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Fox Poll: Hillary Doing Better Than Obama Against McCain With Independents

A second national poll finds that Barack Obama's advantage among independents in general election match-ups may have disappeared, and Hillary Clinton is now performing better among them against John McCain.

The new Fox News poll finds John McCain winning independents against Hillary Clinton by a 42%-38% margin -- and doing even better against Obama, winning indys by 47%-37%.

For comparison the previous Fox poll in March had McCain winning independents 47%-31% against Clinton, and 45%-37% against Obama -- meaning that Hillary's standing has improved, while Obama's latest campaign travails may have caused his position to stagnate or even decline.

The difference between Hillary and Obama's indy support is not statistically significant, but the finding that Obama's advantage among them may have disappeared was also the finding in an Associated Press poll that came out on Monday.


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"One thing Americans can't stand are people who say one thing and do another within a 48-hour period," said Chris LaCivita, who helped create the "Swift Boat" ads that damaged John Kerry's 2004 presidential campaign, referring to Obama's recent praise of his pastor.

"This is an issue that is not going to go away no matter how many prepackaged phony speeches Obama makes," LaCivita said.

I thought he was referring to Hillary on NAFTA, her war, and the use of poetry on the campaign trail.

"This is an issue that is not going to go away no matter how many prepackaged phony speeches Obama makes," LaCivita said."

Its funny that a gutless Hillary supporter would quote a scared republican - oh the irony...

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A Clinton supporter turning to one of the original Swiftboaters for support.

You people aren't real self-aware, are you?


Zogby Today


NOTICE THE MATCH UPS WITH NADER IN THE RACE



Obama  45- McCain 34, Barr 3, Nader 1

McCain 44 - Clinton 34, Barr 4, Nader 3

I'm disinclined to believe any Zogby poll, as much as I might like to believe it's true.

Don't you think realize that enough Obama voters will go to Nader to hurt Clinton ?

These may not be the actual numbers, but the political reality. Don't you think?

So, Maria, you're saying that Obama supporters are so unprincipled that they would vote for Nader, a man many Obama supporters called a self-promoting spoiler when he entered the race? Wow. Why are you attacking Obama supporters like that and calling them hypocrites?

Don't forget that Zogby changed their formula from earlier this year, and nailed the call on PA.

The type of person that cares about Wright will continue to care about Wright no matter what. I would also argue that MOST of these people are ignorant and will continue to be ignorant. No amount of speeches or denunciations will ever satisfy them. They've made up their minds and probably had the second the story came out, without every investigating the matter.

The rest of us could really give two shits, that goes for supporters of all the candidates not just Obama. We don't believe in guilt by association and tabloid journalism.

If you'd like some enlightenment, I'd give this article a read:

http://blogs.tnr.com/tnr/blogs/the_stump/archive/2008/04/29/why-d-obama-join-trinity-in-the-first-place.aspx?CommentPosted=true

Not that it matters, I'm sure your mind is made up.

Tiny sample size--400 Dems, 230 Independents. Fox polls have been way off in general.

A sample size of 1000 or so sounds reasonable. Is their inaccuracy supposition, or do you have evidence for that?
Their numbers on Bush/Congress are pretty much in line with other polls, suggesting they don't have a very skewed global sample.

But 230 is a pretty small sample for drawing any conclusions about independents. I don't have any links to back it up, but my recollection is that Fox polls have been fairly consistently underestimating Obama's support.

oh crap! you posted a fox poll! Don't let Greg see ya!

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Do you happen to know the dates of the March poll?

Just curious.

And Republicans really don't like Clinton, do they? (looking at the favorables/unfavorables of each candidate).

ABC News: Describing the potential of uncovering more negative information on Obama, LaCivita says he is eager. "Like a good red wine, he just gets better with age," the GOP strategist said of Obama.

By taking such a strong stance on the pastor whom he recently said he "could no more disown" than his own white grandmother, Obama also risks alienating black voters.

Its funny that a gutless Hillary supporter would quote a scared republican - oh the irony...

