Florida Gov. Crist (R): I'm Willing To Hold New Dem Primary
Florida Gov. Charlie Crist, a Republican, has stepped into the fight over the Democratic Party's refusal of delegates for the Florida rogue primary. Crist has now signaled that he would be willing to hold a whole new primary election, working with the DNC to make sure the state is represented based on those results. "I think it's very important though that those delegates are seated," Crist said.
If such a new primary election were called, with delegates accepted without complaint by the Democratic National Committee, the possible outcomes essentially fall into two categories: 1) Hillary Clinton again wins by a big margin, giving her a delegate boost against Obama, or 2) Hillary wins only narrowly or perhaps even loses, depriving her of her plan to fall back on a fight to seat the state's delegates.















This seems a blatant attempt from a McCain surrogate to further divide the Democratic Party. Thanks, but no thanks, Chuck.
March 2, 2008 11:41 PM | Reply | Permalink
That's exactly what it is. Chain Gang Charlie is gunning for that VP slot on McCain's ticket, and he figures if he can help Hillary scoop up a few more delegates, so much the better for himself and his party.
March 3, 2008 10:18 AM | Reply | Permalink
Hm, you think that Clinton's delegate lead in Florida would hold up if there were an honest election there, with both teams campaigning? I find that somewhat improbable. I expect that her lopsided victory there was largely a function of the lack of an actual campaign prior to the election. If we had a re-vote, I expect that her lead in Florida delegates would shrink considerably. We Obama supporters have nothing to lose from a re-vote, and should be actively encouraging such an outcome.
March 3, 2008 11:25 AM | Reply | Permalink
Fine by me. Find the money; find the date; and the Obama campaign will arrive there--and win!
Same with Michigan.
March 2, 2008 11:46 PM | Reply | Permalink
What would they have to do, at this point in time, to make it "fair?" Schedule it 3 months down the road to allow adequate time for campaigning? What would the mechanics and details have to be for the country to believe that a second primary is legitimate? Amazing that a Republican is taking the lead on this issue. What's in it for him? Is he truly just representing his state, making sure his Democratic constituents are actually represented? How do the national GOP organizations feel about this? This campaign season has been insane (but incredibly interesting), I can't wait to see what happens next...
March 2, 2008 11:49 PM | Reply | Permalink
If this were to happen, It would give Hillary an excuse to stay in the race, and extend the nominating contest for another month or so. This would be great for the Republicans. No wonder the possible Republican VP choice would be pushing it.
March 3, 2008 7:42 AM | Reply | Permalink
Actually, I think that what is in it for him is that it would make Florida the next center of attention. It got to experience hordes of republicans pandering in January, and now stands a chance to get the full force of two desperate democrats pandering. It stands to benefit Florida, and that which is good for Florida is good for incumbant governors in Florida.
March 3, 2008 11:40 AM | Reply | Permalink
I think it would help the Dems. It would give both HRC and BO a chance to campaign in Florida and would provide excellent exposure to whomever was the eventual nominee. I suspect that will be BO and the exposure would help put Florida in play in the fall.
I suspect that the reason Hunter H.T. doesn't like the idea is that he is a total Hilbot, and thinks that having HRC steal the nomination by seating MI and FL is a great idea. Stealing elections by changing the rules three-quarters of the way through the nomination fight would be like asking to count exhibition games 3/4 of the way through the season because your team isn't going to make the playoffs. Not only would it not be fair, but it would be like pouring gasoline on the party and lighting a match. If that is the only way HRC can win/steal the nomination, it would not be worth having.
March 2, 2008 11:55 PM | Reply | Permalink
This is laughable on so many levels. I am the furthest one could get from a Hillbot, genius.
March 3, 2008 12:54 AM | Reply | Permalink
So you would want us to think. I believe, that just like Obama is a sleeper agent for Muslims, you are a sleeper agent for the Hillary camp. It all makes sense now! ;)
March 3, 2008 8:58 AM | Reply | Permalink
Dammit, my plans have been foiled again! I'll get you meddling kids if it's the last thing I do!
March 3, 2008 9:33 AM | Reply | Permalink
Sorry, I see I have confused my Hunters. There is someone who posts regularly at MyDD using the same name, without your cleverly adopted middle moniker, who is a flaming Hilbot. Again sorry for the case of mistaken identity and for impugning your good name ;-)
March 3, 2008 12:44 PM | Reply | Permalink
I say, let's roll. Put an end to this divisiveness.
