I really would like to know who is behind these attacks in a 'Democratic' primary???

There should be more investigating...
http://coffeehouse.tpmcafe.com/blog/richards1052/2008/jan/19/obama_smear_e_mail_circulates_among_jewish_leaders

The whole thing stinks...

That has GOT to be a prankster trying to stir up crap on the Democratic side. The ONLY people using Sen. Obama's middle name are those who spend their days (and nights?) listening to right-wing radio while scouring the right-wing websites. And, yeah, it doesn't sound like a robo-call, either.

Hillary's campaign manager, Mark Penn, is a union buster.
Mark Penn, is a union buster.
Mark Penn, is a union buster.
Mark Penn, is a union buster.
Mark Penn, is a union buster.
Mark Penn, is a union buster.

So, I guess the Democrats aren't as progressive as they try to make themselves out to be, huh?

Hearing what soon, Greg?

That Obama's name will be used as a smear by the Republican party in the GE?

yes. in fact we've heard that already, at least about the Muslim stuff...

The trash coming out of the Clinton supporters seems straight out of rove's play book. The GOP is hoping they can run a candidate against Hillary. It will not only energize their base, but keep longlong Dems, like me, from voting for the Democratic nominee. I would still vote for a Dem-but it would be a write-in for someone outside the corporatist wing of the Democratic Party.

Greg wrote on January 19, 2008 4:06 PM:
yes. in fact we've heard that already, at least about the Muslim stuff...

So....you're saying that you anticipate hearing that in the GE by Republicans. Seems you're preparing for Obama BEING IN the GE.

But I know how you seem to say what you don't mean.

I think this might be a big issue leading into South Carolina. Who is behind these attacks?

Hard to believe that Clinton's people would do this--even her allies. But what is most dispiriting is that for so many people, that is the first thing that comes to mind.

CT Voter wrote on January 19, 2008 4:14 PM
What difference does Greg's personal opinion about any of this make?

Editorial content.

Ugh. I don't know if I can stomach voting for HRC as our nominee in the fall. Before New Hampshire I was enthusiastic about all three of the main contenders, but I've lost a ton of respect for the Clintons in the past two weeks.

Clintonite Dirty tricks are grabbing all the headlines. The actual results show better news. RURAL Nevada broke for Obama in a massive way. IF there is any indication if who can win in November it is what the Democrats in the Reddest of the Red think. I am from Upstate New York and the trend is the same here. Clintons base is and always will be liberal women. Just like Huckabee's evangelicals it makes for a locked up minimum and may even swing the primaries. Unfortunately, she will loose in a landslide where Obama would assure the Republicans have the worst year since Nixon

THis is not from the Clinton campaign.

Typical comment from bitter Republican full of Clinton hatred....
"Until today I was going to vote for Clinton but I just changed my mind because....."
Yeah, I believe all 50,000 of those comments I've read on all the Political sites.

Obama has to stop playing defense and go on the offense. He needs to be setting the media agenda. All this only makes him look like a weak victim.

He's running against 2 Clintons, not just one. Maybe he needs to declare his potential running mate now--I know, crazy!--but it would make huge news and arm the Obama team with someone who can go head-to-head with Bill Clinton.

I'm most assuredly NOT a Republican, JimS. I've never voted for a GOP presidential nominee and I doubt that I ever will. I voted for Bill Clinton in '92, '96, Al Gore in 2000, and John Kerry in '04. But after all of the lying, lowball tactics I've seen from the Clinton camp in the past two weeks...I'm sick of it. I'm sick of seeing inspiring, positive political figures like Obama, Wes Clark, and Howard Dean cut down by their own party. If you think I'm some GOP concern troll, think again.

Two weeks ago I would not have thought there was any chance a "Hussein" robocall could come from the HRC camp. Now I wouldn't put anything past them.

I bet the Republican operatives are just loving these results. No one they want more in the GE than Senator Clinton...

I don't know about the others, JimS. But me, at least, will vote for a third party if she's the nominee. Race baiting and voter suppression are not things we can allow in the Democratic Party.

Well, unless it's close. Then I'll vote Republican.

Who are worse in every form, of course. But if you can't destroy a cancer in your body on your own, sometimes you need some external entity to do it for you.

We can only hope that the cure doesn't kill the entire body.

