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In Letter, Top Clinton Donors Chastise Pelosi For Statements About Super-Delegates

Twenty top Hillary fundraisers and donors have sent a scathing private letter to House Speaker Nancy Pelosi, chastising her for publicly saying that the super-delegates should support the winner of the pledged delegate count and demanding that she say that they should make an "independent" choice.

I've obtained a copy of the letter, which comes from some of the most influential fundraisers in the Democratic Party, including Hassan Nemazee, Steven Rattner, Maureen White, Stan Shuman, and Alan Patricof.

Here's a key excerpt:

Several states and millions of Democratic voters have not yet had a chance to cast their votes.

We respect those voters and believe that they, like the voters in the states that have already participated, have a right to be heard. None of us should make declarative statements that diminish the importance of their voices and their votes. We are writing to say we believe your remarks on ABC News This Week on March 16th did just that.

During your appearance, you suggested super-delegates have an obligation to support the candidate who leads in the pledged delegate count as of June 3rd , whether that lead be by 500 delegates or 2. This is an untenable position that runs counter to the party’s intent in establishing super-delegates in 1984 as well as your own comments recorded in The Hill ten days earlier...

The letter also contains an explicit reference to the fact that these donors have contributed heavily to Democratic causes, and demands that Pelosi clarify that the role of the super-dels is to make an "independent" choice between the candidates:

We have been strong supporters of the DCCC. We therefore urge you to clarify your position on super-delegates and reflect in your comments a more open view to the optional independent actions of each of the delegates at the National Convention in August. We appreciate your activities in support of the Democratic Party and your leadership role in the Party and hope you will be responsive to some of your major enthusiastic supporters.

The letter represents a significant ratcheting up of pressure from Hillary's big money people on a Democratic leader in a position to influence how the super-delegates make up their minds at the end of the primary.

Full letter after the jump.

The Honorable Nancy Pelosi

Speaker of the US House of Representatives

Office of the Speaker

H-232, US Capitol

Washington, DC 20515

Dear Madame Speaker,

As Democrats, we have been heartened by the overwhelming response that our fellow Democrats have shown for our party’s candidates during this primary season. Each caucus and each primary has seen a record turnout of voters. But this dynamic primary season is not at an end. Several states and millions of Democratic voters have not yet had a chance to cast their votes.

We respect those voters and believe that they, like the voters in the states that have already participated, have a right to be heard. None of us should make declarative statements that diminish the importance of their voices and their votes. We are writing to say we believe your remarks on ABC News This Week on March 16th did just that.

During your appearance, you suggested super-delegates have an obligation to support the candidate who leads in the pledged delegate count as of June 3rd , whether that lead be by 500 delegates or 2. This is an untenable position that runs counter to the party’s intent in establishing super-delegates in 1984 as well as your own comments recorded in The Hill ten days earlier:

"I believe super-delegates have to use their own judgment and there will be many equities that they have to weigh when they make the decision. Their own belief and who they think will be the best president, who they think can win, how their own region voted, and their own responsibility.’”

Super-delegates, like all delegates, have an obligation to make an informed, individual decision about whom to support and who would be the party’s strongest nominee. Both campaigns agree that at the end of the primary contests neither will have enough pledged delegates to secure the nomination. In that situation, super-delegates must look to not one criterion but to the full panoply of factors that will help them assess who will be the party’s strongest nominee in the general election.

We have been strong supporters of the DCCC. We therefore urge you to clarify your position on super-delegates and reflect in your comments a more open view to the optional independent actions of each of the delegates at the National Convention in August. We appreciate your activities in support of the Democratic Party and your leadership role in the Party and hope you will be responsive to some of your major enthusiastic supporters.

Sincerely,

Marc Aronchick

Clarence Avant

Susie Tompkins Buell

Sim Farar

Robert L. Johnson

Chris Korge

Marc and Cathy Lasry

Hassan Nemazee

Alan and Susan Patricof

JB Pritzker

Amy Rao

Lynn de Rothschild

Haim Saban

Bernard Schwartz

Stanley S. Shuman

Jay Snyder

Maureen White and Steven Rattner


357 Comments

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Shorter Top Clinton Voters:

We need to let the democratic process play out so that the superdelegates can overrule it.

Short version : Blackmail by these blackguards.

Believe or not, when someone called from the DCCC to ask for my donation, I said basically the same thing. I'm closing my wallet to DCCC as long as Pelosi is showing such blatant bias against Hillary's campaign. It is unnecessary for her to say such stupid things, including her comments about no dream ticket. This women should keep her mouth shut and let the people decide.

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You mean only people in states that Clinton wins should decide.

You mean she should shut up and let Clinton get the nomination? that's what you mean, right? right?

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And by "People" you mean "Super delegates", right?

And by "super Delegates" you mean only the ones that support Clinton, right? Not the ones whose "independent" judgment would lead to support Obama, right?

Aimey May,

I wrote to the DNC three months ago and told them that I would never vote for Hillary under any circumstance. Now you think about the nearly 2 million people contributing to Barack Obama's campaign and the 20 some maxed out supporters of Hillary on that list? (Clarence Avant, shame on you!) Who do you think the party is going to listen to?

I find the people on the list not unlike Bush's campaign supporters. Accepting of any behavior as long as it leads to a win. This is a new day...and those guys are outta step with the times.

Speaker Pelosi said HILLARY ruled out the chance of a dream ticket when she said McCain was more qualified than Obama to be president. Check the whole context of a story before your rip faces off.

Hillary is opening herself up to the kind of support she is receiving from the party's leadership. The Speaker has the best interest of the party at stake because the Democrats, as a whole, must win the WH in November. Hillary will hand over the WH to the Republicans before she'll let another Democrat have it over her because this is her life: Hillary believes that she and President Clinton own it and Barack is just a johnny-come-lately who is way out of line. I'm for a Democratic president and I support Speaker Pelosi--Hillary's behavior, conduct and remarks are out of line and she needs to get out.

The Democratic party no longer needs be indebted to the DLC fatcats. We are becoming once again the party of the people. The way true progressives have supported Obama they will support Pelosi. Hillary talks a good game but she is not now nor has she ever been a progressive. She served on board of directors of Wal-Mart for six years, while her husband was governor of state where Wal_mart is headquartered. She sat in on mettings where union busting tactics were discussed. She and her husband continue to profit from Wal-Mart connections. Her husband's foundation received a $500,000 donation from them just this year. By the way, Mark Penn, her chief strategist, represents Countrywide along with his union busting activities. And as we know through james carville, we know how the Clinton's are about loyalty.

...meant to say "shorter top Clinton *donors*"

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Hillary's large donors, for a number of reasons, can go screw themselves. I want to see a list of who these assholes are, so I can boycott them and do everything possible to punish them for attempting to buy our democracy.

We're moving towards greater public financing and grass roots activism, and against special interests, every day. The harder they lean on the scales, the more public push-back they'll generate.

People will turn out for David against Goliath every time.

Building on StlMoDem's point - could someone please ask the HRC campaign this:
The campaign says that if superdels make a decide a winner now, this would subvert the election process because their votes should be counted and therefore their pledged delegates chosen. BUT, if, regardless of the lead in popular vote or pledged dels come June, it would be fine thine for superdels to choose the winner. What's the difference? What is the logic behind ignoring votes later being somehow better than ignoring votes now? If superdels do not have to support whomever leads in pledged dels, then why does the campaign argue that it is wrong for them to make that independent choice now?

Nancy should not worry about the clout of donors who have already maxed out on their legally allowed donations.

Shorter version:

Dear Madame Speaker,

Believe and say what we tell you to believe and say or else.

Sincerly,

Money

That's so damn funny ;-)

Poor Nancy, between a rock and a hard place....


I wonder if she realizes what's at stake here. Clinton has all the swing vote one could hope for in an election, she has the hispanics, moderate women, blue collar workers. And my impression is that these voters want to vote FOR Clinton. Not for Obama. And in the last two elections, I don't think they had a Democratic candidate they liked

Or maybe she just doesn't care.

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I am assuming you are still talking about the primary - because their final vote is not determined for the GE yet...

This conflation will not stand!

Yet Obama continues to out-fundraise her by a substantial amount.

Oh, and he's getting more votes.

And delegates.

And more states.

So really, Nancy is caught between Barack and a lost cause.

how punny - but I do agree... who the hell are they to overtly attempt buyibg the party.
Just like the morons from Florida that pulled the same threat on Howard Dean

Whatever you think of Obama or Clinton as candidates, how do you feel about big donors trying to run the party? That really seems to be what's at stake.

Now obviously Clinton needs the big donors more than Obama does, but all things being equal, wouldn't you like to see a Democratic Party that is more responsive to individual voters as opposed to rich people? You know one person, one vote?

Yeah...and we are forgetting the 50% disapproval rating she has? And are we pretending that the republican's won't bring her scandals back? Or bust her for padding her resume? Or flip-flopping on iraq? Or her husband getting his dome polished? Or bring up Hillary-care again? Or talk about Billy in the WH?

Why do you think registered republicans are voting for HER in the democratic primary? Is it maybe because they feel they would rather run against her in the fall?

