permalink
So Matthew, will you be voting for McCain over Obama in November?
April 11, 2008 10:39 PM | Reply | Permalink
Matthew Weaver already said he would vote for McCain over Obama
Something about"that young, uppity whippersnapper"
or was it "that young uppity negro"
I am sure he will fill you in on it.
April 12, 2008 12:05 AM | Reply | Permalink
Oh, bullshit.
April 12, 2008 11:47 AM | Reply | Permalink
I realize that the statement "Oh, bullshit" doesn't really make clear my position.
Mr. Weaver is a toxic menace. He spews the substance you find in fermenting manure pool on factory farms. Someone, please, save those babies.
Our eyes, ears, brains, can take in and analyze Obama's statements and actions. The hate and racism just aren't there in what he's done.
April 12, 2008 11:58 AM | Reply | Permalink
Latest manufactured anti-Obama smear.
The original article was rather favorable.
Has anyone noticed that Politico is rather rightwing and seems to SCOUR the news to pull a single quote out of context and make a big headline???
Seems like their MO
I also note they tend to hit Democrats and lay off McCain.
April 11, 2008 7:33 PM | Reply | Permalink
I've noticed Huffington Post doing a lot of this lately, taking something completely out of context, or putting on a completely disingenuous, sensationalized headline, with an unflattering picture, and then you read it and it is totally ridiculous trash.
Has anyone else noticed that lately? It seems like just the last few weeks there have been a rash of really stupid yet highly sensationalized anti-Obama articles. It is kind of pissing me off.
April 11, 2008 7:40 PM | Reply | Permalink
Politico is more right slanted. I have noticed Huff Post having terrible headlines lately, I did write and complain. They have gone way off the deep end.
April 11, 2008 7:59 PM | Reply | Permalink
Controversy equals readership. All of the Progressive blogs are in business to make money along with other aims. They keep us engaged by promoting controversy. Oldest trick in the book. If the threads get too dull, they'll comment themselves. I like it.
April 12, 2008 10:10 AM | Reply | Permalink
They keep us confused by promoting inflammatory bullshit.
April 12, 2008 11:51 AM | Reply | Permalink
Indeed a manufactured smear. Now that Sargent has posted the FULL transcript, I won't have to bother with it again.
Just like Obama's not bothering with Hillary any longer
April 11, 2008 7:36 PM | Reply | Permalink
Haha, ouch, a not-so-subtle show that Hillary is just a sideline nuisance.
April 11, 2008 7:38 PM | Reply | Permalink
Oh goody.
It is working again...
Whenever cocked up Penn...
Or my punch drunk Hubby...
Gets caught with their cigars in the wrong place...
I got to say something totally outrageous about Obama, to draw the focus elsewhere...
That's my style.
I've got nothing but that to offer America...
Putting him down is all I got left.
I think I am going to tear up again...
April 11, 2008 7:40 PM | Reply | Permalink
you and idiotic crack me up.
keep up the good work.
- -
I'm amazed that the MSM is not running with video caught story of Bill Clinton recent comments about Obama, stereotyping Obama on his recent campaign ad about himnot accepting oil companies' money to that of him [Obama] stealing cars.
April 11, 2008 8:34 PM | Reply | Permalink
Sure sounded like he was talking down to the hard working people of PA. Just as he did in Ohio when he was here.......
April 11, 2008 11:19 PM | Reply | Permalink
"Hard working people of Ohio"; another of those mindless slogans from this clown. If they are so hard working why are they complaining about no longer having any work.
I suppose you are going to tell us next that Hillary, Big Foot Bill, and Mark Penn have been trying to make sure that they do not have to work so hard by implementing NAFTA and the Colombia Jobs Stealing Trade agreement.
April 12, 2008 10:01 AM | Reply | Permalink
Obama has tried to ignore Hillary before. It has always backfired.
Hmm... I was going to leave this comment at the previous statement but I just saw the Hillary video. It really does not say anything that needs to be responded to. Pretty much normal campaigning flourishes.The calling Pennsylvanians bitter part about what Obama said isn't that bad.
I am more worried about how the "they cling to guns or religion" part can be spun. Obama should get ahead of that statement and put it into proper context before either Hillary or McCain misuse it.
April 11, 2008 7:45 PM | Reply | Permalink
"Say anything" is one of those veiled swipes at HRC. It's the Obama version of "whatever happened to the politics of hope?" When they use it, we know who it refers to.
April 11, 2008 7:46 PM | Reply | Permalink
Watch out, I'm going to get rude:
up yours, Hillary.
You want to wallow in the filth with the Republicans, go ahead. You have destroyed any credibility you ever had.
You are officially a Bush Republican.
April 11, 2008 7:49 PM | Reply | Permalink
"I am more worried about how the "they cling to guns or religion" part can be spun. Obama should get ahead of that statement and put it into proper context before either Hillary or McCain misuse it."
Faux News just used it. They ignored the "bitter" comment and highlighted the guns, etc.
April 11, 2008 7:51 PM | Reply | Permalink
To hell with that - he'd say it's too little too late if Obama suddenly walked across Lake Superior and then ascended into heaven.
Let's face it, there are some things he just isn't ever going to get past. You know how it is with the colorblind guys like Weaver.
April 11, 2008 7:52 PM | Reply | Permalink
Will every one please get this straight - Fox is not News and they never tell the truth and the only people who watch Fox now are locked up and can't change the channel.
I'm going to yell: FOX IS IRRELEVANT.
April 11, 2008 7:54 PM | Reply | Permalink
Fox is losing viewers, I recently read their stats. Their day is done, so to speak, except for the bigots and homophobes that will always gravitate towards that type of trash. Bye-Bye Fox.
April 11, 2008 8:02 PM | Reply | Permalink
THIS IS EXCELLENT NEWS!! FOR HILLARY!!!
April 11, 2008 8:06 PM | Reply | Permalink
You are the best.
April 12, 2008 1:30 AM | Reply | Permalink
As I wrote in a post earlier this evening...
First it was the "typical White person" now its the "small town person".
Memories of Obama's recent racial stereotype of the 'typical White person' are still fresh. Add to this now his view of the 'typical small town person.' Obama is quoted as disparaging residents of small towns in Pennsylvania as being "like a lot of small towns in the Midwest" where "it's not surprising then they get bitter, they cling to guns or religion or antipathy to people who aren't like them or anti-immigrant sentiment or anti-trade sentiment as a way to explain their frustrations."
So, how should one interpret this latest disrepecting remark? Is this intended to gain votes in Pennsylvania? I doubt it will win him any votes.
Obama is unapologetic in his racism and hate. Recalling his earlier dissing of voters in Florida and Michigan one has to wonder what groups of Americans he really respects?
I hear Obama is now going to talk about this directly later tonight in Indiana. Will he apologize? Will he explain himself? Will he address this directly or try to deflect everything? Hearing the harsh commentary on all of the new channels tonight, he's got some serious damage control to do. Personally, I think this effort will be too little, too late. He's yet to apologize for his 20-year association with hate and racism that he even takes his daughters to hear. He has yet to apologize for his 'typical White person' comments. Obama's defined himself quite clearly with his comments and association with hate and racism.
An apology will be a start but will he offer one?
Matthew
http://www.TheProblemWithObama.com
April 11, 2008 8:08 PM | Reply | Permalink
Matthew... you are starting to sound like a typical old white guy.
or maybe it is a typical broken record by an typical white guy.
Either way, why don't you come up with a new schtick? Maybe you could start pushing that story about the limo driver or something. Something a bit more racy?
Thanks
April 12, 2008 12:03 AM | Reply | Permalink
If you don't like what Obama said, so be it. My guess is that you are probably looking for things to misconstrue rather than listening to what he actually said. Based on what I've read of your comments, I think that is a pretty fair assessment.
If you are looking for something to be offended by, you will find it. You will twist, maim, distort, or imply whatever you need to in order to fulfill your quest to be offended.
...
Sometimes the truth hurts, but even when the truth hurts, it is always better than a lie.
(not my words, there from someone far more coherent at this time of night over on Fark.com , but it's SO apporpriate to your entire library of posts over the last several weeks).
April 12, 2008 2:43 AM | Reply | Permalink
Maybe Obama's SF speech got translated into moonman language before you read it, because I just don't see anything derogatory in what he said about the people and the situation he's describing.
I read an honest acknowledgment of what are most likely the feelings of those people he described. They are the people who lost their livelihoods when factories closed. It's human nature to blame others for our misfortunes and to find comfort in what we like and what we value. If Obama was discussing the disenfranchisement of geeks and nerds, he might have said that "It's not surprising that they get bitter, they cling to their avatars in World of Warcraft and their antipathy toward those whom society admires for their beauty and suaveness or Luddites or venture capitalists as a way to explain their frustrations."
Of course, it's a generalization, but this is how discourse works. Obama acknowledged something that the other major candidates won't touch and that the "fringe" candidates, already out of the race, expressed with much less grace.
Edwards was all about how for too long the gap between the overclass and the underclass has been growing. Kucinich expressed this in his way, and even Ron Paul expressed it in his tin-foil-hat way.