SHoeless Joe, Well I doubt it. All you Republicans are interested in getting the weak candidate in so you can eat himn for lunch. You destroyed Dean in '04 by the same media gang up and inflating the importance of the scream, just like you tried to do with Hillary's "tears". Once you've got the weak candidate, (Kerry, Obama), you'll turn on your erstwhile ally and eat him for lunch. Obama will be left the same hollow shell as Kerry. The GOP machine will roll over him and you'll get the GOP pres. you've been planning for.

> It's unclear whether this is a robocall.
> To our ears it sounds more like someone
> reading from a call script.

Well how do you think robocalls are made? A mother and a father robot getting together?

As far as we know Obama's people could have done the recording.

But me, at least, will vote for a third party if she's the nominee.

I feel the same way. I've voted for Democrats my entire life, but I will not vote for Hillary Clinton. I suspect we're not alone. Greg just put up a post about how divided the party is over this nomination.

Carry on with your delusionary rants, JimS. BTW, looks like I'm not the only D getting sick and tired of the Big Dog attacking Obama:

http://www.newsweek.com/id/96385

Getting attacked by a Clintonista for expressing my frustration with HRC's campaign is going to make me feel even LESS inclined to vote for her.

She and Bill need to stop lying, race-baiting, and all of the other polarizing tactics they're using, since evidently they don't have any faith in a "positive" campaign. Obama needs to hit back HARD.

Tom: yep, I read the same post. "Polarizing" is indeed the word that's coming to mind. I'll keep my fingers crossed for an Obama comeback and will send more $$ his way.

BTW, just curious here--how did Obama vote on the "Iranian Revolutionary Guard is a terrorist organization" bill? I know HRC voted for it.

No way Clinton had anything to do with this robo-call, BTW, if for no other reason than that there's no way to ever be absolutely, 100% sure something like this is completely untraceable. Even if she were not completely above this kind of tactic otherwise, and I am realistically pretty certain she is, she'd never take that chance.

A previous poster writes:
"The ONLY people using Sen. Obama's middle name are those who spend their days (and nights?) listening to right-wing radio while scouring the right-wing websites."

Not true, remember when clinton fires those staffers sending that "muslim" email around.

Again another trick out of the rovian playbook. Do something that is so disgusting that it is unbelievable that it could come from a dem. Plausible deniability. Must have been the repugs, right?

Do we really want more of this crap for 4 more years? Judging from NV, apparently so.

Re Hillary gaining momentum...

Dem control in the House and Denate will be much stronger with Obama heading the ticket, as the 40% of people who hate (really, truly HATE) Hillary won't be driven to the polls.

Disappointing.

Or do you think they'll go with the race card again, as they did with NH?
Listen, one last time. Barack Obama did not pull the "race card". And unlike Hillary Clinton, Barack had gone out of his way not to bring in divisive topics like gender and race unnecessarily. I still remember Clinton's "boy's club" comments after that debate in Philadelphia, when she threw her first gender card.

Hillary Clinton made a very clumsy historical analogy when she claimed that LBJ was more important in a historical context than MLK. It was a comment that revealed scores about how she views the voice of the public at large vs their elected representatives. It was also a comment that annoyed and offended a good many African American voters, myself included. At it's core, her comment denigrated the efforts and sacrifices of the people that fought for, organized, were jailed, beaten, spit on, and in some cases, killed in the effort to achieve equal rights in this country. Without Martin Luther King Jr. and his dream, there is no successful movement, and for damn sure, there is no Civil Rights legislation for LBJ to claim to his legacy (along with that little war of his).

And while many blacks found her comparison insulting, Barack Obama made no comment on the analogy. When it became clear how negatively it was playing in the African American communities, Clinton went machiavellian, and using her ability to push talking points in the media continued to play the controversy publicly. This allowed her supporters to claim that the overwealmingly negative response coming out of the black communities were actually coming from Obama's campaign. This wasn't just intellectually dishonest, it was part of Clinton's strategy to make it look as if Obama was playing the politics of race and too effectively poison the results coming out of SC by polarizing the vote along racial lines. In truth, the one playing on race in bold yet subtle ways were Hillary and Bill Clinton.