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Lalo,
You have made some pretty wild statements on here in the past, but your suggestions that Clinton has all of the swing votes needed for the general and Obama doesn't is completely unfounded. I don't think that either have shown that they have a lock on all of the voter types which is why we are where we are with a vote that is so close.

I'm not saying that Obama has the GE locked up but there is certainly nothing that would suggest that Clinton has any real advantage in this area.

What swing vote? Do you people seriously have ANY concept of general election electability whatsoever? Seriously...are you for real? It isn't about what happens in the primary, the election is against MCCAIN, and it will be a battle over INDEPENDENTS, a group that Hillary pushes away, and a group that flocks to Obama.

Seriously, do you really not understand this, or are you borrowing a tactic from Hillary and simply trying to deceive people who may not know any better?

wherever Bill Richardson goes, the Hispanics will follow.

Are you saying Hispanics rather elect a Hillary Clinton as president than by-pass chance to have the first Hispanic vice president?

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I always thought Richardson would make an excellent VP. Good counsel, good experience, pretty reliable, brings in voters. I'd be happy with that choice, though it's too early to speculate.

But yeah, your point remains that if Obama needs to Hispanic vote, Richardson is a phone call away.

Regardless, the notion that Hispanics will go for McCain over Obama is utterly delusional. comical even. Wishful thinking from Hillary supporters.

McCain very badly needs to turn out the white, rural, Evangelical, and rabidly anti-immigrant base. To do so, he must pander to people like Hagee during the campaign. Hagee (and countless others like him in the Republican base) hates immigrants and Catholics. And they're accustomed to public support from Republicans and will accept no less. And Republican enthuiasm is already down so McCain needs some red meat speeches.

Big problem.

Hahahaha, okay, so this is what the letter says:

"Millions of voters have yet to have their voices heard, so don't dare say that we will have to abide by their voices once they vote, because we'll cut off funding if you do"

Yes, they are using voters as an excuse to disenfranchise voters. Which is much in keeping with their overall strategy of hijacking the vote, while pretending to care about the voters. If you'd like to read my more extensive comments on their hypocrisy, you can here:

http://www.thepersonalispolitical.com/2008/03/hillarys-only-path-to-nomination.html

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Exactly. These donors own "logic" is bullshit.

'Millions of voters have not been heard, so stop saying the superdelegates should respect the will of what all those voters have to say.'

It is nonsense paper wrapping around a blackmail attempt to get Clinton the nomination.

The extended comments on Lux Veritas' blog are an outstanding analysis. How can the press let her say she is so concerned about voters AND let her say that delegates can rightfully ignore voters? I'm concerned not just that it's doublespeak, but that she's not being called on it.

Thank you for your kind words. And seriously, isn't it insane that she is able to say one thing and then say another in the same breath and NEVER be called on it?? It is astonishing what she gets away with. Her hypocrisy is the most consistent theme in this entire election.

Well, here is a chance to see if the Dem and the GOP parties are really different after all.

A few, large donors are pressuring the present ranking Dem in the country. A few.

This is clearly the type of party that Hillary Clinton enjoys. Powerful backers in her pocket.

What does this mean to the average American? It means that Hillary Clinton's Dem Party really doesn't include you. You don't contribute enough to matter. Your collective voice doesn't matter for influencing policy (except as means to gobble votes).

This tactic is no different that the usual cabal of major donors talking to the GOP. None at all.

The only question I have is whether Hillary represents the Dem Party of the past or the future.

How Pelosi handles this is a large clue.

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Anybody want to take bets on whether this letter would have been written if the situation were reversed and Hillary led in the Delegate count (instead of nothing)?

Place your bets here!

six hundred rupees.

There's a word for this. It's called extortion.

And isn't this what one would expect of the big-dollar donor Clinton machine. When you can't win an election with popular votes, or pledged delegates, just defy democratic principles and threaten to walk with your money.

This is why a change candidate is so necessary--to get us out of this paradigm in which those with the gold make the rules.

What about Sharpton threatening to protest ( riot) the convention, if Obam does'nt get the nomination? The word for that is terrorism. Pleeeez. HRC's "Typical" donors have every right to call out Pelosi who has been irresponsible in her comments. I for one am tired of the GOP running this show with the MSM bias coverage. Obama is obstructionist with respect to re-votes and his argument contradictory. Love the good Rev. Wright covertly campaigning on vacation recently. But, guess that's just a typical
opinion from a typical lunch bucket dem. who is not impressed with The golden one.

It must suck to be a big donor to a political party, expecting to curry a bunch of favors and whatnot, only to have this newfangled invention called "the interwebs" come along and make you completely insignificant.

Hey Pelosi - one million individual donors. $100 each. And we're just getting started.

Balls back in your court, Bob Johnson. Can I get a wha-wha?

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lol. exxxxcellent.

Dear big donors, F*** you. You don't own the party anymore- we're taking it back. Go away, far away, and take your stinking money with you.
Sincerely, the millions of small donors to the Obama campaign.

Well said.

I'm getting a little tired of HRC's argument that she's staying in for the selfless reason of honoring the desire of people in the remaining states to vote. Since when has there been a vested right to vote in a national primary? Yes, if a vote is held, you have a right to vote, but what is the source of this notion that everyone, everywhere must have an opportunity to vote on the nominee? If that's going to be the new standard, I guess primary season is going to last a full year from here on out. Good news for the media, bad news for all the rest of us.

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Pelosi opposed impeachment: she likes Obama's inclusiveness of Republicans just fine. I wonder if she was relying on his advice?

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While I would love to impeach Bush, your argument is pointless.

Impeachment would be impossible and a waste of time. Look at the investigations thus far: Nothing is wrong here folks, please move along.

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AJM is a longtime troll. Just saying, fyi.

Perhaps if we had let the Repugs impeach Bill, she could have taken notes?

If you won't let our friend Hillary win, we'll stomp our feet, take our money, and leave... Waaaaaaaa. -Clinton Donors
Could we kill two birds with one stone this year? Could we get rid of both the Clintons and the scum that follows them around with money to gain influence and power? I sure hope so. If only they had left address, we could tell them where they could stick their money.

Nice avatar :)

Just another sad indication that Hillary's campaign is owned by a relatively few wealthy donors and special interests, while Obama's campaign is owned by millions of the grassroots populace.

So this is blatant extortion from Clinton donors to the Democratic Party.

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This is the same thing that happened with the Florida Big Monies - some of them even asked for their money back.

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Extortion? Really? To insist that the Speaker of The House abide by the Superdelegate rules and let them decide based on the rules.

The rules do not say that the SD'S should vote the way their constituents voted. If this were the case, Richardson needs to resent his endorsement. This is what Pelosi is stating and for her to rewrite or misstate the rules is irresponsible.

What is more disturbing is the Uncle Tom smears being received from Obama supporters to Black,Clinton SD's.

“African-American superdelegates are being targeted, harassed and threatened,” said Rep. Emanuel Cleaver II (D-Mo.), a superdelegate who has supported Clinton since August. Cleaver said black superdelegates are receiving “nasty letters, phone calls, threats they’ll get an opponent, being called an Uncle Tom."

http://www.politico.com/news/stories/0208/8762.html

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If this were the case, Richardson needs to resent his endorsement.

Resent=resend

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I guess the fact that Hillary is backed big some big money players, they can throw around their big money weight.

Seems like this is the name of the game.

I like how they re-emphasize how the regular delegates should exercise independence just like the supers...

Super-delegates, like all delegates, have an obligation to make an informed, individual decision about whom to support and who would be the party’s strongest nominee.

Why even have a primary season for Christ's sake? It seems we should just let the big money donors and the Supers make the decision for us.

And all of this comes from the same campaign that writes off the caucuses and states that don't matter because they vote Republican.

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re: "And all of this comes from the same campaign..."

Just think how a Hillary administration would carry itself. Bush II wasn't even this arrogant in his campaign, and once in power he had a "mandate" to serve his corporate masters.

A Hillary Presidency would just about be the death knell for liberalism in America. Hand over the keys to the corporations and bow down.

Those signers are a bunch of Jeff Gilloolys. Would they rather see Hill destroy Obama and throw this election than see Obama win?

Big donors having a tantrum, holding breath, stamping feet, and bellowing through tears:

"Where. Is. the. Candidate. We. Bought?"

Life's hard sometimes.

Looks like some fat cats see their power slipping away. They looked into a future where a candidate can go directly to the people for funding thus bypassing their monopoly of influence.

They were scared.

They through a tantrum.

The End.

Sinbad wants everyone to know where his money goes. Check it out, Pelosi. Do you really want to turn off the Sinbad spigot?

Sinbad/Clinton '08 - Some people who have a lot of money are mad that they threw all of their money away on an ineffectual, unpleasant candidate

I guess they missed the part where Obama's raised $100 million or so in tiny, average-person donations.

Big donors have gone the way of the Betamax, the HD-DVD, and the landline. Screw 'em.

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Oh, I see. The letter writers are in effect telling those states yet to hold primaries/caucuses that in the end their delegate counts will be meaningless. The choice of a nominee lies exclusively with the super-delegates.