Do you even have a clue about what has gone on between the races for the past 50 years? Do you know that, even as many black people have experienced social and economic benefits from the changes in this society, many more have been pushed further and further away from the kind of equality of opportunity, dignity, and status that the Civil Rights movement marched for 40 and 50 years ago? A black man with a college degree is paid $.73 for every dollar a white man of comparable education is paid. In the blue-collar sector, only a very small percentage of black men—disproportionate to the number of black men in that work—are foremen, technicians, or supervisors. They are predominantly relegated to lower-scale unskilled labor positions.
And how about the criminal justice system? Black people make up 17 percent of the US population, yet more than half of the people incarcerated in this country are black. Sentences for the same crime are harsher for black men than white men. Crack cocaine possession and selling have significantly more severe punishments than for powder cocaine, which is more the "white man's" drug.
I may not agree with the way in which Rev. Wright delivers his sermons, but the content is the same that it has had to be for too many years: white society discriminates against black society, and fighting seems to be the only way to make it change. This is what inspired the Black Power movement, the Black Panther Party, and Black Liberation Theology.
Every candidate says that the last guy did it all wrong, I'll do it right, but America's great anyway. But it doesn't change for the better, not in any more than a cosmetic way. And one big reason for that is that it is in the overclass's interests that the racial divide will never close. Indeed, the wider the gap, the better.
So those white people in Pennsylvania who lost their industries and lost their jobs are encouraged to blame it on outsourcing, immigration, affirmative action—anything but that closing those factories and moving them overseas, or driving smaller companies out of business so larger ones can take over, or squelching technologies that might jeopardize the status quo for the moneymakers.
Well, it's been going wrong for awhile now. Even though many people enjoyed better days during the Clinton era, those living in regions in which the major employers went out of business or moved off shore didn't get the benefits from a tech boom. Whereas they used to have jobs with decent pay—putting them on a par with white-collar workers—and benefits, including retirement, now if they can find work it's at WalMart or Home Depot, where the pay is low, benefits are minimal, and dignity is not an option.
Look, Matthew, Obama is, as Jon Stewart put it, "speaking to Americans as though they were adults." I have no idea if Obama can make enough changes for the better to even start to repair the damage that's been done through deregulation, free markets, and laissez faire (though only for those who are able to "faire" to begin with). But I'm glad that he's not making it all seem rosy, describing brave Americans looking optimistically toward the future. I'll take unpleasant truths over placating lies any time.
It's the lies that are condescending, not the truth.
April 12, 2008 3:29 AM | Reply | Permalink
I have heard that Obama is constantly whispering racial epithets against the half of him that is white.
April 12, 2008 11:03 AM | Reply | Permalink
Independentmeans - well any Democrat who ever attempted to play to Fox watchers was making a huge mistake - it's hopeless to start with so let em go. As you said, their audience share is dropping like a rock. I think it's the end of the whole damn era of hate media, I really do. I think Rush is not long for the world of broadcasting, and one by one they will disappear, except in pockets of talk radio at 3 AM, like they used to be.
April 11, 2008 8:09 PM | Reply | Permalink
Weaver - I think it is safe to say that you can hold your breath and wait for Obama to apologize to you til you turn blue; and maybe you'll pass out and shut up.
There's never anything new out of you - this shit is ancient, Weaver. I mean moldy, green, stale as a 7-11 sandwich left out on a counter without its wrapper for a couple months. You could put anyone's name in your rant - Martin Luther King, Malcolm X, Chris Rock - and make the same point because all you are doing is filling in the blanks in large amounts of stupid stuff that has been said repeatedly already. It is available everywhere and always has been.
There's no shortage of hate groups in this country and never has been.
April 11, 2008 8:15 PM | Reply | Permalink
You sure seem full of hate and anger tonight. Guess it hurts to see your candidate destroy himself. Contrary to your comment, there is nothing stale about Obama's comments earlier this week. Nothing stale about his 'typical White person' comment, and nothing stale about his 20+ years association with a church and reverend preaching and teaching hate and racism. Especially in the latter, Obama continues to go to this church and take his daughters to be indoctrinated in this trash. You've got your head-in-the-sand if you think this is all old news and like everyone else.
It is just McCain, Clinton, and Obama that we choose among now for president. Obama claims to be hope and change, yet, oh, yes, as you so helpfully note, he is a typical voice of hate and racism. I'm sure he appreciates this acceptance of his hate and racism but I assure you that many others, myself included, do not.
I do not expect to hear an apology from Obama tonight as, like Bush, he is simply too arrogant to see the value in one. Plus, apparently Obama believes his hate and racism, thus has nothing he feels needs apology.
Matthew
http://www.TheProblemWithObama.com
April 11, 2008 8:29 PM | Reply | Permalink
Poor Mr. Weaver. He project his own virulent racism and rage onto others.
April 11, 2008 8:37 PM | Reply | Permalink
Wow. I thought listening to my 3-year old son's Wiggles music was repetitive. Sheesh, Mr. Weaver is a jukebox with one song, and not a good one.
It's like having to listen to Warrant's Cherry Pie over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over.
Michael (if that's REALLY your real name), PLEASE try to make just one day's worth of posts PRO-SOMEBODY!
You're negativity is hurtin' my buzz dude, so chill out.
(don't drink or smoke or do drugs, but might as well let Mr. Weaver play with a Californian stereotype, if ONLY to change his tune for a few posts)
April 11, 2008 8:49 PM | Reply | Permalink
Uh, he destroyed Clinton and McCain when he addressed this in Indiana tonight. Sorry about that.
April 12, 2008 12:22 AM | Reply | Permalink
MW needs to update his talking point. The right is so over the "Obama is a black Racist" story and has moved on to the much more compelling "Obama is anti-American" meme.
April 12, 2008 11:10 AM | Reply | Permalink
You make a major mistake that men are apt to make when women talk like I do. You keep insisting that I'm emotional.
I'm not angry at all - if anything I'm ending this week with new optimism. It's not Obama who is in trouble.
April 11, 2008 8:32 PM | Reply | Permalink
Your name HusseinTenaX and a picture that I have no reason to presume is you do not confirm to me that you are a woman. All I see is another annonymous poster emotionally expressing anger and accusations. Thus, I approach you neutrally as I do others who do not have the self-respect or integrity to use their own name. As I've asked others, are you ashamed of what you write, or that someone you know might read this and see either your writing or the real you as a fraud?
Matthew
http://www.TheIndependentView.com
April 11, 2008 8:38 PM | Reply | Permalink
I'm happy to see that Weaver's website is still up - I had trouble logging on to it before.
Happy, because I've just verified that his "personal opinion", according to which Israel needs to be excluded from "the community of nations" is still up.
There are serious problems with a number of Weaver's posts, but I think this is the one that calls out most for action. Matthew Weaver has called for Israel to be excluded from the community of nations. This idea has been put forward before, and the means by which it is to be realized. I don't think Weaver can simply say we don't understand what he means. If someone stands outside my house and says, "Burn this house down", do I have to wait until somebody shows up with a burning torch before I say something?
Matthew Weaver should I think apologize to this board, which has treated him with far more respect than he deserves. He should explain why he is anti-Semitic, and how he plans to try to convince posters on this board that he is sorry for that.
Or else he should be banned.
April 11, 2008 9:04 PM | Reply | Permalink
Among Matthew's other views: pro capital punishment; anti gay marriage.
April 11, 2008 9:31 PM | Reply | Permalink
I don't support censorship, however, I also don't support advertising your hateful site on this forum. I have asked JMM to have you stop your advertising of your inflammatory site. You have a right to blog here with your opinions, but the site sucks, is offensive, and you should not have free advertising.
April 11, 2008 9:39 PM | Reply | Permalink
That's pretty funny, independent means. Have you taken a good look at the advertising Josh runs on TPM?
April 12, 2008 12:10 PM | Reply | Permalink
He went away for a while when another commenter started using his picture -- with the word "TOOL" superimposed over it -- as an avatar. I thought that was funny, that that mild and funny swipe chased him away. Weaver is a big baby.
April 11, 2008 11:42 PM | Reply | Permalink
Personally, I have a problem with the statement on his other site that says he finds Hillary Clinton to be credible.
April 12, 2008 12:31 AM | Reply | Permalink
To lend further credibility to his site, Weaver has adorned it with photos of Elmo and Kermit the Frog. He's not a troll . . . he's a Muppet
April 12, 2008 1:05 AM | Reply | Permalink
Of course you use your own name. You're such a borderline personality you probably believe a talk show gig will come next.
April 12, 2008 1:34 AM | Reply | Permalink
Yes we all are aware of your lovely calm, soothing demeanor, weaver.
enough about you.
April 11, 2008 8:40 PM | Reply | Permalink
Obama hit a nerve with this one, I dont think its crippling but he can officially be concerned PA could get ugly. I read the whole transcript and yep if I was a small town PA resident I would not be happy
April 11, 2008 8:42 PM | Reply | Permalink
Are you? How do you know?
April 11, 2008 8:46 PM | Reply | Permalink
I live in a small town to the north in New York, I grew up in small towns out West. I read and have now listened to his comments and can't imagine that anyone who lives or lived in a small town will not take offense at Obama's comments.
What was Obama thinking?! Trashing religion in small towns or anywhere. Trashing gun ownership just as he trying to say elsewhere that he really isn't as much against them as he has clearly been in the past. And accusing small town residents of being anti-immigrant. Can Obama win Pennsylvania or any state without small town voters?! I don't think so. He might as well withdraw now.