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I love the belief on the part of Obama haters that Hillary is somehow going to be able to withstand the constant references to "Do you want Bill back in the White House?" that she will be subjected to, if she's the nominee.

Of course, she's not going to be the nominee, so Otto here is just doing a public service by pointing out what some slimebucket Republican strategist has said.

Who, deep down in the tiny place masquerading as his heart, really wants Clinton to be the nominee, because he knows she'll be toast against the Republicans.

And the Swiftboaters would be at a complete loss finding material to use against Hillary. I mean, that's the reason the Right's been so quiet in their criticism of her, right? They haven't been holding their fire in the hopes of her gaining the nomination, have they? She's just so darn squeaky clean, right?
The writing's on the wall - the wingnuts are dying to take on Hillary. Up against McCain, her negatives would go through the roof. She's got no personal charisma, which is the best defense against Swiftboating.

This too will pass. As soon as Obama can stop having to fight off Clinton 1, Clinton 2, and McCain at the same time... his standing is going to greatly improve.

McCain is ripe for the pickin'.... and that pickin' is gonna be done by Barack Obama!


And do you wanna talk about say one thing and do another? WHOOOOOEEEEEEEE! McCain is a prime example. "The war is bad! The war is good!" "Tax cuts are bad! Tax Cuts are good!" "Campaign finance reform is good! Campaign finance reform is bad!"

Seriously! It is so obvious, it is LAUGHABLE!

Fox News polls are useless and so was that A.P poll, it was not even a poll of registered or likely voters. McCAin cheated on his first wife and married his mistress. His mistress forced him to sign a prenuptial agreement. If his own wife does not trust him with her money, why should the american people trust him with theirs? Hillary Clinton is a complete and utter liar, what she is doing now is ensuring she will never be elected to national office, not now or 2012.

Yeah, let's let Hillary get pounded on by everyone non-stop for 5 straight days, we'll take the poll again, and then see how she does.

ABC News: Dr. Boyce Watkins, a finance professor at Syracuse University, says he's heard from many blacks who are "incredibly upset" with the candidate.

"For him to denounce so many things about Pastor Wright, one of the most respected pastors in Chicago, so that he can get this election, that is a textbook case of selling out," said Watkins. "It's like watching a mob movie where Tony Soprano has to whack his best friend because he's angered another mob family."

He predicts that many blacks will sit out the remaining primaries and the general election.

Well, if finance professor Dr. Boyce Watkins says it, it must be true.

Nice post.

I think the real Obama lost more than the Independents.

"He predicts that many blacks will sit out the remaining primaries and the general election."

..then the both of you are smoking cooked cocaine.

LOL!!!!

A finance professor who has "heard from many blacks"!!!!

Who can dispute that?

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Dr. Boyce Watkins is actually a well known social commentator.

He's had other comments about Wright. For instance, on March 15 he wrote on his blog:

Jeremiah Wright is the Pastor for Senator Barack Obama at The Trinity United Church of Christ. Pastor Wright was attacked for very strong comments he has made about race in America. I am a huge fan of Pastor Jeremiah Wright and I consider Pastor Wright to be one of the great Americans of our country.

He's going to be unhappy with what Obama had to do.

I'll tell the other black folks that I know that Dr. Watkins has determined that we are upset and sitting out the remainder of the primary.

That's one of the upside of being black, someone else makes the decisions for me. I wonder what independent thought is like . . er . . . I mean, this is a great decision that we all agree with.

From All Black People.

Yeah, most blacks would sit out the chance to vote for the first black president over some pique about how he treated Wright. Riiiight. A few old schoolers might sit it out, but the vast majority can see that Wright's recent performances were little more than ego trips intended to damage Obama. He had every right to throw the pastor under the bus, and they know it.

And blacks are just jumping at the chance to vote for Hillary after all of Bill's racebaiting.

I just saw that, "finance professor"? You're a fucking clown..lol

Well, good news for courting fickle undecideds, I guess. Henry "The Fonz" Winkler just endorsed Obama.

http://www.lacitybeat.com/cms/story/detail/aaaaayyyy/6975/

Now that is funny considering the Fonz is actually the character that originally "jumped the shark".