So why are they saying that Pelosi's remark ignores, in a sense dis-enfranchises, those who have yet to vote when it's the letter-writers who've effectively done just that?

It's like a 400-foot neon sign with HRC's picture on it and the words "BOUGHT AND PAID FOR" flashing beneath it.

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RECOMEND

Sounds like a letter from the The Big Fat Cats who made stupid Investments on Bear Sterns.

They gave all that money to Hillary and they are now realizing that it was a worthless investment.

Hey there Rich Fat Clowns; Nancy Pelosi is not the Fed Chairman, and she is not going to bail you out because you were reckless enough to squander $150 million on a junk bond candidate.

It's not just the candidates that are looking more and more poor as this primary season drags on, but the whole democratic party.

Pelosi -1 for taking impeachment off the table
Pelosi +1 on immunity for telecoms

she's even, let's see what she does.

Just another flank of the Clinton campaign's "last throes" assault. I was truly struck by how much Hillary is beginning to resemble George Bush. The same stubborn refusal to accept reality. The preference for magical thinking and "truthiness". The same indifference to popular will.

Will Clinton treat her party as Bush has treated the soldiers? As a throwaway that's expendable in her quest for "larger goals"?

I would fully support Clinton if she stayed in the race, so long as she was using that time to fight for issues she believes in. But staying in under some stupid assumption that Obama can be brought down with slime and delegate poaching is not only self-destructive, but will help another incompetent Republican run roughshod over our country's common interests.

Ok so someone start digging up all the information on these donors, and their specific interest in influencing this campaign and supporting Clinton.

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I stated the beginnings of one below. Needs more though.

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It's hard to be humble when you're entitled.

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Another $100 for Barack's campaign...in honor of Nancy Pelosi.

It might be a good idea for us to send a donation to the DNC with a nice note telling them that we're buying our party back.

The 20 big-name donors (and the Clintons) can all go kcuf themselves blue.

"Of the People, for the people"

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DCCC would be better, as that is the Committee for getting House Reps elected.

My reaction too. This inspired me to donate yet again to Barack Obama. Anyone else?

I'm in for another $50.

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Do both.

Blackmail. Charming.

The character of Team Clinton shines through yet again.

Hmmmm...yes.

And the envelope was sealed with wax and a brass knuckle imprint.

Yeesh. These tactics are almost comical.

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All Nancy Pelosi had to do was keep her big mouth shut on this issue, instead of repeating, exactly, the Obama line.

Obviously, playing the role of an honest broker was just too damned hard for her, even though she is by her role as leader of the House Democrats expected to show real impartiality on such matters.

I should think that a donor might notice Pelosi's utter disrespect for their side in the issue.

...and said donors can go f*ck themselves.

Take your ball and go home.

You can't play by the agreed upon rules.
You can't play nice with your own team.
You can't stop hurting the team, the league and the sport.

SO F*CKING LEAVE ALREADY YA BUNCH OF LIEBERMANS.

The 28% of you that would vote for McCain if you don't get your way are worthless to us Democrats anyway. Do it now. Stop wasting our time and leave the f*cking party. I assure you that you will NOT be missed.

This party is bigger and more important than Hillay F*cking Clinton and her 20 Big-Money Masters and it always will be.

Very intelligent comments, anchored by that oh-so-clever Lieberman canard.

Do me a favor. Wipe the spittle from your lips, and understand this: Obama's not getting elected without that 28%.

Good luck with your little side project though. I assume you'll be starting a very effective 3rd Party?

Worked for Ross Perot! Oh, wait...

I should think that a donor might notice Pelosi's utter disrespect for their side in the issue.

Surely that cuts both ways, no? If someone on your side of the divide can look at her statement and perceive a pro-Obama bias, then surely someone on my side of the divide can look at her statements and see the same. Maybe you are less inclined to donate to the DNC on that account, but I am more inclined now, and there are more of the people like me than there are of the people like you (as evidenced by Obama's popular vote lead). In other words, even considered from so mercenary a standpoint as the strictly financial, it is not obvious to me that Pelosi has committed a meaningful blunder here.

which donors...? the 20 who signed the letter or the nearly 2 million on Obama's website?

FranklyO, Pelosi is playing the role of an honest broker, by standing in opposition to a superdelegate coup that would destroy her party. Apparently Hillary's big $ crew would prefer a broker on their payroll to serve their narrow interests. How "honest" is that?

Dear Marc Aronchick, Clarence Avant, Susie Tompkins Buell, Sim Farar, Robert L. Johnson,
Chris Korge, Marc and Cathy Lasry, Hassan Nemazee, Alan and Susan Patricof, JB Pritzker,
Amy Rao, Lynn de Rothschild, Haim Saban, Bernard Schwartz,Stanley S. Shuman, Jay Snyder, Maureen White and Steven Rattner:

F*ck you. F*ck you very much.


And finally it just comes down to blackmail. My hatred for Hillary Clinton just leaves me sputtering....

If she wins this nomination.... I'm just totally speechless with rage.

Yet another reason NOT to vote for Hillary, for the good of the Party.

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"We have been strong supporters of the DCCC."

We won't give you $$$ anymore unless you support our candidate.

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This letter doesn't seem to be all that private to me since I am reading it on the TPM website.

I have an idea for Pelosi. Ask Obama to appeal to his small donors to contribute to the DCCC to offset the influence of Clinton's big money donors. I'm in.

Fuck Steve Rattner.


Speaking of which, I wonder if Greg's source among the 20 Dildoners who released the letter realizes that it is being used to foment even further Clinton hate?

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This is why, if by some chance Hillary emerges as the nominee, I will leave the party for good. Oh, I'll vote for Hillary I suppose, but as I'm pulling the lever I'll be hoping for the Democratic Party to go the way of the Whigs and be replaced by something much better.

As it stands now, it wouldn't take much.

If Clinton wins, I'm going to wait and see what McCain's willing to put on the table. If it's a good offer --- like disentangling the Republican party from the southern strategy --- switching will be no sweat off my brow. If not, I stay home.

The Dem party insiders are so insufferable this year. Telling us in January the superdelegates would decide it, trying to buy second primaries in Florida and Michigan, which is so fundamentally antidemocratic as to nauseate, now telling the Speaker of the House how to speak.

F*** them all. Seriously. Their day has passed. The advent of internet fundraising has killed the influence of the megabundlers. Clinton and Bush were the last gasp of that politics.

The party is being taken back by the people -- that's the lesson of Dean's early success, obviously the lesson of Obama's masterful campaign, and even of Hillary's late surge in fundraising before Ohio.

Their whole "you can't have a Democratic Party without us" shit is contemptible. They also can't have one without us, the Democratic voters.

Knowing Pelosi, I think this attempt at putting a chokechain on her will redouble her efforts. Sorry, hostage-taking HRC fatcats, your puerile powertripping days are at an end.

I feel the uncontrollable urge to donate to Obama right now. Yes, I think that will do just fine.

1. private letter?

2. where have we hear this before?

Super-delegates, like all delegates, have an obligation to make an informed, individual decision about whom to support and who would be the party’s strongest nominee.

3. Nancy, in the nicest possible way, please tell them to kiss your ass.

4. Disregard #3.

Tell them in no uncertain terms in the harshest way possible to kiss your ass.


There, fixed.

Pretty ridiculous. First they claim that superdelegates represent the interest of the people just as much as pledged delegates. Then they say anything that even hints at diminishing the "voice of the voters" is unacceptable when they themselves have continually done this by saying caucuses don't count and that only big states count. Make up your mind and quit trying to spin everything that doesn't go your way.

The Hillary donors are correct when they say that superdelegates are supposed, according to the rules, to use their judgment. According to the rules they are not expected to necessarily reflect the results of the primaries. If they were bound to vote for the candidate with the most pledged candidates, there would be no reason for their existence. The party didn't create superdelegates to be rubber stamps. It was Pelosi, not Hillary, who said that the superdelegates should behave contrary to the rules of the DNC. Pelosi suggested that superdelegates should support the candidate with the most pledged delegates. At one point she said they should do so, even if that candidate did not win the popular vote. Hillary correctly maintains that superdelegates should follow the rules which say that they are free to use their best judgment for the good of the Party in the general election.

"Hillary correctly maintains that superdelegates should follow the rules which say that they are free to use their best judgment for the good of the Party in the general election."

Good. Then they'll still vote for Obama.

"Super-delegates, like all delegates, have an obligation to make an informed, individual decision about whom to support and who would be the party’s strongest nominee."

I believe this is the line that - besides even thinking of sending such an inappropriate letter - irks most people. Flying the suggestion that Nanacy needs to remind people that pledged delegates are not necessarily pledged. You know - Hillary's latest BS line. Of course each campaign gets to choose its own delegates - so you know - chances of swaying one should be about nil.

... somehow it wouldn't surprise me if Hilary tried to sue for their judgment on some BS claim of Obama unsuitability.

Shorter Clinton: I wanna be Madame President, and if you don't nominate me I'll take all the toys home with me.