In effect, Hillary Rodham Clinton has been splitting the Democratic party from within, and is currently trying engage in a 51% solution in the primary. And following this Karl Rove election blueprint, she might just be successful, but I'll be damned if I'm part of that in the general. I suspect that the fallout of Clinton's Rove tactics will be somewhat significant within the party. Jeanne Shaheen poll numbers in the wake of NH and her husband's smears on Obama jump to mind.

Lincoln once said a house divided cannot stand. Clinton and her supporters are sure as hell dividing that house up right now. It'll hurt the Democrats as a party come November regardless of who makes it, but I have the feeling that I'll officially be an independent by then.

Let's think this through--the race issue has hurt Hillary, not Obama. This robocall would hurt Hillary, not Obama. Obama advanced the race issue and it helped him. Obama released this robocall. Hmmm....

I know many of you are upset about her win today but try to stay grounded. Try to keep your self-respect.

This is child's play compared to what the Repubs would do to Barack Hussein Obama should he win the primary.

JimS:

Or maybe you're actually a Republican. Let the paranoia flow.

All I can tell you is if the general election were held tomorrow and HRC was the nominee I'd probably stay home. And I've voted Dem in every presidential election since I turned 18 in 1976. And I don't give a rat's ass whether you believe me or not.

Live in denial all you want - but after the miserable time Dems have had in the last couple of decades it's hard to believe anyone could have such swagger. The dislike for Hillary - AND Bill - is genuine and widespread. A few weeks ago I assumed I'd vote for the nominee no matter who it was. That's changed. She (and He) have pissed a lot of people off in ecent weeks. And if the thought of having them back, with all their lies and sleaziness and Republican tactics, is enough to turn me off there are going to be a lot more like me.

The Democratic Party is like the Palestinians: no matter how legitimate our goal we always manage to screw ourselves out of reaching it.

I doubt if this was from Clinton. But Obama needs to thicken up his skin a bit. For better or worse that is his name. It is a natural advantage for his opponents and one that he has to deal with. Whining over whenever anyone uses his full name will not give people confidence that he can lead the country.

broadbrush: "Hardball Barack- Marquis of Queensbury does not apply."

Then how about the Marquis de Sade?

So everything negative said against Obama is 'dirty tricks', 'dividing the party' and 'rovian'...whereas everything negative tossed at Clinton is a revelation in truth and light. Obama and his supporters are uniters and straight-arrows. Clinton and her supporters rely on nasty, 'old-style' political mudslinging and dissembling. Clinton attacks; Obama only responds. Barrack is a hell of a nice guy and Hillary is a bitch.

Tell the truth. Are there ANY Democrats on here...really?

Richard: "So everything negative said against Obama is 'dirty tricks', 'dividing the party' and 'rovian'...whereas everything negative tossed at Clinton is a revelation in truth and light."

Oh, good -- you got the memo.

Ever think it's a republican making those calls?

Obama once said the suburbs bored him. Easy to say that when you hailed from an apartment in (WAIT FOR IT) wealthy hawaii! Imagine Edwards' grandma somehow flying to Hawaii (who knows, maybe Hilary's Dad bought her a ticket) in the wayback, and asked for a loan from Obama's Grandma, who was (WAIT FOR IT) a LOAN OFFICER with a bank!
Grow up! I'm white and I'm blacker than Obama! I mean, a man of the people! Look at who's donating to him! And watch the indictments roll out of the bush admin right in time for general election.
QUESTION: do we want to back a rock star like mick jagger or do we want to BEAT THE REPUBS COME FALL! GROW UP!

"Let's think this through--the race issue has hurt Hillary, not Obama. This robocall would hurt Hillary, not Obama. Obama advanced the race issue and it helped him."

I guess the race issue really has hurt Hillary, since she has won the last two contests. And it's clearly helped Obama, as he's lost the last two.

Post another comment when you wake up, dude.

It's all over if the people, that's all of us who call ourselves Democrats, let it happen. There is no way I'll vote for the Clintons. If I want a Queen I'll go to England; at least there's more upward mobility there than right here in the USA. Bill's time is up. After 35 yrs trying to become president, if Nevada was the best they can do, they're toast. Lost by 9 pts in Iowa and lost several delegates to boot; tied for delegates in NH w/only a 2 pt "win"; now couldn't pull out even a tie in delegates with a 5 pt "win"! Pathetic.