Matthew
http://www.TheProblemWithObama.com
April 11, 2008 8:59 PM | Reply | Permalink
A. I wasn't asking you. You're a troll and your opinion matters less to me than the turd my neighbor's cat laid in his front yard.
B. He wasn't dissing religion or guns in any way. He was saying people vote based on issues like that instead of issues like the economy and a functional Washington because they've lost hope in politics. You might be too hate-filed or plain old obtuse to get that, but most Americans are smarter than that.
Say whatever you want. Like Wright, like plagiarism, like NAFTA, all lies and smears can be easily disproved with the actual facts. And when people find out they've been deceived and lie to, they act. I would recommend you not pay any attention to the news around election time if you're sensitive.
April 11, 2008 10:34 PM | Reply | Permalink
"I read the whole transcript and yep if I was a small town PA resident I would not be happy." Why, are they bitter?
April 11, 2008 8:57 PM | Reply | Permalink
So, Obama calls white folks of PA bitter in front of his elitists donors and you give him a free pass.
I seriously doubt the PA voters will.
She will win by 20 points.
April 11, 2008 8:57 PM | Reply | Permalink
I missed his comment in Indiana tonight but just her Olbermann quote it. It was NOT an apology but instead an in your face comment. I don't see this working.
I up your 20% to 25-30%. This will also resonate in Indiana and possibly in North Carolina. Really everywhere, it was offensive and he apparently doesn't get it.
Matthew
http://www.TheProblemWithObama.com
April 11, 2008 9:02 PM | Reply | Permalink
Don't be suprised when Indiana falls in-line with its neighboring midwest states, IL, WI.
Hillary is no saint here.
I get that old disco tune when I see headlines like this:
http://www.wishtv.com/Global/story.asp?S=8151493&nav=0Rce
"burn baby burn"
April 11, 2008 9:09 PM | Reply | Permalink
He said he is not out of touch, knows people are bitter and that why is running.
No apology.
April 11, 2008 9:10 PM | Reply | Permalink
He spoke the unabashed truth and it was invigorating, impressive, and very refreshing.
April 11, 2008 9:47 PM | Reply | Permalink
None's needed.
He wasn't criticizing people in rural PA. He was criticizing G.H.W. Bush, B. Clinton and G.W. Bush, politicians all that said whatever needed to be said to get elected and then promptly stopped giving a shit about rural America.
Obama gets it.
These people get it: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Sc9PepjyDow&eurl=http://www.dailykos.com/
Unfortunately you and Sean Hannity are on the same side of an issue again.
Coincidence? I think not.
April 11, 2008 9:53 PM | Reply | Permalink
You have often claimed to be a Democrat. And you recognize that this is a Democratic blog.
You're a bald faced liar.
So what do you think we should do with someone that puts on the face of Scalia telling us to go fuck ourselves in the ass (in Italian), and then criticizes the presumptive Democratic nominee? Mind you, this would apply even if HRC had a chance to win.
You're a Republican, and a slanderer. Attempts to play nice with you are pointless; you're Godawful boring and as they said on Kos when they banned you, you're not even a good troll.
Ban gotalife. His fifteen minutes are up.
April 11, 2008 9:09 PM | Reply | Permalink
Ban him? Also his friends and known associates? How about an echo chamber loyalty oath? Isn't putting his name on the Wall Of Shame enough?
April 12, 2008 11:54 AM | Reply | Permalink
That is a another lie. He never said anything about skin color. You are another of those Aryan Nation Racist Scumbags!
April 12, 2008 10:19 AM | Reply | Permalink
Oh that was funny, I thought your username was "Goat Life." Dyslexia = endless entertainment.
April 12, 2008 11:16 AM | Reply | Permalink
Darn! There I was back on the Obama bandwagon and He had to go diss us small town Pennsylvania voters.
Here's how it is: in a lot of these communities in big industrial states like Ohio and Pennsylvania, people have been beaten down so long. They feel so betrayed by government that when they hear a pitch that is premised on not being cynical about government, then a part of them just doesn't buy it. And when it's delivered by -- it's true that when it's delivered by a 46-year-old black man named Barack Obama, then that adds another layer of skepticism.
But -- so the questions you're most likely to get about me, 'Well, what is this guy going to do for me? What is the concrete thing?' What they wanna hear is -- so, we'll give you talking points about what we're proposing -- to close tax loopholes, you know, roll back the tax cuts for the top 1 percent. Obama's gonna give tax breaks to middle-class folks and we're gonna provide health care for every American.
But the truth is, is that, our challenge is to get people persuaded that we can make progress when there's not evidence of that in their daily lives. You go into some of these small towns in Pennsylvania, and like a lot of small towns in the Midwest, the jobs have been gone now for 25 years and nothing's replaced them. And they fell through the Clinton administration, and the Bush administration, and each successive administration has said that somehow these communities are gonna regenerate and they have not. And it's not surprising then they get bitter, they cling to guns or religion or antipathy to people who aren't like them or anti-immigrant sentiment or anti-trade sentiment as a way to explain their frustrations.
Um, now these are in some communities, you know. I think what you'll find is, is that people of every background -- there are gonna be a mix of people, you can go in the toughest neighborhoods, you know working-class lunch-pail folks, you'll find Obama enthusiasts. And you can go into places where you think I'd be very strong and people will just be skeptical. The important thing is that you show up and you're doing what you're doing.
Calling us cynical about government...Yeah, right.
He's completely wrong...We really DON'T want to vote for the black guy. They're shifty and all.
Saying we cling to guns and religion...He's wrong about that too even if I did buy my shotgun at the church bazaar.
I'm voting for Hillary. At least she doesn't mind shoveling the same BS to us small towners year after year. Just the way god intended!
Thanks To Matthew Weaver for helping me see the light!
April 11, 2008 9:04 PM | Reply | Permalink
from swimming freestyle:
"Barack Obama is a remarkably eloquent man and turning into a remarkably capable politician. But if the Senator believes it's smart to insult voters from a state critical to your success, he's hit one of the worst false notes yet in his campaign.
Yeah, I know what his campaign said, and that may have been what he meant. But a sophisticated candidate doesn't refer to voters in language that can be construed as derogatory or insulting. Obama asserted Pennsylvania voters are bitter and so simple and lacking in maturity and intelligence that they address their frustration by clinging to primitive and reactionary crutches rather than addressing their problems in constructive ways.
It's divisive. And not the way to attract the voters you need most."
http://swimmingfreestyle.typepad.com
April 11, 2008 9:05 PM | Reply | Permalink
Nice blog.
Matthew
http://www.TheIndependentView.com
April 11, 2008 9:09 PM | Reply | Permalink
Don't call bitter people bitter because it makes them bitter. And if you stereotype them, then all the small town people in NC and elsewhere who are exactly like the ones in PA (cause they are all alike, you know) will also be bitter. That's how Obama will lose the bitter vote, which will have nowhere else to go but to Clinton and McCain. It's not about race and gender anymore, it's about hopism versus bitterism, and that makes for a close race, indeed.
April 11, 2008 9:14 PM | Reply | Permalink
Oh so now only small-town people can use the B-word?
ah fie!
kicks a nearby can
April 11, 2008 9:22 PM | Reply | Permalink
He's not dissing the people that are bitter, he's sympathizing with them. It's called "empathy". He understands why they have no hope in the govt any more.
He IS turning them around, getting everybody involved into politics again, and that's how he will win BIG.
Sit back and enjoy, Barack's putting on a show!
April 11, 2008 10:28 PM | Reply | Permalink
His empathy ends where my hard-won bitterness begins. Bitterism is the last surviving industry around here, and his hopism is sapping the last of it.
April 11, 2008 11:26 PM | Reply | Permalink
Oh darn, my "fearism" is out of date.
April 12, 2008 11:22 AM | Reply | Permalink
You know, I think you're wrong. I think people are tired of HR speak. They're tired of being patted on the head and patronized -- and congratulated for not making waves even when their hearts are broken, and acting like "team players" while they're getting the business. They hear this kind of crap on the job -- on the very jobs where they're getting screwed and losing their pensions and paying more and more for their health insurance -- and losing their overtime pay and getting capped at two weeks vacation a year (if that). And now two uber ruling class candidates with personal fortunes out their wazoos are patting these people on the head just like HR does, and saying now don't you listen to that guy who says you're angry. Why you're better than being angry, we all know that. These people are angry, their life isn't composed of Hallmark card sentiments and Hillary and John just flunked another credibility test. They really have been in Washington (and rich) for way too long.
April 12, 2008 1:20 AM | Reply | Permalink
You should have watched his townhall in IN. It was a thing of beauty.
” Hillary Clinton supported a credit-card based Bankruptcy bill - “*I* am out of touch?”
It took McCain three tries to realize there was a housing crisis- I am out of touch?”
April 11, 2008 9:05 PM | Reply | Permalink
Well Hillary had to change the story away from Bosnia some how.
April 11, 2008 9:15 PM | Reply | Permalink
How do I know? Well let me see I am in the military and surrounded by young men and women from small towns and yes being stereotyped in such a manner will not sit well. Obama needs to address this and do it fast before it becomes far uglier.