I wasn't crazy about either Clinton or Obama (both are a bit too conservative for my taste), but I'm less impressed with Clinton every time she or her supporters pulls this kind of sh*t. I'll probably need a breath mask to vote for her if she should be nominated.

So THAT's who Hillary's working the night shift for...

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Right, That's what Hillary's been holding out for. Hoping her machine will somehow fix the nomination.

Good for Pelosi! She's my Senator and made some pretty good moves lately.

Who did those clowns think they were screwing with? And what were they thinking? Look at Obama's donations and get some perspective, jackasses.

Here they go- the attempt to steal the election in on. The only difference is that Hillary is trying to stay above the fray by using her "donors."

Its stealing the election either way.

Why didn't they just fund MI. & Fl. and take a rest?

Right, it was Howard Dean, and that non DLC DNC.

Obama's $55M, you know, we will get back to you!

So dose this mean they will fund McCain or go after down ballot Dems. who don't support them.

O.K.! Obama may raise $250M for the general, and Geffen and folks are in the wings; I betting on Pelosi to tell them to go elsewheres, like to hell.

Hmm. Can we find their addresses and write them back?

What a complete and total disgrace. I hope it backfires. Really, this is totally disgusting.

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"Twenty top Hillary fundraisers and donors have sent a scathing private letter to House Speaker Nancy Pelosi."

Its a private letter, huh? Thats why they sent it to you as well as probably everybody else on their mailing list too?

I'm guessing Pelosi's office released it.

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"We therefore urge you to clarify your position on super-delegates and reflect in your comments a more open view to the optional independent actions of each of the delegates at the National Convention in August."

So not only should you tell the Super-Delegate to ignore the number of states won by Obama, his lead in the pledged delegate count and his lead in the popular vote, you should also make it clear to every pledged delegate that they are free to change their vote and should consider doing so.

By the way, Greg.

Awesome get. Thanks for posting.

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We have been strong supporters of the DCCC. We therefore urge you to clarify your position on super-delegates and reflect in your comments a more open view to the optional independent actions of each of the delegates at the National Convention in August.

In other words, be more open to Hillary stealing the election or else we'll take our money and go home.

Course, if Hillary does that, than Obama's donors, which include a million new donors (like me and my partner), will take their money and go home.

Does Pelosi want the Dems to be the party of the millions or the party of the dozens? Doesn't seem like much of a quandary to me.


Hillary,

Thank you for tearing the Democratic Party apart.
It is, after all, not about America, but about you.

Hey, if by some chance you do get to be President, I bet you're going to love all those
"signing statements"--just think what you can do with those!

Just keep on Burning Down the House--and let us all live with the tragic results.

No, not more money to the Obama campaign. It's time to send money to the DNC. What if folks start making $25 contributions and say: There's more where this comes from, especially if you get rid of these fat cats who are trying to hold our party hostage?

Wow. Not one intelligent response to a letter that is factually accurate about the role of superdelegates, and about Pelosi's own self-contradiction (she is my representative, BTW, and I like her, but I, too, didn't like this attempt of hers to bind the superdelegates). The superdelegates were created NOT to be bound by the same rules that bind the pledged delegates--yet NO ONE here is suggesting that maybe the problem is with the system, not with Sen. Clinton.

It really is too bad that it sometimes seems that all Sen. Obama's supporters have is vitriol.

This thread is filled with the only intelligent response: rage.

It really is too bad that it sometimes seems that all Sen. Obama's supporters have is vitriol.

Well, not quite: they do have the winning candidate.

I don't really disagree that the Democratic primary system has problems - I hope we can get it changed for the next election cycle. The problem is that you don't change it in the middle of a primary. This is the system that all candidates accepted and endorsed at the beginning of the primary. These are the rules by which all parties agreed to play. Senator Clinton has repeatedly argued for changing those rules in the middle of the primary. Superdelegates were NOT created to overturn the will of voters. That's a fallacy. Yes, they can vote as they choose, but no one should realistically believe that they are going to give the election to the candidate who trails by some 150 pledged delegates at the end of the race.

No vitriol intended.

Yes, how sadly true. Why I totally remember when these guys wrote Hillary to express their dismay about disenfranchising the late states back when she was telling the Sunday morning show guys it would all be over on Super Tuesday.

And can we please stop pretending that we have super delegates for any reason other than that the swells who write the rules decided didn't whan to have to go to all that tedious trouble of declaring for a candidate and getting selected as a delegate in order to come to the big party?

But, doesn't Pelosi have a right to her opinion, just as much as Hillary has to hers?


I don't think it's the topic of the letter that's controversial, we all know the superdelegates can pick Micky Mouse if they wanted to.

But the TONE of the letter is threatening. You don't threaten people who you need to support you... that's just dumb. And deserving of ridicule.

I'm beginning to think that Hillary supporters are incapable of analysis. I hear the "factually correct" phrase very consistently. Just because something is factually correct doesn't make it right.

I guess (Hillary endorser) Maria Cantwell and the gov. of Tennessee can expect their angry letters soon, too. How dare they suggest the superdelegates follow the will of the voters!

That's a resounding YES!

I wonder who leaked the letter -- Pelosi or the bundlers

If you are not a constituent and want to contact Nancy Pelosi, here's the link. I sent her a letter just now expressing my outrage at this letter and letting her know I'd be making one of my small donations to Obama in response.

http://www.speaker.gov/contact/

Be sure to THANK Pelosi in your letter for speaking her mind, and not bowing to any outside pressure.

Either Hillary wants the Supers to make their own choice, or she doesn't. She needs to recognize some Supers will choose to vote based on the pledged delegates. That is their right, as it is Nancy Pelosi's right to advocate one way or the other.

Hillary can't have it both ways: Either the supers are free to speak and vote as they please, or they are not.

Speaker Pelosi,

I just saw that you're being pressured by big-money Clinton donators.

I'm a small-money Obama donator who'd like you to stay strong and keep seeing the reality the Democratic Party faces, in spite of the noise and mud that's in the air now.

It's all just made me make a second $25 donation to the Obama campaign.

Thanks for what you do,
(my real name)

The sad part about this is that they think things like this aren't going to get out in the media and backfire.

I got news for you folks: inside politics doesn't remain inside for long these days. If you don't want to look like douchebags to your constituents, don't pull crap like this.

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This aggression will not stand, man.

It's such a frustrating thing when something called "democracy" gets in the way of your control.

Poor little babies are have their power threatened. They will stomp and pout and hold their breath until they turn blue. The plutocracy is threatened!!!

Yup, count me in on another contribution to Obama's campaign.

I say we take a broom and sweep out the trash.

Are these people responsible for the "impeachment is off the table" catastrophe? Did they threaten Pelosi then too?

How long before we find out that Hillary's campaign actually drafted this letter? Does anyone really believe the "direct question" Hillary was asked in her editorial board interview wasn't a set up? Much like her planting people in her townhall meetings? I swear it gets worse everyday.

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Extortion is the word to sum up this letter. The money bag holders seem to think they should run this party and the party's leadership must answer to them.

This is just another slimeball pulled out of Clinton's kitchen sink strategy. Maybe she picked it up from her new pal Richard Mellon Scaife.

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once again, do you really want to go down the extortion road?

African-American superdelegates said Thursday that they’ll stand up against threats, intimidation and “Uncle Tom” smears rather than switch their support from Sen. Hillary Rodham Clinton to Sen. Barack Obama.
Emanuel Cleaver II (D-Mo.), a superdelegate who has supported Clinton since August. Cleaver said black superdelegates are receiving “nasty letters, phone calls, threats they’ll get an opponent, being called an Uncle Tom.

“This is the politics of the 1950s,” he complained. “A lot of members are experiencing a lot of ugly stuff. They’re not going to talk about it, but it’s happening.”


http://www.politico.com/news/stories/0208/8762.html

I guess CHANGE really is scary -- on many levels.


I'm sure most have seen this, if not, enjoy...a few seconds of an ad precede the clip.
Hillary's Inner Tracy Flick
http://slatev.com/player.html?id=1377935786

Technically, the rules do let superdelegates vote their conscience. But the Democrats not only need to avoid any foul play, but also any perception of foul play. And if Hillary gets this election through the superdelegates, there are going to be a lot of Democrats who will view this as totally unfair - and this will divide the party. I don't think Obama supporters who say they wouldn't vote for Hillary are necessarily objected to her as much as they are to what she would need to do to be the candidate.

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My letter to Nancy Pelosi (with my permission to copy, xerox, adapt as any of you may see fit to do).

Dear Ms. Pelosi,

I read in the news today that you received a letter from several donors to the Hillary Clinton campaign urging you to “clarify your position on super-delegate,” preferably in a way that suggests that super-delegates should not give any weight to the pledged delegate and popular vote lead.

I too have been a strong supporter of the DCCC. I have shown that support not through huge donations of money, but with time canvassing, phone banking and yes giving money when I could afford to do so. I am one of the millions of people who made a small donation to the Obama campaign and have made small donations to Democrats in the past. I can’t afford seats at big dollar fundraisers and I can’t afford a big fancy lobbyist, but you and the other party leaders cannot afford to ignore the collective voice of Democrats.

