C'mon how is this worse than Gingrich serving his wife divorce papers while she was in the hospital after a cancer operation so he could be free to marry his 7th grade math teacher? How is it worse than telling her she wasn't pretty enough to be first lady?

How is it worse than Romney shooting a man in Reno just to watch him die?

Ok, I made that last one up, but give him time.

Yes, all that was despicable of Rudy as well.

Some just might overlook his hateful actions toward his former spouses, even the one dying from cancer by rationalizing she had to have done something mean to him.

What is unforgivable is a man who PUBLICALLY terrorizes and emotionally traumatizes  his own friggin flesh and blood. Those were his children for pete's sake. They had to go to school after he did that. They were subject to taunts and ridicule because Rudy was such a supreme a-hole. Those children were defenseless and they had to rely on a mother who had been just as savagely demeaned as them. Absolutely unforgivable.

I bet those kids live in fear that one day their dad will denounce them publically, as well.

Is everyone forgetting Reagan's family? The same people who are supposed to turn on Giuliani loved Reagan. Just a tidbit I remember about Maureen Reagan: Her parents (Ron and Jane Wyman) sent her to boarding school on the East Coast at age 6; her half sister Patti wasn't told that they were sisters until Patti was 7 or 8 (http://edition.cnn.com/TRANSCRIPTS/0406/07/acd.00.html -- about half-way down the page).

The family stuff is probably going to matter even less nowadays but if the news media wants to get into it, they could psychoanalyze the effect of ambitious parents on all of the children. Who raised Chelsea? Didn't the State of Arkansas have someone on the staff with an official title whose real job was taking care of Chelsea? Want to get into that kettle of worms and ask Hillary Clinton who took care of Chelsea and did the Clintons pay that person? It steps on her message of being a woman who had to juggle career and family, too, if the state gave her a nanny.

The one and only thing that could be a no-sale for Giuliani with the "religious right" folks is the abortion issue, IMO. They may well be sincere and reject him because they know he's just pandering to them.

If Hillary Clinton is the nominee, its all moot. We all saw the Clinton soap opera played out in public --- remember that clip of the 3 of them walking across the lawn and Hillary looking prune faced and wearing dark glasses after Bill's grand jury testimony admitting Monica.

With the MSM acting as a public relations firm for Repubs, whoever gets the Repub nomination will get an entirely fresh and updated image.

"If Hillary is the nominee, it's all moot."

Appalling, but true. Count on Rudy's amen chorus in the "liberal media" not to make the distinction that Bill was impeached for covering up an affair, while Rudy was rubbing his wife's and children's noses in one.

"How is this worse than Romney shooting a man in Reno just to watch him die?"

You had me going there for a second.

"C'mon, how is this worse than Gingrich serving his wife divorce papers while she was in the hospital after a cancer operation so he could be free to marry his 7th grade math teacher?"

That is so icky on so many levels.

Some just might overlook his hateful actions toward his former spouses, even the one dying from cancer by rationalizing she had to have done something mean to him.

You're kidding, right?

Jan Knaus

Especially Hilliary whose husband played around in the Oval Office while he worked...

You may be right Karen about the order of wives though I don't think any of them died.

Then of course Gingrich was shacking up with his office mgr in DC while wife No.2 was back GA during Bill Clinton's impeachment. He eventually dumped wife No. 2 and married the office mgr. but not before Larry Flynt threatened to out him and he
resigned from the House.

"Especially Hillary?" "Especially?" What does your "but,but,but Clinton" remark have to do with Rudy? And how does your tortured sentence follow up at all? If you can't make a cogent argument, maybe you should go back and actually read what people said. You might learn something. I know. You don't want to. Guess what? You need to.

Jan Knaus

One correction, Youthful Indiscretion Hyde wasn't speaker, Gingrich was.

But one crucial difference is that the Clintons still managed to raise a wonderful daughter who her father obviously loves very much, whereas he humiliated and apparently abandoned his kids. What I find ironic is this- go over to the focus on the family website and you'll find all sorts of actually quite good advice about pulling a family back togather after this sort of betrayal/crisis. The Clintons managed to actually do this. Shouldn't they actually be praised by the family values crowd?

I believe that's correct. He labeled his affair while married with a married hairdresser in his 40s
as a "youthful indiscretion" when it came to light during the Clinton impeachment.

Giuliani's kids have had lots of advantages because he's their father, too

Name some.

Giuliani, had no money while he was married and those kids recieved nothing when he divorced. So, please name some advantages Giuliani afforded his kids, please.

While I am sorry about your mother and family situation, I'm not really sure what the point of this post is. What, precisely, are we not going to get into during this Presidential election? People's private lives? That's clearly a pipedream- you can bet your last dollar that the Right is going to be rolling around in the Dems' personal lives like hogs in slop- regardless of whether the stories (i.e. Obama in a Madrass) are true or not. Do we sink to their level by making up s*it? No. Do we fight back? Yes. You HAVE to- witness, i.e., The American President.

Moving beyond this pure political characterization though, Giulani has chosen to put his personal indiscretions in the public eye at an unprecedented level. He moved his mistress into his house and made her his official hostess for crying out loud! And while, as I said before, you can and perhaps should overlook what goes on in the private lives of two consenting adults, you can tell a lot about a person by how they treat those weaker then they are- i.e., their children. In this case, none of it's good.

As for Chelsea- I don't know her or anything, but a brief run down of her biography indicates that yeah, she's done pretty well- National Merit, highest honors from Stanford, masters from Oxford, prestigous jobs. Certainly better then the Bush twins.

Not true. Their mother got about $7 million plus child support.

You are really all over the map on this one:

I don't have an opinion about whether people should stay together for the sake of their children because I don't want to run their lives any more than I'd want to stop someone from having an abortion!

"Staying together for the sake of the children" isn't what we're talking about here. The sake of the children wasn't considered. He moved his mistress into the governor's mansion when his wife still lived there with his children! That level of disrespect for their mother is more than most children could ever forgive. They have a reason to try to work it out with Rudy; he is their father and they have a history. The only history his current wife has with the children (rightly or wrongly) is that she is the woman who broke up their home.

Basing one's opinion on how a person treats his family and others is a reasonable test of his character. It is not the same as "running his life." We may all come to different conclusions about what matters, but a legitimate way to evaluate a person's ethics is through his past behavior.

What does THAT have to do with telling someone they should not have an abortion?

Jan Knaus

"Giulani has chosen to put his personal indiscretions in the public eye at an unprecedented level"

O for sure! He announced the divorce at a PRESS conference for pete's sake. The conference was not called for that announcement but he turned it into these most unprecedented revealation EVER at a press conference.

Maybe not, once he provides his rationale. Which is to reduce crime based on the poor and minorities having too many kids which generate the most offenders. In other words, it plays right into their bigotry.