April 11, 2008 9:26 PM | Reply | Permalink
so young men and women in the military are content [happy] with what the government of 8 years has brought to their small-town's economy and their lively hood?
If you say no to this, then you accept what Obama said was truth.
If you agree with to that then you are a John McCain Republican.
April 11, 2008 9:42 PM | Reply | Permalink
thanks for posting link to full Obama comments Greg,
Here is his answer on video from his townhall in Indiana.
http://my.barackobama.com/page/community/post/samgrahamfelsen/gGBWx9
April 11, 2008 9:29 PM | Reply | Permalink
Yes, this is a death knell for Hussein X Obama.
Just as it was for all those Republicans who coasted to victory by telling voters they had every right to be angry, and should be angry, at all those pesky minorities and the "big guvment programs" set up to make sure they get treated fairly.
For Hussein X Obama to point out that a lot of people are bitter because guvment doesn't work for them and allude to the fact that people have been encouraged to project the frustration they feel towards guvment onto their fellow citizens...why, he might as well have just squatted over the punchbowl!
April 11, 2008 9:31 PM | Reply | Permalink
I like the X part you added. Does it come with high strength alloy claws that are retractable?
Maybe eyes that can shoot lasers?
If not, he should get his money back.
April 12, 2008 12:13 AM | Reply | Permalink
Obama just responded tough and clear to an audience in Indiana! He says he IS in touch with people's justifiable grievances. Get the video of his response up in a prominent place.
April 11, 2008 9:34 PM | Reply | Permalink
Yes, please add the video. I have no idea how to do that in a TPM comment but it is in a couple diaries over on DKos right now.
Way to fight back Barack!!!
April 11, 2008 9:36 PM | Reply | Permalink
skocpol yes that response was great, I posted link to the video above for those who want to see it. talk about getting in front of it.
April 11, 2008 9:36 PM | Reply | Permalink
As the video clearly demonstrates, Obama is dead in the water thanks to this tempest in a teapot put forward by Clinton and McCain.
Not.
April 11, 2008 9:37 PM | Reply | Permalink
video of obamas response. wow: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Sc9PepjyDow
April 11, 2008 9:37 PM | Reply | Permalink
Transcript
"TERRE HAUTE, INDIANA – At a town hall meeting in Indiana, U.S. Senator Barack Obama made the following comments in response to the Clinton and McCain campaign’s attacks:
“When I go around and I talk to people there is frustration and there is anger and there is bitterness. And what’s worse is when people are expressing their anger then politicians try to say what are you angry about? This just happened – I want to make a point here today.
“I was in San Francisco talking to a group at a fundraiser and somebody asked how’re you going to get votes in Pennsylvania? What’s going on there? We hear that’s its hard for some working class people to get behind you’re campaign. I said, “Well look, they’re frustrated and for good reason. Because for the last 25 years they’ve seen jobs shipped overseas. They’ve seen their economies collapse. They have lost their jobs. They have lost their pensions. They have lost their healthcare.
“And for 25, 30 years Democrats and Republicans have come before them and said we’re going to make your community better. We’re going to make it right and nothing ever happens. And of course they’re bitter. Of course they’re frustrated. You would be too. In fact many of you are. Because the same thing has happened here in Indiana. The same thing happened across the border in Decatur. The same thing has happened all across the country. Nobody is looking out for you. Nobody is thinking about you. And so people end up- they don’t vote on economic issues because they don’t expect anybody’s going to help them. So people end up, you know, voting on issues like guns, and are they going to have the right to bear arms. They vote on issues like gay marriage. And they take refuge in their faith and their community and their families and things they can count on. But they don’t believe they can count on Washington. So I made this statement-- so, here’s what rich. Senator Clinton says ‘No, I don’t think that people are bitter in Pennsylvania. You know, I think Barack’s being condescending.’ John McCain says, ‘Oh, how could he say that? How could he say people are bitter? You know, he’s obviously out of touch with people.’
“Out of touch? Out of touch? I mean, John McCain—it took him three tries to finally figure out that the home foreclosure crisis was a problem and to come up with a plan for it, and he’s saying I’m out of touch? Senator Clinton voted for a credit card-sponsored bankruptcy bill that made it harder for people to get out of debt after taking money from the financial services companies, and she says I’m out of touch? No, I’m in touch. I know exactly what’s going on. I know what’s going on in Pennsylvania. I know what’s going on in Indiana. I know what’s going on in Illinois. People are fed-up. They’re angry and they’re frustrated and they’re bitter. And they want to see a change in Washington and that’s why I’m running for President of the United States of America.”"
April 11, 2008 9:40 PM | Reply | Permalink
The only question is whether the MSM is willing to show that response from Obama. The controversy is very clean right now: Obama says something stupid, McCain & Hillary pounce. As usual, the devil is in the details. I'm sure the folks here who hate Obama will claim this is just a do-over, and perhaps it is. But context is everything. The people in that hall in Indiana seemed to get it, that's for sure. My guess is that by being 100% unapologetic, he will get a chance to air a more full response to this controversy. Will it become big enough for him to go on the Sunday shows?? That would be a sure way to get his point across uninterrupted. Doubt it will happen, though.
It was lovely to see Hillary quoting Ed Rollins & Grover Norquist for her validation on this story, BTW. Penn is clearly still hanging around.
Just watch it.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Sc9PepjyDow
April 11, 2008 9:47 PM | Reply | Permalink
Exactly. Watch the reaction as ordinary people listen to someone talk to them like adults. Clinton is saying: "No, treat them like the children that they are. Just flatter and pander to them. Stop being so complicated!" The people listening in Indiana know exactly what he is saying. As cswartout says, watch it!
http://www.dailykos.com/story/2008/4/11/212019/438/254/494026
April 11, 2008 9:55 PM | Reply | Permalink
MarkC,
Thanks for the attaboy. I do think that his being completely unapologetic is exactly the right way to handle this. It absolutely forces the press to ask WHY he is being unapologetic. He then gets the opportunity to respond on his terms and they have to get it into the political bloodstream.
DO NOT APOLOGIZE.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Sc9PepjyDow
April 11, 2008 10:03 PM | Reply | Permalink
The GOP-Media machine is fighting hard. (Thanks Mayhill, for her asinine Gotcha games)
I'm glad Obama is fighting back:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Sc9PepjyDow
They won't be satisfied until all our jobs are outsourced, and we have 8000 dead in Iraq.
And yes, I am bitter!!
April 11, 2008 9:51 PM | Reply | Permalink
Good attempt on Obama's part to try explaining away his comment but he's simply twisting his words to deflect. He did not accurately relate what he said. He needs to be clearer about what he actually said in San Francisco. It's on tape and the comparison will only make him look even less credible and honest. He needs to make a clear apology. Anything short of than won't work.
Matthew
http://www.TheProblemWithObama.com
April 11, 2008 10:00 PM | Reply | Permalink
I don't support censorship, however, I also don't support advertising your hateful site on this forum. I have asked JMM to have you stop your advertising of your inflammatory site. You have a right to blog here with your opinions, but the site sucks, is offensive, and you should not have free advertising.
April 11, 2008 10:01 PM | Reply | Permalink
There is nothing hateful, nor inflammatory about my Web site. It is definitely not about advertising either. I have a very lucrative day job. My Web sites are simply to further share my opinions. I also occasionally post blog entries here at TPM as well. Unlike you and many other commentors, I use my real name and do not hide beyond annonymity. I am not ashamed about my opinions, nor afraid of anyone reading what I write and think. Further, I am respectful of writers, such as you. Finally, while it's probably a hopeless effort, I do take offense and criticize some of the insults and derogatory comments made about writers as it does not add to the discourse on the blogs.
Matthew
http://www.TheIndependentView.com
April 11, 2008 10:14 PM | Reply | Permalink
Sorry, that's BS and you know it. You have banner ads on your site so you get get paid for every page view on your site. Obviously you feel strongly in your opinions and have every right to blog them; but don't act like traffic to your site doesn't do anything for your wallet.
April 11, 2008 10:50 PM | Reply | Permalink
Then there is nothing hateful and inflammatory about Rev. Wright and TUCC either, then. I can go on your site and I can be offended. You can watch Rev. Wright snippets and be offended.
If you can call Rev. Wright and TUCC "hateful" and "inflammatory", than we can return the favor.
It's EXACTLY the same thing.
You offend me.
April 11, 2008 10:51 PM | Reply | Permalink
Oh, and your divisive words are un-American.
April 11, 2008 10:52 PM | Reply | Permalink
I think the media pressure will force him to apologize to the voters.
Breaking News on CNN.
April 11, 2008 10:09 PM | Reply | Permalink
And he'll probably drop out of the race and retire from the Senate and go back to the Chicago slums where he'll steal cars and deal drugs.
It would seem the bitter ones are... in fact... you.
April 11, 2008 10:13 PM | Reply | Permalink
You're a Lou Dobbs fan, aren't you? The King of All Gas Bags.
April 12, 2008 12:55 AM | Reply | Permalink
You can spin this any way you want but it is bad.
Very bad.
Game changing bad.
April 11, 2008 10:04 PM | Reply | Permalink
Didn't you say the same thing about "typical white voter" and Wright and NAFTAgate and ... ?