What these donors are suggesting is both distasteful in its whiff of influence peddling and potentially disastrous in terms of party unity and energy this fall.

Thank you for speaking out strongly in favor of respecting the will of the voters on your March 16th appearance on This Week. I hope you will continue to speak out in favor of a fair, democratic and transparent process.

Barack should make some comments on this, show the public how Hillary is trying to blackmail the Democratic party.

This list of people is a shocking example of who owns the Clintons. No wonder it has been so hard to tax hedge funds when the Clintons are in these peoples' pockets. Obey us or we take our meony away. Shame on them. The Clintons are even more out of touch than I thought.

Question:

I thought Hillary was all for women's lib.

Can't Pelosi say what she wants to say?


In any case, these kind of desperation attacks are really, really bad for Hillary.

You don't get people to support you by THREATENING them.

Well, at least if you're a Democrat you don't.

I guess this means that Richardson was right in announcing his support of Obama, right?
He was simply using independent judgment after all.

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OK, Can someone now please send a letter to Pelosi berating her for taking impeachment off the table?

Any question who has better coat tails?

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"We therefore urge you to clarify your position on super-delegates and reflect in your comments a more open view to the optional independent actions of each of the delegates at the National Convention in August.."

These "major" supporters aren't just talking about superdelegates exercising their options, they are talking about pledged delegates too.

No surprise:It's what the Dem party became under BClinton prezidency & DNC under McAuliffe,Just like the Repukes with "big" donors or a few folks controlling the Dem agenda least we forget Corp.profits over people and the outsourcing of our jobs.It's Clintonism.

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What a load of hooey!

1) "Several states and millions of Democratic voters have not yet had a chance to cast their votes. We respect those voters and believe that they... have a right to be heard."

2) "optional independent actions of each of the delegates"

Well, which is it Hillary gazillionaires?

Or are we supposed to be so confused as to buy both at once?

Anyway Pelosi can quietly tell these people to go f-themselves and form a third party if they don't like the results of the will of the people?

I hope Nancy Pelosi explained to those Clinton donors that it would be inappropriate for them to attempt to buy an election. Extortion is generally frowned upon. The DNC doen't need their stinky money.

1. Wait until all the primaries have occurred.
2. Support the intended purpose of the superdelegates, their independence.

Only in the minds of Obamites is that a threat or extortion. To the rest of the world it's about due process.

The real nomination process is just about to begin. Get your popcorn and have a seat. Bwahahaha.

Pelosi says to wait until June 3rd.

She also says this:

"If the votes of the superdelegates overturn what's happened in the elections, it would be harmful to the Democratic party," Pelosi said in an interview taped Friday for broadcast Sunday on ABC's "This Week."

That's Pelosi's opinion, and she has a right to say it.

Hillary can threaten all she wants, it won't change Pelosi's mind.

Fogu2, Due process arguments from a Clinton supporter are per se laughable at this point. Your candidate has been crying for the rules to be changed in her favor mid-stream ever since it started to dawn on her that the Feb 5th coronation wasn't going down.

Try this on for size: you can't consistently argue that: 1) we should allow all primary voters to have their voices heard because failure to do so is disenfranchisement (i.e. bad); and 2) once Obama wins more pledged delegates through these contests (which is essentially a mathematical certainty), the superdelegates and pledged delegates should feel free to usurp the will of these voters and vote their own conscience at the convention. You see, the disenfranchisement part that animates the concern in step 1 magically disappears in step 2. Do you get it or do you need the symbolic logic version?

So your only contribution to this is to generalize by calling people Obamites? You are hurting the discussion by generalizing. Tell us an intelligent, well-reasoned argument and we'll discuss. Calling people names and generalizations... that just makes you and only you (plenty of intelligent Clinton supporters) seem lacking in reasonable conversation.

The superdelegates were created NOT to be bound by the same rules that bind the pledged delegates

And no one is binding them. Unlike Hillary, no one on the Obama side is saying change the rules on how SuperDelegates should vote. We are just suggesting a criteria they should use when deciding their vote. That criteria was chosen so that the party would not blow itself apart by not appearing to honor the will of its constituents.

Btw, in my own mind the SuperDelegates should follow the pledged delegates unless something out of the ordinary happens that can not be accounted for by simply going by the pleaded vote count. Like take a fictional situation were Republican, urged on by a radio talk show wacko partisan, voted in the Democratic primary for the candidate that was easiest to beat.

Reminds me of Ferraro: "You really shouldn't mess with people like me!"

Those pesky voters are forgetting that money is in charge around here!

I don't think Nancy likes to be told what to do.

Unlike Hillary, she's the real deal.

Nice,

Just like Bill telling voters in Kentucky today something like don't let them steal this election from you.

It is Hillary that is trying to steal the election away from the voters. It really is disgusting and just one more reason not to vote for her - ever!

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The irony is almost too overwhelming. A bunch of donors write to Nancy Pelosi and claim to be "speaking for" voters by demanding that she stop telling super delegates to listen to voters, and claiming the authority to do so because they donate a lot of money.

There's something really wacky about claiming the right to speak on behalf of voters on account of the fact that you donate so much money.

brain donors. to cheney's army of shambling zombies...

It is extortion. No doubt.

But, this is the essence of the entire battle. The race between Hillary and Obama has always at the core been about Big Money vs. The Grassroots. It's why Hillary is fighting so hard. She is their candidate. If she loses, they lose. Now (Thanks to Greg) it is more out in the open. Good.

A lot of us already knew the battle lines. Hopefully, this gets some attention in the press so more people can see the vileness associated with Big Money.

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Insults used as blackmail. Super delegates came about for a purpose...if you didn't like it you should have said so at the time. Not at the time they are to do what they were created to do. They don't represent "independents or republican cross overs" voting in the dem primaries, they represent the democratic party. It's the way it's supposed to operate no matter who they may favor. If you disagree with their function then join the party and get rid of them for the next primary election because they are there for this one.

Good for them.

Let the voters vote and count before spewing about superdelegates.

The choice is between the DLC establishment or the Wellstone style movement.

These big money people are used to being able to buy their elections, and its pissing them off that instead the voters get to decide.

And go by the rules.

Which, by the way, Clinton adviser Ickes helped form those rules, and voted FOR the sanctions.

I certainly agree with the Clinton supporters that it is nonsense to say that superdelegates should feel obliged to vote one way or the other. Superdelegates should be free to vote for whichever candidate they prefer, for whatever reason seems most compelling to them as individuals. That said, if you seriously think that it is at all likely, once all ~900 supers weigh those various considerations which appeal to each individual, that they will break decisively for Clinton then you are kidding yourselves. They are leaning further and further to Obama as time goes by (even in the immediate wake of her Ohio victory he picked up 12 while she picked up only 4), so the idea that they are suddenly going to rush in to put her over the top is just too far-fetched to credit.

Yeah, somehow I doubt that they'd be completely content with the superdelegates backing Obama with their independent judgment.

Greg: The question is what Supers should or shouldn't do.

This is the question:

What does it mean when the top donors chide and demand the Speaker of the House to change her opinion on the issue?

And you and I don't fully know how much influence these donors have in the party and if the influence is sufficient to swing key number of delegates.

This has a lot to do with the influence of big money or our politics.

That's the key issue here.

The question is, who will speak for the 12.6 million people who have voted for HRC, if you want to get technical.

Here's another: should the 13.4 million who have voted for Barack get to dictate the outcome before the process has run it's course?

Sorry, but Pelosi must maintain at least the appearance of neutrality, and she couldn't even do that. No wonder her tenure has been so lackluster.


Why stay neutral when one candidate is actively hurting the party? Pelosi obviously doesn't think Hillary's "McCain has mad CIC cred" or her plea for a superdelegate coup are in the best interest of Democrats. As a leader of that party I'm glad she isn't sitting idly by. Blind neutrality does no one any good. What was the benefit of the media remaining virtually mute and "neutral" when Bush and Co. were BS-ing the country (and Hillary) about weapons of mass destruction? That worked out well, huh.

I agree with you - the Super Delegates should be allowed to make their decision at the END of the process.

If that were today, I think they would choose Obama. But people have to be allowed to vote, no matter how badly some Obama supporters want to cut that process short

If the Super Delegates choose Obama in June, he wins. That's it.

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I hate watching a desperate campaign flail around. This gets more ham-handed by the hour.

Excellent distillation of the issue!

Way to go getting the big money influence out of politics Hill!

As I read it, the big dollar HRC donors won't be able to donate their way around HRC's certain negative impact on down ticket Dems if she's the Dem candidate in November. It's Obama's coattails we need, and the better trade off for Pelosi is to ignore this silly threat and ensure that the Congressional races are as favorably positioned as possible. And why is there any reason to believe that Obama's fundraising capacity can't be turned to bringing in loads of small donations or the DCCC once he is the nominee? We're better off without HRC and her big-dollar supporters.

"The people deserve to have their voices heard! How dare you suggest that the people's voices actually matter!!"

It is far too long to repost, so if anyone wants to read my full breakdown of this latest shameless example of Hillary's attempt to hijack the democratic process you can read it here:

http://www.thepersonalispolitical.com/2008/03/new-tactic-attack-and-extort.html

Is this also a list from AIPAC?