BOOM!

Personally, I'm hoping they film an ad where the Fonz hits Clinton on the back of the head like a jukebox and she stops talking about nuking Iran or throwing change at us.

Ha ha ha. Good one. Credit where credit is due.

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I'm waiting to see who Laverne DeFazio endorses.

Interesting. When they ask who the respondents would like to see as president/nominee, Obama still leads her with independents, albeit by 3%.

What is means is that:

1. the Independents that favor Clinton would bolt en mass to McCain in the general if Obama is the Dem candidate

2. the Obama Independents would vote for Clinton over McCain is she were the candidate.

Clinton is the right choice if you want a Dem in the White House.


A very accurate analysis from a "republican troll posing as a hillary supporter" point of view.

"If we don't believe in freedom of expression for people we despise, we don't believe in it at all. "

Indeed, feel free to speak your b.s. I'm still gonna call you on it.

Rasmussen says it's dead even all around. Meanwhile, TPM's Poll Tracker lists Fux and only Fux results. Can there be a theme developing here?

ABC News: The Chicago Sun-Times' Lynn Sweet quotes an "Obama adviser" saying that Wright has become a "huge distraction. At a time when Obama is trying to appeal to blue-collar and working-class voters, Jeremiah Wright is dragging this campaign into a conversation about race . . . and that's not what white voters want to hear."

"Nobody even wants to talk about it. It's a disaster," one Obama campaign source tells the New York Daily News' Michael Saul, who described "a usually upbeat headquarters was fighting off its worst morale problem since the primaries began."

ABC's George Stephanopoulos, reporting on what's next for the Obama campaign on "Good Morning America" Wednesday: "They will be announcing more superdelegate endorsements today, to try to get back on track."

Why did Obama let it get to this point? "After Obama's uncategorical repudiation yesterday of the man who presided at his wedding and the baptism of his daughters, voters and other political observers will inevitably wonder what took so long -- and how Obama could have misjudged someone to whom he was very close," Peter Canellos writes in The Boston Globe.

"In political terms, this was a 3 a.m. phone call that went into voice mail," Chicago Sun-Times columnist Carol Marin writes.

"As definitive as Obama seemed, there are still questions about his relationship with Wright," National Review's Byron York writes. "Is it really plausible for Obama to say that he did not hear a steady stream of such stuff coming from Wright's pulpit in the last 20 years?"

Must be the same adviser who said Obama was going to take on Fox.

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Shorter Otto: WRIGHT WRIGHT WRIGHT WRIGHT WRIGHT!!!

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A Fox poll. Favors Clinton. 'Nuff said.

jeez, FOX now theeere's a "fair and balanced" poll. Blarg!

Please, note: sarcasm and loathing.

Flush......down the drain.

"Flush......down the drain."

..that nonsensical, clumsy poll? I agree.

Meanwhile, the ads using Wright and racial inuendos are backfiring as I've thought and said they would:

"Rev. Wright Swiftboating Turning Republicans Into Democrats"

http://www.dailykos.com/storyonly/2008/4/30/7435/81980/876/505608

Dr.Larry Sinclair agrees with Dr. Boyce Watkins and Dr.J.Wright that it is over.

Otto F, you can quote as many republicans as you want, it still wont make it so. Give up and go to sleep, some one will wake you on President Obama's inaguration.

I would think that any poll pitting one party’s nominee against two people, neither of whom yet has his/her party’s nomination, would necessarily favor the one who already is a nominee. In this instance, there are between 16 and 20 percent of those polled who don’t respond. That’s quite a bit of wiggle room. Who knows who they will end up favoring? Why not ask these independents if they intend to vote for McCain or for whichever Democrat gets the nomination? Seems like that is the only question that matters.

It would be better to see the Democratic Party to stay true with Obama and go down to defeat than to see it win with Clinton.

Oh yeah--that makes sense. Have some more kool-aid.

"The difference between Hillary and Obama's indy support is not statistically significant,"

Kinda defeats the idea that she is "doing better than Obama", among independents....