April 11, 2008 10:06 PM | Reply | Permalink
yes he did, and he was wrong just like always.
April 11, 2008 10:16 PM | Reply | Permalink
The blowback is already starting gotalife. Check CNN, MSNBC, HuffPo...
Especially the comments by real people. They see this for what it is, Clinton and McCain trying to make the most of a perceived gaffe.
Until the people start realizing what Obama really said. The majority of comments I read are the "Sometimes the truth hurts and so far, only Obama is telling the truth" kind of statements.
The video response of Obama seals the deal.
Clinton and McCain can call him elitist, but it only takes a few minutes before the MSM realizes it's Hillary and John that are both worth more than $100 million each.
The blowback has already begun. Hillary and John are "concerned" and think Obama should apologize for insulting middle American culture.
Middle America is responding and they're pissed and tired of hypocritical pandering hacks telling them that only they can fix things.
You're right about one thing. This is bad, game changing bad. Obama just changed the sport, and Hillary and John aren't smart enough to see it.
He just usurped Edwards' cause, and called Clinton and McCain out for their pandering ways...
...and neither of the republicans (Hillary and John) saw it coming.
April 11, 2008 11:27 PM | Reply | Permalink
lol this is hilarious to watch the Hill-bots try to make this into an actual issue.
Nobody cares, it's a non-issue. Hillary hanging on by the thinnest of threads - and Obama doesn't even mention her. LOL classic.
April 11, 2008 10:12 PM | Reply | Permalink
Nobody cares?! Okay, maybe here in the primary he might pull this off but have you noticed the nearly unanimous criticism across the media tonight. Obama is building up a critical mass of character defining items that will sink him in the general election, if he makes it so far:
- 20 years at a hate and racist filled church
- typical white person comments (plus publicly trashing his own grandmother
- small town people
Plus, consider all of his earliest statements that he has had to since come out and correct. Lies or misstatements, you can be sure the Republicans and especially the 527s won't miss the opportunity to refresh everyone's memory.
Matthew
http://www.TheProblemWithObama.com
April 11, 2008 10:20 PM | Reply | Permalink
Backtracking a bit, are we? What are you going to say when he's going to poll much better than McCain come September?
"He might be able to get away with it in the general, but he won't get away with it in the White House. I won't let him! There will be FOX smears and impeachments galore".
HAHAHA!
April 11, 2008 10:40 PM | Reply | Permalink
dude, you are an idiot if you don't see the danger behind these comments.
April 12, 2008 5:11 AM | Reply | Permalink
this is exactly like plagiarism gate.
remember that?
people blogging about it and saying it was the end of him, and the pundits making a huge deal.
it went nowhere, he got in front of it just like he did with this.
this is most definitely not a game changer. and there is little left in the game to change anyway.
April 11, 2008 10:15 PM | Reply | Permalink
Is there no end to Obama's elitism?
http://mediamatters.org/items/200804110004
April 11, 2008 10:18 PM | Reply | Permalink
Clinton spokesman Phil Singer has since responded to Obama's words on his remarks.
“Instead of apologizing for offending small town America, Sen. Obama chose to repeat and embrace the comments he made earlier this week," Singer wrote in a statement. "It’s unfortunate that Sen. Obama didn’t say he was sorry for what he said. Americans are tired of a President who looks down on them — they want a President who will stand up for them for a change. The Americans who live in small towns are optimistic, hardworking and resilient. They deserve a president who will respect them.”
As has McCain's spokesman, Tucker Bounds.
"Instead of apologizing to small town Americans for dismissing their values, Barack Obama arrogantly tried to spin his way out of his outrageous San Francisco remarks. Only an elitist who attributes religious faith and gun ownership to bitterness would think that tax cuts for the rich include families who make $75,000 per year. Only an elitist would say that people vote their values only out of frustration. Barack Obama thinks he knows your hopes and fears better than you do. You can't be more out of touch than that."
FELL RIGHT FOR IT!
Oh, and Obama nay-sayers here, save your drivel, Obama's remarks were aimed directly at the people in these small towns, who know exactly what's going on, and who are now finding out somebody who finally acknowledges them as opposed to just pandering to them. It makes a huge difference. Did you see how fired up that crowd was? Prepare for 9 more months of that!
April 11, 2008 10:23 PM | Reply | Permalink
Obama was not very honest about his original comment and offered a twisted restatement. His audience didn't seem too energetic to me. It would be nice to ask them tomorrow what they think about this.
Matthew
http://www.TheProblemWithObama.com
April 11, 2008 10:40 PM | Reply | Permalink
You have no idea what you said, because your twisted mind parses things Obama says in unrecognizable forms. There seems to be consensus. Check even the CNN blogs.
And remember, he only needs 50% + 1. The beauty of democracy. Your hateful anti-vote will get drowned out.
Say hello to Pres. Obama.
April 11, 2008 10:42 PM | Reply | Permalink
Just out of curiosity. Do you really think those "fired up" fans sitting behind Obama at an Obama rally with the cameras pointing right at them mean anything at all? Maybe we can decide the campaign at the next debate by using an applause meter. Or maybe we can add a laugh track and applause track to the echo chamber.
April 12, 2008 12:42 PM | Reply | Permalink
Matthew, you (and your clones) remind me so much of the house judiciary committee during the Clinton impeachment. Each one kept repeating the same stale, tired talking points, as if repetition made their cynical arguments stronger. As if the public is swayed by legalistic scorekeeping.
You have presented your brief. You then present your opinion as fact. But people think for themselves, more than ever before. You simply can't wrap your mind around the fact that people can no longer be herded into your corral with simple minded scare tactics. Your supreme disdain for the electorate shows in your pat "analysis" of how they will react, as if they are automatons reacting to stimuli.
Things have changed. People make decisions without consulting the demographic tag "experts" like you have pinned to them. No one is entitled to office because they have done everything the experts told them to do. For now, the experts still are not in charge. We still vote for our leaders.
Obama talked to the people and responded to the criticisms. Did it to the utter satisfaction of the small town people he was addressing. (But not you, of course.) You should wag your finger at those people and tell them what they need to be asking Obama. They are not living up to your expectations.
April 11, 2008 10:35 PM | Reply | Permalink
Your comment is interesting. What immediately comes to mind is how blind Obama supporters are in hanging onto his candidacy regardless of what reality might show him to be. And worse, they have such knee-jerk reaction to anyone that might question Obama that they entirely miss what is being said.
Matthew
http://www.TheProblemWithObama.com
April 11, 2008 10:44 PM | Reply | Permalink
Kinda like you with Clinton? First Bubba, then Hill?
April 11, 2008 10:49 PM | Reply | Permalink
There is simply no sensible way in which to interpret Obama's SF comments re: PA such that they imply anything condescending or bitter in the least. If anything, a neutral reader (as many such, in fact, have done) would readily concede that the underlying thrust of his comments here are in defense or justification, if not merely explication, of the resentment and bitterness at issue. In other words, it's but one more political Rorschach test left in the wake of the seemingly interminal march of this primary.
I'm really beginning to suspect (with full knowledge that this confession will likely only feed the 'elitist' meme) that members of the electorate who have had the privilege of experiencing a truly captivating and effective professor seem to "get" Obama's approach in a way that seems to require of others (draw your own PA conclusions here, pollsters) a bit more get-to-know-ya time. Now I suspect the charges of "arrogance" and "condescension" are akin to those levelled by the C+ student in the back-row, shoulder-chipped and resentful of being "lectured," the instructor's experience notwithstanding. Class in session, America. Who's done their homework?
April 11, 2008 10:36 PM | Reply | Permalink
Have you watched his rebuttal? He was speaking in Iowa I believe. As usual, he turned their own words against them and got cheers with 'And they call ME out of touch?' and a standing ovation at the end.
April 11, 2008 10:46 PM | Reply | Permalink
Just saw it; think it was Indiana, in fact. Maybe Columbus, IN? It's on the campaign's site. Phenomenal response. Steel spine indeed.
April 11, 2008 10:54 PM | Reply | Permalink
It was Terre Haute, IN
April 12, 2008 1:29 AM | Reply | Permalink
He was speaking in Indiana.
April 11, 2008 10:57 PM | Reply | Permalink
Well, I watched the youtube and he had me standing up clapping, all alone here in my house, just the way he did at his speech at the Democratic National Convention.
April 11, 2008 10:43 PM | Reply | Permalink
http://www.reuters.com/article/topNews/idUSN1116676020080412?feedType=RSS&feedName=topNews&rpc=22&sp=true
LOL.
I told you guys he was arrogant. He'll continue to show his true colors.
Just another reason he cannot/will not win general election.
I TOLD YOU SO.....
HAHA HAA
April 11, 2008 10:45 PM | Reply | Permalink
Fast news day, huh RaeK. You just got slapped down. People in America can tell empathy from pandering. And Obama's creating a revolution in small town America.
Clinton is TOAST.
April 11, 2008 10:48 PM | Reply | Permalink
HIDE THE CHILDREN!
The McCain Girl wannabe is B-A-A-A-A-A-CK! :o
Say "G'night," Hillary.