The worst that happens from the standpoint of an Obama supporter is that he loses, and the delegates get seated. And I don't think that anyone out there thinks that if Obama captures the nomination, he won't eventually seat the Michigan and Florida delegates anyway (after he clears a safe margin). And seating them puts an end to a divisive situation, and allows him to campaign there, meaning that he'll have organization and a battle-tested GOTV machine in Florida come the general, provided he wins the nomination.
I wouldn't mind him playing a bit of hardball and demanding a new Florida primary come with some kind of revote in Michigan. Michigan was the much more troubling situation as far as Clinton's plans to force a delegate seating at the convention. But I honestly say that Obama should go for it. He's managed to close huge gapes everywhere he's been able to be active. I don't think that it's a bad thing to introduce himself to the voters of Florida. Maybe he'll be able to put to rest some of these Muslim rumors that keep floating around for some odd reason.
March 3, 2008 12:01 AM | Reply | Permalink
Crist is running for the VP spot, that is all this is; to think anything else is just dumb.
March 3, 2008 12:03 AM | Reply | Permalink
My thoughts exactly.
March 3, 2008 12:10 AM | Reply | Permalink
A Republican solution to a Democratic problem? ? ? ?
March 3, 2008 12:23 AM | Reply | Permalink
There is NO "Democratic problem"! At the moment, this is Hillary's problem--the rest of the Dems have no problem with the outcome, as long as everyone follows the rules.
March 3, 2008 12:21 PM | Reply | Permalink
Hey, if Charlie Crist, in his infinite stupidity wants to give our bank-busting candidates a chance to organize and build a GOTV infrastructure in his state, let's take him up on the offer.
Contrary to popular opinion, I think the Democratic race sucking up all the free media attention is a good thing for us. Every time we argue about healthcare, its a chance to remind people about the importance of the issue. After hearing us bicker about substantive issues aren't people going to be disappointed McBush's only solution to EVERY problem is tax cuts?
Game on, Charlie!
March 3, 2008 12:25 AM | Reply | Permalink
beware of a republican baring gifts
he just wants to prolong this fight.
sorry but Florida democratic party broke the rules after being warned time and time again.
imagine if Obama won the second time , someone would sue to say that first election shoudl be the one that counts..
sorry this opens a whole pandora's box
March 3, 2008 1:25 AM | Reply | Permalink
I am all for redoing the vote if it comes to seating Florida. You have to remember, though, that currently Clinton is losing even if we take into account the delegates that she won uncontested. It would require a pretty big blow-out for her to gain anything from it.
March 3, 2008 2:25 AM | Reply | Permalink
My biggest objection is that it would stretch out the process much longer and end all hopes of some sort of closure next week. A secondary problem is that it would seem to be rewarding the protests of a candidate who wants the rules changed because she could do well by said changes.
Why should this come up only now? If it's a good solution, why was it not devised before votes were cast, introducing impure motives of various kinds?
March 3, 2008 2:47 AM | Reply | Permalink
I do not see how this rewards a candidate who wants to rewrite the rules in the middle of the game. The rules were that Primaries could not begin before Feb 5 except in four specific states. If Florida were to hold a new election now, it would be following the rules, not ignoring them. Meanwhile, I do not know why you suppose that a re-vote would favor Clinton. Do you really think that her lopsided victory there would have occured in an election which had been preceded by an actual campaign? I do not. I think that if we have another vote there in which candidates are actually allowed to campaign, her margin will shrink way down and her delegate lead there will vanish.
March 3, 2008 11:45 AM | Reply | Permalink
I just want this primary to fucking end already!!!!
March 3, 2008 2:50 AM | Reply | Permalink
All this talk seems to ignore the people in Florida & Michigan who voted. I see no other way of looking at it but that they're being disenfranchised if their votes won't count. And, I don't think they have much control over the decisions of their party leaders, so don't go there.
I also have an unpleasant suspicion that a lot of the willingness to ignore their votes is also quite unprincipled and dishonest, and that if it favored those same people's candidate, they'd be all for it. Either you're honest and have principles you'll stand for, or you don't.