Riigght. Hillary will sweep up the indies despite still having the highest negatives--regardless of whether measured directly or through top of mind association--of any of the three.

http://www.gallup.com/poll/106909/TopofMind-Candidate-Perceptions-InDepth.aspx

Yeah, we should totally dump the one who has the best numbers for the one with the highest negatives. Our victory will be assured. Fox News and several prominent members of the pond scum wing of the Republican Party say so, so it must be true.

And I'm absolutely sure the moratorium on Clinton sheet sniffing will last all the way through to November, too. Especially given that you’ve all legitimized the "how could Obama stay in this church for 20 years" faux issue as a totally fair and relevant question. Do you really think that, having opened the door to the “old longstanding associations” issue, "how could Hillary stay married to a serial philanderer for 35 years, and what have the two of them been up to since 2000" won’t be considered fair game, and a matter of vital national importance, for the Axis of Imbecility (Politico-Fox-ABC)?

Oh, wait, I forgot. You’re still die-hard Hillary supporters, so you’re capable of believing six impossible things every day before breakfast.

Wednesday, April 30
Race Poll Results Spread
Democratic Presidential Nomination FOX News Obama 41, Clinton 44 Clinton +3.0
Democratic Presidential Nomination Gallup Obama 46, Clinton 47 Clinton +1.0
Democratic Presidential Nomination Rasmussen Obama 47, Clinton 43 Obama +4.0

General Election: McCain vs. Clinton FOX News McCain 44, Clinton 45, Und. 11 Clinton +1.0
General Election: McCain vs. Obama FOX News McCain 46, Obama 43, Und. 11 McCain +3.0
Hillary's ON A ROLLLLL

And she's moved to w/in Obama by only 5 points in NC.

Latest polls:

Kentucky Democratic Primary SurveyUSA Clinton 63, Obama 27 Clinton +36.0
New Jersey: McCain vs. Clinton Monmouth/Gannett McCain 38, Clinton 52, Und. 6 Clinton +14.0
New Jersey: McCain vs. Obama Monmouth/Gannett McCain 32, Obama 56, Und. 7 Obama +24.0
Arizona: McCain vs. Clinton Arizona State McCain 53, Clinton 37, Und. 10 McCain +16.0
Arizona: McCain vs. Obama Arizona State McCain 47, Obama 38, Und. 15 McCain +9.0

Too little too late. Wake up. After the "stunning" victory in Pennsylvania... Clinton has garnered 5 superdelegates. Obama? He's gotten 9. At that rate, Clinton will win the 2008 Democratic nomination for President in September 2010. Of course, President Barack Obama will already be in the White House. Hahahahaha

WOO HOO!

GO OBAMA '08!

Yes We Can!

Shit. Who let the sheep out of her pen?

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wake up, or at least pull your head out of what ever part of Hillary's anatomy it is stuck in.


from ben smith at 5:31 eastern
Obama gains in network polls


Contra the previous item, two other polls are showing the Wright flap doesn't seem to be doing major damage head-to-head national polling.

Quite the opposite:

Two network polls due out in the next hour or so, I'm told, actually have him moving up against Clinton.

He's moved ahead out of a tie in the last NBC poll, and gained in the CBS/NYT poll. Details on the evening news.

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Dr. Boyce Watkins is black and well-known in the African-American community. You deriding her for teaching Finance, that's just her title. She deals on issues of income inequality. I am not quite sure why you doubt that Obama is straddling a fence on Wright but it does not matter really, the damage is done and polls are beginning to reflect that. Clinton has 9 point lead in Indiana sure to grow now and in North Carolina she is withing striking distance with anti-Obama ads running day and night courtesy of the GOP.

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Fox Poll. That's all I need to know. They have an agenda, and it is the installation of Hillary as the Democratic nominee, so that they have a new punching bag for the fall.

Like the poster abve mentioned,It's a Fox poll, spells mis-information plain & simple for whatever reason the folks a Fox have problems when telling americans the truth.

Fox and the GOP want HIllary to be the nominee. Do you really think it's beneath them to skew a poll in her favor? (think how they called the 2000 election for *) I bothers me that any reputable site would include their information. Why not just post credible sources?

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