April 12, 2008 12:13 AM | Reply | Permalink
Obama beats the crap out of Clinton and McCain over this: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Sc9PepjyDow
Obama is the master of the counterattack. His speeches are like Marth's Down+B attack in Super Smash Brothers Melee.
April 11, 2008 10:47 PM | Reply | Permalink
By the way, how do you interpret Obama's criticism that small town people cling to anti-trade sentiment? Does this mean that Obama is once again supporting NAFTA?
Matthew
http:/www.TheProblemWithObama.com
April 11, 2008 10:54 PM | Reply | Permalink
Well, when slimy candidates preach labor cant whilst:
I. ... taking direct campaign advice from (a) a long-time strategist and pollster and (b) their ex-president spouse, both of whom are on record as accepting money to actually hasten passage of the self-same "free" trade agreement that said candidate has repeatedly denounced as bad policy ..
II. ... cheerleading for passage of comparable "free" trade agreement whilst their spouse is president, only to lie on a dime about said endorsement in the heat of a presidential primary ...
III. ... and repeatedly lobbing accusations at their fellow-party member of basically every vice or shady tactic, in fact, that they themselves indulge in whilst trying to undermine the democratically elected nominee of their own party?
And you wonder why folks are bitter? We're not out of touch, sir.
You're out of touch.
April 11, 2008 11:01 PM | Reply | Permalink
I never saw that Obama is anti-trade. He just has some disagreements with NAFTA.
Why am I wasting my time responding to you, bigot?
April 11, 2008 11:08 PM | Reply | Permalink
Where does "bigot" come into this conversation. Obviously you've run out of substantive conversation, if you had any. Reducing your commentary to insults is, at best, immature.
Matthew
http://www.TheProblemWithObama.com
April 11, 2008 11:14 PM | Reply | Permalink
"Where does 'bigot' come into this conversation."
Your website, bigot.
April 11, 2008 11:16 PM | Reply | Permalink
Obama laying the smack down..
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Sc9PepjyDow
April 11, 2008 11:13 PM | Reply | Permalink
Okay, admittedly, I haven't had the rug of economic prosperity jerked out from underneath me like many people living in former industrial towns in Pennsylvania. BUT if I were in that position, I would much rather have someone recognize my justifiable anger than have someone patronize me as "resilient."
April 11, 2008 10:57 PM | Reply | Permalink
Forgive me if these points have already been made (It's been a busy day and I haven't had the chance to read much of this and related threads), but it seems to me that the Clinton campaign had this "ammunition" at the ready in order to counter a potential bad press incident that might occur. Bill Clinton created that incident today.
But the weakness of said "ammunition" only further confirms that they don't have anything of actual substance to throw at Barack Obama.
You know it's not much when only Fox and angry trolls (same difference?) are taking it seriously.
April 11, 2008 11:18 PM | Reply | Permalink
This is soo not an issue, but McCain and his girlfriend Hillary are really trying to make it one. They must not have read the comments in its context. I mean how can you disagree with what he said? its true...
BUT, BO response is not only a good one, its kinda hilarious as well.
April 11, 2008 11:29 PM | Reply | Permalink
Uh oh, now the Obama supporters are bitter.
Where is the hope?
That is right.
It coming from Clinton.
April 11, 2008 11:34 PM | Reply | Permalink
It's anger at a repressive regime that resists violently to dissent. Not that you'd know or care about democracy or the voice of the people.
Clinton IS the hope of the status-quo, the cronies, millionaires, and Washington fat cats. And their days are numbered.
April 11, 2008 11:43 PM | Reply | Permalink
The only thing coming from Clinton is sniper and an exaggerated resume.
April 11, 2008 11:48 PM | Reply | Permalink
It's an issue. He was condescending and patronizing. If you fail to understand that every thing this guy says is not golden, you leave him open to defeat in November.
Take off the rose colored glasses. This could kill him in PA.
April 11, 2008 11:44 PM | Reply | Permalink
You don't hear what he says. People in PA and IN do. And they can tell genuine empathy from pandering.
April 11, 2008 11:48 PM | Reply | Permalink
I am so glad to see all the HRC supporters here saying Obama is done. That is such potent evidence that this thing is nothing and Obama will sail by. HRC and her supporters have the ultimate in tin ears. Their predictions never fail to fail (like Hillary!).
April 11, 2008 11:45 PM | Reply | Permalink
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Sc9PepjyDow
Obama = the real deal
April 11, 2008 11:47 PM | Reply | Permalink
Obama disrespected the voters and did not apologize.
Time for him to take an extended vacation and drop out.
April 11, 2008 11:51 PM | Reply | Permalink
Wow. You guys must be working over time as the PA primary approaches. Watching your lead tighten probably means you have to work 16-20 hour shifts.
I bet the glitch with the log-in really gives you a headache.
April 12, 2008 12:22 AM | Reply | Permalink
Not smart Senator Empty Suit Obama. Watch out for the BITTER ordinary whitefolks. God Bless Revered Wright while I'm at it and Louie FaraCAN. For the sake of it add Mrs. Obama who is now proud to be American for the first time in her adult life. Of course Senator Obama you forgot to mention your vacation in Pakistan (after Indonesia) in the 80's in 2 books. Of course you are so honest it must just slipped your mind, I mean three weeks in Pakistan...everyone vists, so much to see and do. Party like Amsterdam.
Another Obama F-up:
"You go into these small towns in Pennsylvania and, like a lot of small towns in the Midwest, the jobs have been gone now for 25 years and nothing's replaced them. And they fell through the Clinton administration, and the Bush administration, and each successive administration has said that somehow these communities are gonna regenerate and they have not.
And it's not surprising then they get bitter, they cling to guns or religion or antipathy toward people who aren't like them or anti-immigrant sentiment or anti-trade sentiment as a way to explain their frustrations."
Obama the Empty Suit.
April 11, 2008 11:52 PM | Reply | Permalink
Do you have a random post generator? Maybe you feed it your list of concerns, rank them, and it generated a spew that you can copy paste?
It must save time, although between you, imbecilic and Weaver, it is starting to show.
April 12, 2008 12:24 AM | Reply | Permalink
Perhaps Bill Clinton would like to comment on this situation. He's doing so well with his remarks these days.
For a guy who's over 60 and all.
April 11, 2008 11:53 PM | Reply | Permalink
For the millionth time this primary season, gotalife aka Judge Antonin and Marginal Player aka Marginal Intelligence declare Obama finished!
Dream on boys.
OBAMA========The Next POTUS
April 12, 2008 12:00 AM | Reply | Permalink
I love how Obama won't be framed by HRC or the GOP. Just like on Wright, when they wanted to turn it into "when was he in the pews." Here, HRC fully expected he would cower and make some crap statement about how he "misspoke" (like a certain other Dem candidate) and do a false mea culpa. Instead, he turns it around and says, "Yeah, I said it and here's why" and people say, "Huh, makes sense." He's the best candidate ever.
Now, can we talk about HRC's conflicts of interest and what role Bill will play in the White House and how we will hold him accountable?
April 12, 2008 12:01 AM | Reply | Permalink
Hillary and her supporters are on the WRONG side of history. Everything she says will be held against her in the history books because she is criticizing one of the nations most important presidents. Obama will probably have a Washington monument built for him in DC.........his achievements are on par with George Washington, MLK and Lincoln.
April 12, 2008 12:22 AM | Reply | Permalink
okay don't start having orgasm here.
April 12, 2008 5:16 AM | Reply | Permalink
Alaskans have been promised by Republicans for years that ANWR would be opened for oil exploration, all the Republicans needed was a majority...
Hmmmmm, 7 years of a majority and nothing happened, why am I not surprised? What a shock that politicians promise and lie in campaigns!
What I find interesting is that I've felt all along that the Clinton campaign was 'talking down' to voters. Some people ARE bitter, some are not... most are just fed up but don't let it get to them.
I think the Clinton's are bitter, and their campaign has been their revenge. With all of Hillary's 'promises' I can't help but wonder how many she'll be able to get through... and how many she'll have to make excuses for.
April 12, 2008 12:23 AM | Reply | Permalink
Gotalife
If you look at Obama's response to Sen Clinton and Sen McCain's criticism and also watch the response of the people, you see so much of pride in his supporters.
It looks like whenever Obama is challenged, he speaks from the bottom of his heart and it creates hope in all his supporters that he is running for a purpose.
Clinton is not a trustworthy politician. She has a lot of good ideas but she will not be able to get any of that implemented because she will be more interested in taking credit for the ideas rather than getting implemented.
So support Obama because he is a people's president.
April 12, 2008 12:24 AM | Reply | Permalink
I'm from south central PA and after reading his comments, I absolutely agree with Obama. He's right. Just like Ohio and Michigan, I am bitter over high oil prices, Iraq, outsourcing, high executive pay, rising prices, etc...your damn right i am bitter. I am voting for Obama.
April 12, 2008 12:28 AM | Reply | Permalink
I just saw Obama's response. It only reinforced my convictions about this man. He has my vote, all the way.
Peace--
Vyv
April 12, 2008 12:37 AM | Reply | Permalink
Sorry Gotalife and creepy-ass ice cream head avatar thing, and all of the Hillaristas and Republictrolls squealing with delight, but, once again, Hillary and St. John just got their asses smacked off and handed to them in a package by Obama.