Excellent, we can't let Pelosi and Reid steal this election by denying Florida and Michigan and giving us a candidate who is sure to lose. Hillary is our only chance. Obama is radio active now since his assocation with a racist hate cult has been exposed.

Dear Bud, The only racist hate cult around here is made up of trolls like you.

Hmm, isn't Pelosi a Super delegate? And therefore can't she exersize her judgement about the role of Supers? And isn't she free to say whatever the f*** she wants about anything she wants to? I hope this letter tips her into an outright endorsement of Obama. Wish I could vote for her (maybe a VP slot?)

On the other hand, maybe the shamelessness of this letter will tip a few more superdelegates to Obama.

It's interesting that the letter was leaked. It's clear to me that someone wants this out in the public domain. Who was it that said sunlight is the best sterilization?

Someone once said about Senator Obama that the current power structure will fight hard to hold on to thier position, and that he represents a threat to them. This letter clearly demonstrates that some people are getting very nervous.

Please, please, PLEASE let her tell them to push off. Enclosing a check a la Howard would be a nice touch, but from Nancy, I'll take a craftily worded letter, thanking them for their support, and telling them to go pound sand. She just might redeem herself after all.

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From before Clinton "announced," I have believed that there was no way, none, that she could possibly win the general election. Since late February, when Obama conclusively demonstrated his viability, I have wanted Clinton to withdraw. And I believe that the last several weeks of "kitchen sink" flailing have demonstrated beyond doubt that Clinton is not staying in primarily for the Democrats, but rather for herself.

(Of course, it takes a heapin' helpin' of arrogance for anyone to be a politician; duly noted.)

But to criticize a leader of the Democratic party for, heaven forfend, trying to, you know, lead her party, strikes me as totally absurd.

I don't know what beef Pelosi and Clinton have with each other, but it's clearly deeply held, don't you think?

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Obama is radio active now since his assocation with a racist hate cult has been exposed.

O indeed he is. Why just yesterday Donna Brazile, who is an uncommitted superdelegate, took Hilary to task for her attack on Obama by way of Rev. Wright. Oops, wait a minute that doesn't fit with your thesis.

Ok, let's try this: the Democratic gubernatorial candidate from Texas, Chris Bell, sent an email to registered Democrats in Texas this morning, supporting Obama and Rev Wright,and taking the Clintons to task for their attack on an African American minister who garners a shitload of respect.

O, damn, that doesn't fit your thesis, either...

Doesn't it make you mad? I fail to understand why two dozen wealthy people have the gaul to put pressure on NANCY PELOSI to decide what to say to her party. Do they think they are better than the MILLIONS of democrats who donated to Obama? THIS IS LUDICROUS! We, MILLIONS of Obama supporters should sign an internet letter to Pelosi stating that she should keep her word and better yet urge superdelegates to go for Obama sooner, rather than later. We obviously are bigger in number of supporters and dollar amount given to the democrats. Our voice is much bigger than that of a dozen wealthy donors. This is a new day in politics and the internet have made the voices of small donors stronger than the few wealthy!

I've had it with the Clintons. The cynic in me always believed that all the politics is only a show put on by the few for the enjoyment of the many who have no say.

Obama changed all that. However, the Clintons have given up on pretenses and this letter sheds light on the inner political machinations in their ugly nakedness.

Most certainly the Clintons have lost my vote. They have no shame.

Felix

Yeah but the hispanic swing effect is greatly lessened if, say, a lot of black people or young people or young black people or college students, etc show up to vote for Obama.

This is what her supporters did in Florida.

Basically they said, seat the delegates as is, or give us back all the money we've given to the DNC.

Add that to the Michigan revote that was to be paid by big Clinton donors, and you can come to your own conclusion about what she's trying to do.

Ok, i'll say it, she's trying to blackmail the Democratic party in order to win the nomination.

Is there any rule which says that super-delegates have to vote for the candidate with the most delegates? If so, what is it, please? If not, shut up.

The Obama campaign, for all of its talk about "new politics", has worked to deprive the voters in Florida and Michigan of the opportunity for a re-vote because the Obama people are afraid they won't win. Some democracy, huh? "New politics", huh?

And here they're crying because they want to make up some imaginary rule that says that super-delegates have to vote for Obama (er, I mean the candidate with the delegate lead who coincidentally happens to be Obama - a mere coincidence, I'm sure).

Obama politics resembles the old Chicago politics more than being any sort of "new politics".

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Is there any rule saying Pelosi can't be of the opinion that superdelegates SHOULD (not ARE REQUIRED TO) vote for the pledged delegate leader for the good of the party?

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You seem to have an inability to distinguish between what is required and what is right. We are not arguing that they must vote that way we are arguing that they should. It is the ethical thing to do. Under the rules they can vote for whomever they choose. Your candidate argues that they should vote for her. We argue that they should vote for the candidate with the most pledged delegates. I think that it does not make much difference because even if they are voting for the candidate they think is best they will choose Obama by a majority. Hillary has gotten all of them that she ever will. The rest of them are going to break for Obama the second week in June if not sooner.

The Michigan legislature shut Clinton down.

Fact.

She lost. In the legislature. She didn't have the votes to get her hastily drafted new law to the floor.

I know it's hard, but that's what happened. The elected representatives of Michigan voters shut her down.

Oh, the irony. Clinton's big money donors threatening the elected leader of The People's House, while Hillary Clinton natters on about democracy.


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Yeah but the hispanic swing effect is greatly lessened if, say, a lot of black people or young people or young black people or college students, etc show up to vote for Obam

That's certainly what happened here in Dallas County during the primary.

It's anyone's guess what happens in the general, though I have a pretty damn good idea what will happen here - Obama will win the county. Of course, Kerry won the city in '04 and just barely missed winning the county. But Obama will take Dallas County in November if he is the nominee. If it's Hilary, I honestly don't know. I'm not making that up, either - I can't call it. She might take the suburbs.

I just send the letter quoted below to Nacy Pelosi showing my support of her initial super-delegate directive and I suggest that everyone do the same.

URL: http://www.speaker.gov/contact

I have recently read a proposed letter from top Clinton donors directing you to change your stance on how super-delegates should cast their votes. I urge you to stand strong and prevent the Democratic party from tearing itself apart by overturning the will of its primary voters.

On a personal note I would like to add that this is the first election that I have donated to a political candidate. If you can not already tell I am a Barrack Obama supporter. To be honest, my enthusiasm for this election has taken me a bit by surprise. It snuck up on me, and before I knew it I was donating, following online political discussions, and now even writing to the Speaker of the House.

I know I am not alone in this new devotion as assuredly as I known that perceived corruption or unfairness would undo it. I do not know how to fight this resistance to change that is bubbling up in the party other than to ask for you help.

Thank you for listening,
Ken

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Ken,
thanks for posting the link to the Speaker. I sent an e-mail in support, too.

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Me to.

Yep, thanks for the idea.

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My response is that I just donated to the DCCC.

Wow, it's crazy how sometimes something can be staring you right in the face and you don't see it. You're right about the flawed logic - let the people vote!...so we can have the superdelegates overturn the majority of voters in the end.

This letter is disgusting. Not only do they think their money buys Hillary Clinton, they think it buys the whole party. Same thing when Dean was threatened with having to give DNC money back. Obama's going the right way. Get money from the people. Not these big money donors with swollen heads and illusions of grandeur.

There are millions of us will never support Obama after his racial shenanigans and association with "Rev" Wright. *IF* he gets the nomination, we will work to defeat him. We must repudiate racial politics from our party. 28% of Hillary supporters will NEVER vote for Obama. Greatness can come from defeat.

"We must repudiate racial politics from our party."

By defeating the black guy?
And nice avatar. Is that your way of repudiating racial politics?

You're not even a hillary supporter. Another GOP troll. This place is starting to stink with you f**kers.

Well said! LMAO!

We don't need or want the help of folks like you. Go vote for McCain, sing bomb Iran, and give yourself a huge high five for being post-racial.

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It's easy to be "post-racial" when you're white.

Just wait until Obama is President. We'll see how post-racial these f*&ks feel then.

Sounds like a letter from Tony Soprano or John Gotti. Face it guys, you LOST.

Translation: We bought her, please don't break her.

I really hope that the MSM picks this up as major news so these jerks get exposed for what they are.

Will you call on Kerry and Kennedy to back the will of people since Hillary won Mass?

Sure if all the super delegates do it.

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No because I am not arguing that each superdelegate should ratify the vote of his/her constituents. I am arguing that thye should confirm the majority of the pledged delegates. But either way Obama wins, so I guess it is a wash.

Yep, no problem. If every elected representative votes in accordance with the will of their constituents- best case senario for Hillary- it breaks right down the middle. And Obama still wins easily.

In fact, DailyKos had analysis few weeks earlier projecting Obama would have lead among super delegates- if that was used as a benchmark.

If you really want to be fair, we can draw it down to congressional districts for congressional members and Obama will have about 60% of the Supers elected for Congress- because of his big victory margins and small margins in loses.