March 3, 2008 3:37 AM | Reply | Permalink
Not true. If Obama "won" Florida under the same circumstances, this supporter (and, I suspect many) would not be calling to seat their delegates. It's a simple question of fairness.
It is neither candidate's fault that the states' Democratic voters were disenfranchised. It is wholly on the state parties' shoulders.
March 3, 2008 7:31 AM | Reply | Permalink
This is a sign that McCain and surrogates are frighten about Obama. While I like the idea of holding another democratic primary contest in Florida with Obama name on the ballot, at this point it not going to be necessary, because Hillary will lose Texas tomorrow, and drop out of the race, unless she is willing to inflict further damage to the democratic party.
March 3, 2008 4:53 AM | Reply | Permalink
Guys, forget Folorida for a moment, and read the assessment by Zogby International after releasing the poll today 3/3/08.
Obama, has a slim advantage on Clinton in both states, although the leads are within the poll's margin of error of just under 4 percentage points.
Obama leads 47 percent to 44 percent in Texas, as Clinton gained 1 point overnight in the polling conducted by Zogby International. He leads 47 percent to 45 percent in Ohio, a turnaround from Clinton's 1-point advantage on Sunday.
Obama has wiped out big leads in the last two weeks in both states for Clinton, a New York senator and former first lady, but in the final days of the race neither candidate has managed dramatic shifts.
March 3, 2008 5:25 AM | Reply | Permalink
Gee, what a sweet offer.
March 3, 2008 7:07 AM | Reply | Permalink
Governor Crist is, by and large, popular in Florida with both Democrats and Republicans. He's also on Karl Rove's shit list, for refusing to campaign with W years ago.
I'm less inclined to believe this offer is completely nefarious.
March 3, 2008 7:43 AM | Reply | Permalink
They oh so want Hillary as the candidate. Clear as day.
Why?
Because she can't win the general election. Zero % chance.
March 3, 2008 7:56 AM | Reply | Permalink
I am not against a real primary being run if it can be done in a timely matter... Perhaps they could piggyback it with the Pennsylvania primary. My only concern would be as follows:
Who would be able to vote? Only registered democrats? Everybody? Everybody even if they previously had voted in the Republican Primary this year already? I think that would have to be worked out before anybody would agree to anything.
March 3, 2008 8:34 AM | Reply | Permalink
Homefries. I like crist for a republican. The problem I have is that he is angling for a vp slot with mccain. What better way to seal that than to allow a redo of the primary, probably paid for by the rnc, lets say about June 30, so that the clintons' train wreck can keep going and further divide the dems. It sounds like a rnc hail mary pass to get the clintons the nomination and then crush them in november, retake the senate and cut into the dem lead in the house. Pathetic.
March 3, 2008 8:46 AM | Reply | Permalink
I strongly believe that Hillary would win Florida, although the margin would not be impressive enough to make much of a difference.
What's important here is that the Republicans most certainly believe likewise and are trying anything to run against her instead of Obama.
March 3, 2008 8:56 AM | Reply | Permalink
thats why repubs are voting for obama so hillary can be the nominee.....wake up they want to run against this con artist
March 3, 2008 10:44 AM | Reply | Permalink
Hopefully, tomorrow makes this moot.
March 3, 2008 8:58 AM | Reply | Permalink
Are you the same Hunter Thompson who incessantly posts pro-Hillary comments at MyDD?
If I have a case of "mistaken Hunters" I profoundly apologize. You should track down the guy at MyDD and straighten him out, he is impugning your good name.
March 3, 2008 9:13 AM | Reply | Permalink
What an asshole.
He seems to want to prolong the Democratic battle.
Too late for that now. Regardless of the outcome, this race is ending tommorow tuesday.
Hillary will have to be dragged off the stage if it comes to that.
March 3, 2008 9:38 AM | Reply | Permalink
Caucuses in Fla. would be nice.
March 3, 2008 9:56 AM | Reply | Permalink
While the campaign for the democratic nominee will more than likely be decided tommorow this is an encouraging sign.
Personally, i think this would be the only really democratic way to resolve the issue of whether or not to seat the delegates from Fl and MI.
And now the Fl Governor is takign a position that is directly opposite from the one being pushed by the Clinton campaign.
Hurrah!
March 3, 2008 10:36 AM | Reply | Permalink
what happened to our constitution......one person one vote ........the dem party are idiots ....vote twice in texas ...let fla vote twice and what about michigan??