You know, it really almost makes me feel sorry for you guys. This is like, what, the two thousand and thirty first time you've gotten yourselves all worked up over the latest career-ending fake scandal only to see it blow up in your faces? Time after time since about last November, it seems like you've just barely gotten the gleeful chortling and hand rubbing going over the certain doom of his candidacy, when once again does that political jijitsu thing he does so well and turns it around on your people and your hopes are dashed once again.
The emotional roller coaster you put yourselves on over these things must be exhausting.
Honestly, the spectacle has taken on that same element of comic pathos you feel when you watch yet another of Wyle E. Coyote's plans disasterously unravelling because of his tragically persistant faith in the products of the Acme Company.
April 12, 2008 12:48 AM | Reply | Permalink
Obama's gonna be a great president.
April 12, 2008 12:53 AM | Reply | Permalink
Damn straight.
April 12, 2008 1:19 AM | Reply | Permalink
Finally, a president who will tell us the truth from day one.
April 12, 2008 3:07 AM | Reply | Permalink
McCain and Clinton try to manufacture a scandal by twisting Obama's original, truthful words.
He opens a can of whoopass. Brings the crowd to its feet. Shows that anger and fight some people thought he was missing -- but he does it in a way that makes ya laugh while thinking, Damn, he's so right.
He's so good at this, it's getting predictable. I'd be so proud of a President like this ...
April 12, 2008 12:56 AM | Reply | Permalink
I don't see the problem. I agee with Senator Obama. In fact, the bitterest people don't vote at all, exactly for the reasons he stated. That's the biggest voting demographic, the ones who don't vote. I may be wrong, but I don't think that demographic can vote in the primary in Penn, can they? But looking towards the election, energizing the non-voting non-involved people is a good move. Atleast trying is good. Good for the country. If more people cared...
But, when you talk about the people over the wheels of Washington, well, that's the news-entertainment industry and all the other mainstays in this game. Be on the opposing side of the establishment and speak the four-letter word of populism, they'll tear you down and call you a fake. Like they did Edwards. They bring up their cherry-picked soundbites, and then ignore or downplay your responses and your campaign. Look what they did to Gore.
I hope it goes well.
April 12, 2008 1:05 AM | Reply | Permalink
President Barack Obama
Get used to it.
Okay, I stole this from another site but I thought it was cool.
April 12, 2008 1:33 AM | Reply | Permalink
I like it! I think I'll steal it too.
April 12, 2008 1:41 AM | Reply | Permalink
Barack Obama has this secret weapon... It's become exceptionally rare, especially among prominent politicians.
It's called - *Reason*.
April 12, 2008 1:35 AM | Reply | Permalink
It's even more than that...
it's Honesty.
Even if you don't always agree with Obama, you know he's not spinning you. He's telling you how it is (or, how he thinks it is).
It just happens that most people agree with him.
April 12, 2008 1:42 AM | Reply | Permalink
We're in agreement. He has courage in the first place; the courage to voice reason in place of the calculated "safety" of spin.
Courage + Reason = Honesty. :) (At least in this context.)
And yes, even if one doesn't agree with his reasoning at times (like me with NASA!), he's honest, nonetheless.
And it strikes me... I feel John McCain has a measure of that quality. I just disagree, often very strongly, with too many of his conclusions.
Hillary Clinton...? Sadly, in my observation... That quality is virtually undetectable.
April 12, 2008 2:42 AM | Reply | Permalink
reason is so elitist.
can i really vote for someone i think is better than me?
a slightly different thought:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6viAqJTyP7Y
April 12, 2008 2:10 AM | Reply | Permalink
Seen it and emailed it to many a friend and acquaintance! :)
Anyone who hasn't seen this video, CLICK THAT DAMNED LINK!
And stick with it. Some people are turned by it in the beginning (often by the language). I say you'll be glad if you give it a chance and your full attention. It's brilliant and very touching...
I wish they'd put it up on the big screens at the Obama rally here, but there were children present. :) 12,000 people would have been laughing and crying.
April 12, 2008 2:52 AM | Reply | Permalink
Quick question for the people in this thread who aren't having an orgasm over Obama's comments:
You do realize that the first person to bring small-town resentment up in this campaign was Mike Huckabee, right?
Huckabee mentioned in a debate (and several times afterward) that evangelical voters across the country were upset that they had loyally supported the Republicans for two decades now and had bugger all to show for it.
He shot out of the pack shortly thereafter and proved so popular in some parts of the country that he was able to score 60% of the Republican vote in Kansas when he had run out of money and McCain was only a few delegates away from winning the nomination.
Why do you suppose that was?
April 12, 2008 1:48 AM | Reply | Permalink
I agree, Mike Huckabee said some really reasonable things, when he wasn't saying things like the Earth of only six thousand years old.
April 12, 2008 2:59 AM | Reply | Permalink
Make that *is*.
I'm so the target market for an edit feature. :)
April 12, 2008 3:01 AM | Reply | Permalink
Me and my working class buddies are pretty sick-and-tired of a certain crooked John Kerry snob in blackface buying up elections, disenfranchising voters, and looking down his effete mulatto snoot at us.
It's not surprising then that we're also sick of all you limousine liberals who cling to your second amendment-hating atheism and your antipathy towards working people who are against exporting American jobs, as a way of explaining your greedy parasitic frustrations.
April 12, 2008 2:03 AM | Reply | Permalink
nice try, stephen, but the Politics of Hate won't work this time.
It's over.
President Barack Obama.
Better get used to it.
April 12, 2008 2:07 AM | Reply | Permalink
Well guess what, we're tired of you modern-day Pharisees in the Rethuglican party.
We're tired of you starting wars, promoting torture, and starving the poor and still getting away with calling yourselves Christians.
We're tired of you spitting all over the Constitution in the name of 'protecting America.'
We're tired of your wink-wink-nudge-nudge racism, and your use of it to advance your plutocratic agenda.
It's all very un-American, and we'd like it to stop.
April 12, 2008 2:17 AM | Reply | Permalink
Surprisingly, CNN defended Obama on his Pennsylvania remarks and ridiculed McCain and Clinton for slamming him. I say surprisingly because I've never seen CNN defend Obama so aggressively. It was great!
April 12, 2008 2:48 AM | Reply | Permalink
that's right, CNN panel ridiculed Clinton AND McCain: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4G8dRMofHNs
April 12, 2008 3:28 AM | Reply | Permalink
Thanks for the late late update...well done.
April 12, 2008 3:07 AM | Reply | Permalink
First of all, way to go, Hillary! Bullseye! She scored big.
As for Obama, who came across as angry and bitter? Obama did. It's amazing. He's been ahead in the race for quite some time. Many are treating him as the presumptive nominee. He's raking in the money and outspending both Hillary and McCain. But who is angry? He is.
He may be feeling confident enough right now to let lose, but it isn't going to play well with anyone except his supporters. He reeked of attitude in that video. He came across arrogant, self-righteous, and a wee bit threatening. He looked like he's getting ready to lead a riot at the convention. He should have stuck with the script his spokesperson put out as damage control.
April 12, 2008 3:14 AM | Reply | Permalink
Wow, the Clinton squad is out in full force -- their desperation is palpable!
Obama '08!
April 12, 2008 3:21 AM | Reply | Permalink
I admit that I am bias...against ignorant people, such as those who call Obama a racist (Matthew). Obama is half white, and was raised by a white mother and white grandparents. How can someone be racist against his own self and his own upbringing? Obama being called a racist is the stupidest argument that people are putting out there. If you only see black when you look at him then that's your problem, but that has not been Obama's reality. His mother and grandparents are as white as yours. Obama's own identity is with both white people and black people--and because of that he can (and has the right to) speak of both experiences.
April 12, 2008 3:25 AM | Reply | Permalink
He came off tough, not angry, which is good after those skinny vacation legs and effeminate bowling. :)
I think he made some new fans tonight, especially with the guys. Honestly.
April 12, 2008 3:34 AM | Reply | Permalink
I'm sure the "bitter" people of Pennsylvania are going to appreciate Mr. Obama traveling all the way to their State to explain to them why they are such narrow-minded, frustrated people.
"And it's not surprising then they get bitter, they cling to guns or religion or antipathy toward people who aren't like them or anti-immigrant sentiment or anti-trade sentiment as a way to explain their frustrations."
And it was so good of Mr. Obama to put it into terms that even they could understand. Yes, they're just going to love it!
April 12, 2008 4:03 AM | Reply | Permalink
Otto F - I think you better get used to Obama delivering some hard punches on Clinton. His tone has definitely changed this last week, he's through with politely dancing around her and is working up to a knock out. You Clinton supporters claim you want a fighter, well get ready cuz it appears Obama's gloves are off. I, and millions more, say it's about time!
April 12, 2008 4:09 AM | Reply | Permalink
Guys, give TPM a break. When compared to other outfits, I'd rely on TPM to give it to me straighter any day. Media bias is exactly what these guys are trying to avoid, and when you only have so much time to get something out, you can only focus on so much. Full context and the like can always come later, but as a news organization, TPM tries like everyone else to get the story out ASAP.
The genius behind TPM being online is they can provide context through youtube videos without taking up airtime. You will never see cable news provide the kind of context TPM can, precisely for this reason.