Why don't you suggest this to you Madame?

Seems fair to me.

You are either completely missing the point, or you are just going out of your way to be disingenuous in order to support Hillary. I'm guessing the latter.

The point isn't that superdelegates should follow the voters at the state level, this is a NATIONAL election, and the point is that whoever the voters pick NATIONALLY should be the winner.

And I'm sure there are superdelegates supporting Hillary is some of the 30 races Obama has won, compared to her 14, so you can keep bringing up Kennedy and Kerry, as you people usually do (I'm assuming because they are the only superdelegates in the few states she has won that you know of), but for every Kerry or Kennedy there are plenty of Clinton superdelegates supporting her in Obama's states. So let's do everyone a favor and quit making these stupid arguments, because they aren't making her supporters look any smarter.

Speaker Pelosi,

Don’t let these bastards intimidate you!

Would they be writing this if the shoe was on the other foot? Of course not.

And seriously, who gives more money to Democrats?
Is it these 20 bozos whose donations are concentrated in the hands a very few self-serving and obviously entitled and arrogant people?

Or is it the millions raised from grassroots /netroots activists?

Seriously.

Who actually has given more to the party, the presidential candidates and the people running for Congress & the Senate?

Top donors or individuals?

As soon as these same bozos started threatening Howard Dean a couple of weeks ago – implying they’d either withhold or ask to have their contributions returned - the grass roots/netroots stepped up to the plate and started making donations to cover the few hundred thousand in question (which is all it actually was when we started looking at who gave what among those who were threatening).

Ask the DNC how much they raised the weekend the reports of those backer’s threats became public.
Y
ou know where you can tell them to stick it, Speaker.

Go ahead & do it.

"The People" have yours, Howard Dean’s and Senator Reid’s backs.

Classless, loud mouth hillbillies calling Gov. Richardson a 'Judas' don’t represent real Democrats. In fact, they destroy them (just ask John Kerry about Ohio).

So, hang in there.

They don't care about the party, they only care about Bill, Hillary, the DLC and themselves.

Hey, why wait until the nomination process is complete. Let's just declare ourselves the winner now!

How undemocratic of the Obamites to not want the process to proceed. What exactly are they afraid of?

No Florida
No Michigan
We're ahead let's just say we won!

This is not even close to being over. Bwahahaha.

Good old Fogu, always looking out for the interests of the Dem Pary. That's Fogu, a loyal lifelong Democrat.

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lol. Yeah, these RNC bots are pretty hilarious.

Obama plus another $200. Thanks for the inspiration big money douches.

Isn't Nancy Pelosi a superdelegate? Doesn't that mean she's supposed to use her best "independent" judgment about what's good for the party when she makes her decision? Wasn't her statement a reflection of what she thinks would be best for the party? So what's the problem?

Oh, that's right. The problem is that big money people are accustomed to calling the shots. Gosh, I feel so bad for them.

Isn't this fairly clear evidence that Hillary's claims that contributions from PACS, lobbyists, etc. do not demand a quid pro quo is bunk? Quite honestly, I view this position by these contributors as attempted extortion.

As others have noted in their posts, one of the real strengths of the Obama campaign has been its ability to attract small donations from hundreds of thousands of individuals, none of whom expect anything more than what Obama has publicly promised. There are no hidden promises, no secret deals, no ambassadorships or Cabinet posts up for sale.

Quite honestly, Nancy Pelosi has exhibited far more integrity and character than these selfish chumps who believe their contributions should have greater weight than the votes of the people. For some reason Clinton's supporters don't get it. The American people have had it with the savagery of the Clintons and their inability to engage in honest dialogue about the issues.

They've been so ensconced in the politics of personal destruction that they haven't any idea as to how to win a campaign based on the strength of their characters and policies.

It's the Bill Richardson affect. Just a little warning that if you do a BR, you're toast. No more leadership role, no more money.

Pelosi is the one of the few dem leader who acts like a dem.

For decades the Democratic Party has been neither a single party nor has it reliably acted like one.

It's thanks in large part to this that Bill Clinton was elected and then went on to be a disastrous president for the left in America and around the world.

I don't hear or read it often, but Clinton's administration was responsible for the deaths of more people (around one million in Iraq alone) than any since FDR, whose presidency, of course, included World War II.

It's thanks in large part to the Democratic Party not being a single party that Bush has been able to get away with the most unbelievable criminality of any president in U.S. history. By the time he's through, he may surpass Clinton in numbers of people killed.

If this primary battle will spotlight some of the differences within the party, so that it can find at least a modicum of unity, excellent!

If the in-fighting means McCain is elected, which I seriously doubt -- then again, I must remind myself never to underestimate the stupidity of Americans -- wouldn't that indicate that America is still not ready for a modicum of sanity at the head of its government?

If so, that would be a great pity. But if toxic medicine is what you need, you'll just have to plug your nose and swallow it. Again.

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Don't forget Vietnam. The US killed 'bout 2 million there and it wasn't until late 1968 that a Repug was in charge of that disaster.

At the risk of being redundant:

Barack's victory is on us.

Yes he has won more delegates, more votes, and more states. All that is wonderful. The clincher however will be his ability to raise more money. Tons and tons of money.

This is Washington DC folks!
To quote Dylan: Money doesn't talk it screams.

We are almost two million strong. If we each give $25 dollars that sums to $50 million! You want to crush Clinton and clinch this thing? Then we got to bury them under our bullion. We need good massive number$ for March.

You know what to do.
You know where to click.

Make it so grasshoppers...

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...er, it's "Money doesn't talk, it swears." But that's okay, I don't expect Bertrand Russell to be up on his Dylan quotes.

Anyway, your point is correct. Obama is by any rational, practical or fair measure soon to be the nominee. The problem is the Clintons and their campaign are not concerned with such trivialities as being rational, practical or fair.

From Andrew Sullivan (andrewsullivan.com):

Clinton's 2012 Strategy
26 Mar 2008 03:59 pm

It's clearly working. Her goal is to defeat Obama by destroying him in the next month or two, not by making a positive argument about herself. By ramping up his negatives, she also has an added threat to the superdelegates: nominate him and you'll elect McCain. And if she cannot destroy him this time, and he gets the nomination, she will have so anathematized him with a segment of voters that McCain will beat him, and she gets to say "told you so" and run again in 2012. The new Gallup finding shows that it is working. It is Rove-Morris politics at its purest; and she and her husband are as skilled at it as anyone.
And that is one key reason why she must be beaten. A great deal is at stake. And the war is just beginning.

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At this point we should all just resign ourselves to a McCain presidency. I think Dowd gets it right today... Hillary is already gunning for 2012, and is happy to see Obama go down so she'll have a chance at it.

Interesting times.

http://www.nytimes.com/2008/03/26/opinion/26dowd.html?_r=1&hp&oref=slogin

I found Dowd's column interesting, but it's a flawed strategy. If the Dem loses in 2008, neither of these candidates will get another shot in 2012. They'll both look like John Kerry.

This sounds remarkably similar to the arm-twisting tone Terry McAuliffe took with Bill Richardson, regarding what Richardson "owed" to the Clintons and why that should drive any endorsement decision; likewise Carville's "Judas" comments. Obama's shown that he doesn't need this circle of donors to raise money, so I doubt Pelosi's that scared about the implicit threat. The more likely effect is to continue to erode Hillary Clinton's credibility among party leaders and superdelegates. If this letter was initiated or approved by the Clinton campaign, or perceived as such, this will be yet another stupid tactical error by the Clinton team.

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What a disingenous, steaming pile of crap! Yes, by all means, let the voters be heard!

(Oh, and by the way, we're going to encourage Obama's delegates to switch their votes, and we're going to encourage the superdelegates to vote against the majority. We'll let the voters be heard, but we don't have to listen to them.)

I am so incredibly pissed at these arrogant, elitists jerks.

Well Bud, hopefully you're not representative of most Hillary supporters.

But it's very reassuring to hear about your committment to repudiating racial politics. Let us know how following through with that works out for you. In the meantime, don't understatemate the power of personal self-awareness and being honest with yourself.

I hear you Bud.

Didn't Clinton win California and the same would apply to Pelosi?

Now you're one dumbass aren't you. I think you pretty much make it clear every time you puke on the site.

Nancy Pelosi represents not the whole of California but the 8th district of California which went resoundingly to Obama.

Yes, Kerry and Kennedy represent the entire state of MA.

TooBubba, it was also during the Bill Clinton presidency when the sanctions caused Saddam Hussein to disarm, if that matters a whit to you.

It's questionable, at the least, to say the sanctions had anything at all to do with Saddam "disarming."

But for the sake of argument, let's say the sanctions caused Saddam to disarm. Was it worth the approximately 1,000,000 Iraqi deaths, which included approximately half a million children, the sanctions are known to have caused? Do 1,000,000 dead Iraqis matter a whit to you?

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I not only agree with what these rich people say, but I will never forgive Josh Marshall for denying me the right to vote for him in the primary. Primaries are never over until after the convention, and any American who is eligible to be president, but who either doesn't run or drops out before the convention disenfranchises every voter in the country. And I will never give anyone any money who prevents me from voting for any candidate I might want to choose.