March 3, 2008 10:40 AM | Reply | Permalink
Thanks for your offer Crist, but Democrats don't need a Republican's help to further screw-up this situation. We've handled that quite nicely ourselves!
March 3, 2008 10:41 AM | Reply | Permalink
Findlay, you're here! Glad to see folks from home.
March 3, 2008 10:46 AM | Reply | Permalink
Crist is the one who signed into law the primary date that the dem voters were stuck with thru no fault of their own .....
March 3, 2008 10:48 AM | Reply | Permalink
Florida's state Democratic legislators voted in favor of the bill(setting the primary date) that Crist signed; more specifically, a majority of Democratic state legislators voted with the Republican majority of state legislators.
Google it, or search the TPM archives, I've seen it mentioned several times.
My point is that, having voted for those self-same state legislators, that willingly supported the bill, the "dem voters" aren't in a No-Fault zone.
On another topic: Crist angling for a VP nod in this election cycle? On what planet? Not with McCain's Hagee endorsement, is all I'm saying ...
March 3, 2008 11:39 AM | Reply | Permalink
For all the cynicism and suspicion of Governor Crist that I see above, this is a solution that resolves the issue of Florida delegates at the source that caused it (the Florida government.) It is also the ONLY possible solution that actually involved the Florida voters. Everything else will be a case of non-Floridians haggling over how to allocate Florida delegates.
Sure there are some downsides, but all of them are less than if the rest of the National Democratic delegates wind up saying "Here's what we will do to Florida."
So the original voters are disenfranchised? They knew that when they voted! They made their statement anyway. With this proposal they get to present their own say in a forum that counts in more than just the media. It's not as early in the decision process, but the Florida political leaders robbed them of that, not the national Democratic Party.
Will it add to the uncertainty leading into the convention? Yeah, and that has always been the conservative argument against democracy and letting voters decide. Democracy takes away the power to act that elites claim is their own and that no one else is competent to perform.
For the downsides, this puts all the repercussions from Florida voters back where it belongs - onto the Florida political leaders who masterminded that piece of crap that caused the problem.
And it WILL suck all the national media attention out of McCain's sails.
Then, after the election, the Democratic Party will have about two years to come up with a set of rules that makes some sense out of the primary process. But that is for after the next Democratic President is elected.
March 3, 2008 11:42 AM | Reply | Permalink
Florida's Dem House Minority Leader was just on the radio in Miami, and he is advocating a mail-in ballot, with Dems and Independents eligible. He thinks it will help Dems in November to have Hillary and Barack campaign here. (He has not endorsed Clinton or Obama.)
Crist's offer means the state will pay for the primary, whether it's a mail-in or polling place primary.
March 3, 2008 12:13 PM | Reply | Permalink
Since it was the Republican legislature that set the dates to begin with, it makes sense to agree with Uncle Chuckles on the condition that the GOP pay for it. This should be fun.
March 3, 2008 12:18 PM | Reply | Permalink
it continues to shock me how a bunch of supporters so in love with themselves and their candidate, and who've gotten the same fawning for their candidate from the media translating into historic levels of financial support, and a fully engaged "hipster" online community...
...shocks me that that hubris so oft projected on tv by supporters and campaign officials isn't translating now into an eagerness to reflect true democracy, to garner a unassailable mandate for the "chosen one" candidate and full bore support a fully-funded re-do of florida and/or michigan elections.
...oh, but i'm sure all the unemployed and partially employed college and grad school supporters of obama who have no life obligations like jobs, or caring for children to keep them from making a limited 2 hour abomination to democracy called a "caucus" -- i'm quite sure you folks would be just peachy-keen with re-do caucuses because your schedule (or lack thereof) allow you to dominate such events.
but a re-do primary? "eek! shudder the thought!"
your convinced he's the messiah, well then convince everyone else by running out the string and garnering your candidate's mandate.
if you can't, then please, stop whining.
March 3, 2008 1:25 PM | Reply | Permalink
Ya know, the only whining I've heard so far in this thread seems to be someone who is "... shocked, shocked I tell you".
Were you planning on addressing the actual comments in the thread?
Or do you just have a gripe and figured you'd leave a steamer here, for lack of a better place?
March 3, 2008 1:50 PM | Reply | Permalink