So chill out, guys, TPM hasn't steered us wrong, yet. You can always criticize, but please make it constructive. Ask politely for the full context, don't be rude about it.
(Note how I didn't really address the topic, because I really don't want to dignify this nontroversy with a response except to say that Obama's points = swish.)
April 12, 2008 4:25 AM | Reply | Permalink
Wow. I'm a big Obama supporter and I'm afraid this could really turn into a shit-storm. I don't disagree with what he said, but I don't think you can get away with saying that people use religion and guns as a crutch in this country without a hell of a backlash.
I hope I'm wrong. His response/explanation in Indiana was very good and the reception he got on CNN was MUCH more positive than I'd have ever expected. If he can turn this into a positive instead of a negative, he's the best politician in my lifetime. But I won't be surprised if this REALLY hurts him. It's not a manufactured story - its a self-inflicted wound. The first one that might be really bad. I hope I'm wrong. I hope its not bad. But this one has me worried.
April 12, 2008 4:25 AM | Reply | Permalink
If you're such a big Obama supporter, why do you lose faith so quickly and border on concern trolling?
There is no negative here, just a manufactured controversy for the sake of scoring points. I don't know the exact situation in Pennsylvania, but I do know people, as Obama said, rely on the things they can count on in times of hardship (family, religion, 'how things should be'). People see hard times and they look for an explanation, often in the wrong places (immigration, gay rights, etc.).
You worry because Obama didn't pander to anyone - because it gave it straight? I'm not going to question your support, but maybe you should reconsider WHY you support him so much. If it's not because he's one damn honest politician, then ... I just don't know.
April 12, 2008 4:34 AM | Reply | Permalink
Obama made those remarks in San Francisco before an elite group of fund raisers. He was questioned about his difficulties in Pennsylvania, and his remarks were his attempt to explain the working class Pennsylvanian to the wealthy San Francisco fund raisers. In doing so he was totally condescending, and the people of Pennsylvania should resent it. We should all see Obama for the aloof elitist that he is. We should also note his cynical attitude toward basic human nature. And we shouldn't be surprised that a man who would publicly denounce his own grandmother's racism would have so little regard for strangers.
April 12, 2008 4:29 AM | Reply | Permalink
Jeez, shut the hell up.
April 12, 2008 4:35 AM | Reply | Permalink
Here is how Fox News is covering the story:
"Hillary Clinton and John McCain both ripped into Barack Obama Friday for reportedly saying residents of small-town America “cling to guns or religion or antipathy to people who aren’t like them” out of bitterness over lost jobs.
"His opponents interpreted the remarks as arrogant, but Obama stood by the statement Friday and even elaborated on the argument that many people in small towns are bitter and frustrated with the status quo in Washington."
The article continues on, stressing Obama's elitism and calling him out of touch. Good going, Obama. Just what McCain needed.
April 12, 2008 4:41 AM | Reply | Permalink
Otto, Otto, Otto.
Look at which "news" outlet you are quoting.
Silly Otto.
April 12, 2008 9:26 AM | Reply | Permalink
"If you're such a big Obama supporter, why do you lose faith so quickly and border on concern trolling?
There is no negative here, just a manufactured controversy for the sake of scoring points..."
I hope you're right. I wasn't trolling at all. I just never assume that because something doesn't offend ME that it won't offend a lot of other people. I'm not losing faith in Obama, but I think the remarks in San Francisco could come off badly to some of the very people he's talking about. OTOH, his clarification in Indiana was very effective and might actually pull MORE of them to his side - I very much hope so. And the reception he got on CNN was incredible, and surprising to me given the media's desire to turn anything like this into a big controversy. If he manages to turn this into a net positive, he's even better than I thought he was and I already thought he was the best I've seen in my lifetime.
I remain a strong supporter for a number of the reasons you mentioned. But, as an observer, I always expect the worst and I'm seldom disappointed. I hope to be disappointed this time.
April 12, 2008 4:53 AM | Reply | Permalink
BTW, the good news is that there's no video of the original remarks, which I think could be seen as condescending in print. But there is video of his Indiana response, which was excellent. So if that's what people take from this story, it could be a net positive for him, which would be incredibly good news.
But I'm still worried. Its my nature :)
April 12, 2008 5:05 AM | Reply | Permalink
That is the most honest and revealing comment I have ever heard in the echo chamber. I suspect you just said what everyone else here secretly thinks. It's really a little sad I think.
April 12, 2008 12:07 PM | Reply | Permalink
Callng a large swath of people in small towns in rural midwest as religious, gun-owning, anti-immigrant because they are bitter about their job losses is the stupidest thing a presidential candidate could say. I can't imagine how can you paint such a broad brush and come to such simplistic conclusion. Even if it is true for some people, it came out in such a condescending way by passing direct judgment on them, that it is going to really really turn off lot of people.
When you are a presidential candidate the last thing you do is pass judgment on voters.
I'm telling you this comment is going to sink him.
April 12, 2008 5:07 AM | Reply | Permalink
I think his description applies to a great many people.
And to ramboorider, I didn't mean to say you WERE concern trolling, it just started to sound a little like it.
April 12, 2008 5:44 AM | Reply | Permalink
No. It just gives Obama a chance to pivot to the argument that will win the election:
For 30 years, the neocons have conned America with nonsensical crap about welfare queens, democrats taking people's guns, and gays getting married. It's time to call them out on this con job. It's time to tell the American people what evil con artists the hacks on the right really are.
Obama will unite the country. But in order to unite this country, he must destroy that which is dividing it.
April 12, 2008 5:45 AM | Reply | Permalink
Interesting. You have taken comments Obama made in SF to explain why he can't win Pennsylvania and morphed them into heroic challenges that Obama threw down on the campaign trail. Reading your comment, I envision Obama slogging through the mud of rural Pennsylvania like some latter day Huey Long, raising the consciousness of the downtrodden hayseeds, rallying them to him to turn the rascals out!
But it didn't quite happen that way, did it?
April 12, 2008 10:27 AM | Reply | Permalink
Do you guys really not see the problem with his statement? Everyone is focusing on the bitter part, and not on what he said about the clinging to guns, religions, etc. That is what people are upset about. Just look at the right-wing places, if you don't live in PA. None of them are talking about "bitter." In fact, the focus on bitter, and not on what follows is just playing into the Republicans' hands by making it look like Obama is so out of touch with working-class America that he doesn't even understand what he needs to apologize for!
But honestly, can you guys really not see how the "clinging" part sounds insulting? I mean, it sounds like he is implying that there is something wrong with guns and religion, and that if we had jobs, then we wouldn't want them.
April 12, 2008 6:40 AM | Reply | Permalink
but really you gotta remember, John McCain and Hillary Clinton jumped on the Bitter part, meaning THATS what this became about.
and now that the media has weighed in, they are making McCain and Clinton look bad on it.
sure WE all know what the rest of the quote is, but I bet really only fox news will show it.
its now become are people bitter at their government, McCain and Clinton say no, Obama says yes.
I agree he got away with his misspeak, but its McCain and Hillary's fault. they let him get away with it by only attacking him on the bitter part, and calling him out of touch. to go back and try and change what they are attacking him on, wont work IMO.
April 12, 2008 7:54 AM | Reply | Permalink
Obama is very good at changing the subject. Plays his base incredibly well and some of the MSM. Be interesting to see what people decide his real attitude toward America is. One of his strengths was supposed to be that he would not energize the Republican base. We were going to sort of slide into office while the Republican base wasn't looking. A couple of more value comments should wake them up.
I've never liked Obama, and the more I see him and hear him the more I'm convinced he's not someone I can support. I don't think he'll be a worse than average President if he gets elected. I think he'll be a President who makes a lot of excuses and scapegoats anybody he can to cover his ass.
April 12, 2008 10:22 AM | Reply | Permalink
goatlife and Matthew Weaver are paid-for-posting trolls.
nuf said.
Obama. Kicks. Fuckin'. Ass.
April 12, 2008 8:06 AM | Reply | Permalink
magurakurin,
I am just getting up this morning and reading posts from newest back. Yours strikes a raw nerve. Your accusation is without proof and absolutely untrue. I am not affiliated with any campaign, party or group. I am definitely not paid in any way, shape, or form for writing or sharing my opinions. My Web sites are at my own expense and my comments are my own. Furthermore, I use my real name as I am not ashamed of what I write, nor afraid that someone I know will see it and question my views or say that what I write is different than what I say to my friends directly. This is more than I can say for you and most of the commenters who hide behind annonymity to spew their insults and accusations.
Matthew
http://www.TheIndependentView.com
April 12, 2008 9:41 AM | Reply | Permalink
Weaver you are lying. You are a part of The Aryan Nation movement. You are A Racist Scumbag!!!!!!
April 12, 2008 10:30 AM | Reply | Permalink
ps....just in case you don't know it yet
this just cost your guy the nomination and the election.
just in case you don't know it yet.
April 12, 2008 8:26 AM | Reply | Permalink
That CNN clip is something. Jack Cafferty ties this comment to NAFTA and says, basically, sure people are bitter because they've been lied to by the idiots in Washington who sold them out with things like NAFTA. Toobin says that HRC should be "embarrassed" about the way she "twisted" his remarks.
April 12, 2008 8:36 AM | Reply | Permalink