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Hold your ground, Speaker, and I'll be giving to the DCCC. There are more of us than there are of them.

Query: How do you simultaneously argue (1) that the primaries must take place so that the will of the people can be known and their choice honored and (2) that the delegates who are chosen by 'the people' because they will vote for a certain candidate are not required to honor their "pledge" to do so?

I guess in Clintonworld this doesn't present a problem: they are both arguments that the Clintons **want** to make and therefore they are, by decree, complimentary and consistent. Back over here in the mundane world of facts and logic, it makes no sense.

I keep thinking that **surely** it's become so blatant and stupid that the voters must see through this ....... and then I remember that GWB was re-elected and lose all hope.

I have sent a supportive email twice now to Speaker Pelosi. It has been returned twice with the note, "delivery failed." Full mailbox?

I also sent $$$ to the DNC.

This letter is incredible. It should be on display for all democratic voters to see. I don't care who you support - the power donors shouldn't be making veiled threats to the DNC like this.

I thought the RNC was supposed to be the party of wealth and the privilege.

The time has come for a third party...

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$30 more just donated to Sen. Obama. FU HRC & Co.

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Forget Democratic Party politicos and politics...

The Republicans are worse....

Understand we're living in an oligarchy and take it from there..

"On a personal note I would like to add that this is the first election that I have donated to a political candidate. If you can not already tell I am a Barrack Obama supporter. To be honest, my enthusiasm for this election has taken me a bit by surprise. It snuck up on me, and before I knew it I was donating, following online political discussions, and now even writing to the Speaker of the House." KenM1

Just sent a letter to Pelosi and DCCC with donation. If enough of us express disgust, it may get a response.

Political fatcats trying to kneecap the Speaker of the House, who dared speak out against their chosen stooge. So this is what's really going on while Hillary hangs up the "let the remaining primary voters have their say" windowdressing.

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Translation: We bought her, please don't break her.

LOL!

I was thinking something along the lines of "we really don't lose our money..."

But I like yours a lot better.

Perhaps a letter should be drafted, copied and sent to Hillary's people telling them that they are destroying The Party of Jefferson, period.

Or an online letter addressing all of them that the public can sign? Sort of like what Robt Greenwald does over at Fox Attacks?

Hillary is too polarizing an individual to ever become POTUS.

Bottomline, the problem with most of her supporters is that they haven't a clue about any of this and are just supporting her because she is female.

Come November when the 527s come rolling out against her every Dem will be horrified and it will be more of the same I told you soing that happens.

And Hillary's supporters will be nowhere to be found, won't want to hear or know anything about the demise of the Democratic Party, why?

Because most of them could care less about politics in the first place, let alone The Party.

Most of the Obama supporters have a genuine concern for The Party and how it will be left after all of this is over.

And Obama's supporters are made up of The party's future, not it's past. Which is enormously important.

Take a moment and write to Speaker Pelosi if you support her position. You can do it here: Speaker of the House

I just did.

Tonya Harding and her 20 kneecappers. Wonderful.

We need both types of donors. I've given to both, most recently and more to Obama (nowhere as much as these guys have given to Clinton) and I'm fine with their general point. Pelosi certainly doesn't represent me in anything and she should shut her yap and let it play out.

It has played out.

I am a democrat and I have never voted for a republican. If Obama is the nominee, I will vote for McCain. That is just the truth. Obama is not ready to run this nation. I don't understand the infactuation, but I love my country and will not hand it over to just anyone. I am a black male also. I know these ultra liberal blogs are filled with hate, but many people feel the same way I do, and will never support Obama. I use the think repupublicans were our worst enemy, but now I see we are our own worst enemy. There is a reason democrats have won only 3 presidencies in the last 40yrs. Dems do not know how to pick a candidate. They go off of pure emotion and details and experience be damned. Fellow democrats please wise up to how you treat one another. The Clintons are democrats who have done great things for this country. You would think they were the most racist, worst people in America reading these comments. It is sad, very sad.

Really, Sadder than the fact Party is being sold to big money?

It is infact sad very sad. We've seen this angle of agony before.

So you support McCain's Hundred year war in Iraq. No wonder you support Hillary. She also supports McCain to continue Bush's stupid war, which Hillary stupidly voted for, and has now endorsed War Monger McCain to continue it, if she does not get her way.

OK Bret, go vote for McCain. In the meantime, please explain to all of us who are blinded by hate how the Clintons have done such great things for this country. Give specifics. Perhaps you could start with NAFTA, GATT, and the dissolution of the Glass-Steagal Act.

Of course, that would require a minimal degree of intellectual honesty. Good luck with that.

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Sorry, but I don't believe you. You obviously have an axe to grind. No one with any sense of history could argue that Obama isn't ready to run this country. He has more experience than Lincoln, better judgment than Clinton (or McCain), and stronger charisma than any president in my lifetime.

"No one with any sense of history could argue that Obama isn't ready to run this country."

I'm sorry, are you joking?

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It is sad to see fat cats pulling strings only to find out they are not attached to anything any more.

Is it not?

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Perhaps it's time to get back to the fundamentals of what a primary process is. This is not really an election and it is certainly not a matter of public right. Primaries are the process by which a private organization, in this case the Democratic party, decides who it's candidate will be. The Clinton campaign has been making a lot of noise about "disenfranchisement" and "voice of the people" and so on. Of course, they are making those noises because they are behind, but it brings up a relevant point.

I would suspect that the origins of primaries being staged as statewide elections was an attempt by the parties to shift the cost of their selection processes to the states (taxpayers) and so it has taken on the appearance of an election subject to public access. It is, however, nothing of the kind. The political parties, for all of their institutionalized acceptance, are no more than private clubs and their selection process has no more constitutional or legal connection than that of the local PTA.

The Democratic party, for right or wrong, established the rules of its process and eliminated Michigan and Florida from the process. I happen to think that was an unfortunate decision, but Clinton agreed to abide by those rules and then immediately and unilaterally abandoned that agreement. And now, further, she is trying to reframe the situation as something it is not in order to gain a narrow personal advantage.

This is not about elections or rights or an electoral franchise. It is about a private club picking it's candidates. An unwillingness to abide by rules that turn out to be inconvenient is a hallmark of the unsavory kind of ruthless power mongering that we have gotten all too accustomed to from the Republicans. This has got to stop.

And, as for the argument that the Florida primary got untracked by the FL Republican legislature setting the date, since when has the Democratic party allowed the Republican party to set it's primary schedule? Is that really a good idea?

s/ Increasingly disgusted in CA

-SR-

Some Democrats have shown real spine and integrity, but the Clinton's are a powerful force.

The Michigan legislature did shut it down. I was shocked they bucked the Machine, but they did.

Clinton's brand new, tailor-made election law didn't get to the floor, much to her surprise.

Hence, this tactic.

She lost in Michigan. She didn't have the votes.

She doesn't care.


OK, just sent $100 to BHO, and this letter to Speaker Pelosi, CC'd my Gov and Congressional delegation as well.

Dear Speaker Pelosi-

Thank you for your service to our country, and to the Democratic Party.

I read today with disgust a letter, addressed to you, which can only be interpreted as an attempt to blackmail the Speaker of the House of Representatives and the most powerful woman in the United States. This letter from so-called significant Clinton donors implies their money will dry up if you do not publicly endorse their scheme to throw the Democratic nomination to the candidate with fewer votes, fewer delegates, and the fewest states won. I ask simply that you hold your ground, for the good of the country and our Party.

Perhaps I am especially sensitive to this scheme, as I am a local Party leader in a red state- one of the states that Senator Clinton and her surrogates say doesn't matter. I am only too aware that a Clinton candidacy will mean no money and no support for my state, while simultaneously punishing Congressional candidates simply for being associated with her toxic campaign.

These tactics are too frequent, too pointed to ignore. For years, I have consoled myself that even in lost campaigns the Democratic Party was fighting for the common people and the common good, for civil rights and economic fairness. Foreign investors do not write our foreign policy, oil corporations do not write our environmental policy, multi-billion dollar corporations do not write our labor policy and tax code, and we do not use the politics of fear and race baiting. This blatant effort by twenty individuals to hijack the nomination process because of their corporate interests, combined with the gut-wrenching tactics of the Clinton campaign, flies in the face of all I have believed of the Democratic Party.

Please help me fight for what's right, what's good in this country. Please stand up and defend the millions of us who do not make millions of dollars, who do not have the option to buy our place and the political table, and who don't happen to live in Democratic strongholds. We matter, too.

Again, many thanks for all your efforts.

every time she or one of her proxies opens their mouths, i write another check for Obama. getting pricey, but worth it. the Clintons have no moral compass, only self-interest.

Oh, my. This may have been a mistake. Releasing these names.

Sort of a "who's who" of Clinton sleaze, from the '90s.

Start with this name: Susie Tompkins Buell. Google.

Isn't this a textbook example of what's wrong with our government? The Clinton bigwigs are telling the elected Speaker of the House to shut the hell up?

Bought. And. Paid. For.